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Welcome to Net54baseball.com. These forums are devoted to both Pre- and Post- war baseball cards and vintage memorabilia, as well as other sports. There is a separate section for Buying, Selling and Trading - the B/S/T area!! If you write anything concerning a person or company your full name needs to be in your post or obtainable from it. . Contact the moderator at leon@net54baseball.com should you have any questions or concerns. When you click on links to eBay on this site and make a purchase, this can result in this site earning a commission. Affiliate programs and affiliations include, but are not limited to, the eBay Partner Network. Enjoy!
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  #1  
Old 04-12-2009, 05:56 PM
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Posted By: JimCrandell

Good luck everyone on the new board. I think its too much for me and my computer. Perhaps when I have the time I will try to figure it all out but it just seems too complicated for me.

Cheers,

Jim(Davalillo)

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  #2  
Old 04-12-2009, 06:13 PM
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Posted By: Joann

Hi Jim,

I would hate to have the board lose you over the change. Right now it is a little tough to figure out because the slow loading times stand in the way of experimentation, but I know that the mods will have it fixed quickly after the holiday weekend.

If you want, I would be happy to talk via phone and walk you through the screens that are needed for basic use of the board. There are a ton of features and buttons, but you don't need nearly all of them to just read and post basic replies. It's sort of like me and MicroSoft Word - it will do 10,000 things but all I know and need to do is write a basic memo.

Happy to help sometime this week if you want.

Joann

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  #3  
Old 04-12-2009, 06:18 PM
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Posted By: David

What a pain...not worth the frustration. The site does'nt send you an email or take your id. Keep this site open until you figure it out.

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  #4  
Old 04-12-2009, 06:32 PM
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Posted By: JimCrandell

Thanks Joann--you are a very nice person and I appreciate it. Its all just too frustrating for me to figure out and I don't know a word of the tech lingo that people throw around.

I will keep your offer in mind when I come back in the future.

Good luck.

Jim



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Old 04-12-2009, 06:52 PM
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Posted By: CoreyRSh.anus

I gave it a shot but too seem to have come up short. I thought I followed every instruction, received a confirmatory email and a link to click on to complete the process. But when I repeatedly tried to open the link it wouldn't open.

I for one was very content with the old forum.

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  #6  
Old 04-12-2009, 06:56 PM
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Posted By: leon

We will get these things fixed and be better than ever. If ya'll need to take a few day break while we get it in order I certainly understand that.

Corey- I have said, in no less than 5 different posts, that the email part of registration is broken. You don't need that to login.....and participate...

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  #7  
Old 04-12-2009, 07:02 PM
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Posted By: Alan

I'll wait until the bugs are worked out. I actually wanted a new forum, but now I'm thinking we should have stayed with this one.

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  #8  
Old 04-12-2009, 07:14 PM
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Posted By: Jamie Boneparth

Jim,

I know I'm relatively new to the forum, but I have really enjoyed your posts. I find them valuable and, especially with the depth and scope of your collection, consider you to be a great member of the community.

Probably everyone is frustrated with the technical difficulties the new forum is currently experiencing. I know I am. But I can assure you that the problem is not you, nor your computer.

One thing I'd like to suggest to Leon is to keep this old forum up for another week or so until things have been smoothed out, so everyone may continue to contribute and not feel alienated by the new forum.

As Joann has offered, I have been told that I'm also pretty good at putting technical jargon in layman's terms and would be happy to help you out via phone if you'd like (this is an offer I'd like to extend to everyone). Surely, it would be best to wait at least a week, however, until the speed of the forum has been expectedly improved.

Kind regards,

Jamie

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  #9  
Old 04-12-2009, 07:28 PM
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Posted By: leon

Don't anyone take this personally but if you think we should have stayed with this site you are being very short sighted. This isn't a personal jab it's just my opinion just like everyone else has theirs. After we get the slowness issue worked out I expect almost 100% approval rating on the new board.

Another thing. No matter how many times I say something some folks either can't read or don't want to believe it. I am not sure which it is. It's like me saying "go left at the light" and the person I am telling asking me which way to go at the light?? It makes no sense...

This board will stay up for several days after all of the bugs are worked out of the new one. Do I need to say that again? ALso, the emails for registration are not working and you won't get one and won't need one. Do I need to say that again too?

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  #10  
Old 04-12-2009, 07:44 PM
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Posted By: JimCrandell

Jamie,

Thats kind of you-thanks. I will keep it in mind.

I don't really like the look or feel of the new forum--

The old one was perfect....at least for me.

Jim

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  #11  
Old 04-12-2009, 07:49 PM
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Posted By: Dan Bretta

Jim, trust me when I say you will get used to the new board. I won't say that you'll like it more than this one because I know you're not much of a bells and whistles type of guy, but you will adjust.

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  #12  
Old 04-12-2009, 08:55 PM
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Posted By: Jason L

but I don't see any of them, as a simple user.
The new board is far too busy on the eyes for me. I'm sure I can get the hang of it once I have the patience.

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  #13  
Old 04-12-2009, 08:57 PM
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Posted By: Randy Trierweiler

Leon, I registered and made a post on the new site, all within 5 minutes tonight.

It looks like you have many of the bugs worked out all ready.

Change is not always easy, but it is neccesary.

You and the tech guys keep up the good work.

Randy

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  #14  
Old 04-13-2009, 03:36 AM
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Posted By: Dave F



Jim-

I'm not sure why the new board would be that complicated. There is still places you hit "post reply", then after you type in your reply you hit the "submit reply" button. That really isn't too complicated. Yes, there is a few other things on the forum that aren't here...but honestly, you don't use those things anyway. You've never really been one for posting scans of your cards on here (at least not that I've seen much, maybe your posting your 1950's stuff...who knows). You've also never been one to be throwing up links or etc that may get more complicated....so I'm finding it hard to understand why the new board is more complicated for you. Of course, if "post reply" and "submit reply" are too difficult...then yes Jim...you're gonna have problems. But, Net54 is outdated. Pretty much any forum for anything on the internet at this point has moved past the technology Net54 has put in place. If you can't even put the minimum effort forth to adapt to something quite simple, you'll soon be done posting on any forums on the net I believe...

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  #15  
Old 04-13-2009, 04:08 AM
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Posted By: dennis

it is easy,and i too, am a dinosaur. jim,alan,corey you will master the new site in no time. we need you guys over there.

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  #16  
Old 04-13-2009, 04:59 AM
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Posted By: JimCrandell

Yes--I probably could take the time to learn and do what I did before. Part of it is not really having the time or the enthusiasm to do it

Part of it is just not liking the feel and look of the board. As Jason says it is incredibly busy looking

Lastly I started posting on Net 54 2-3 years ago or so to try to publicize card alteration and what I felt were the practices of many of the dealers and auction houses. One can debate whether what I did or my methods were effective but I do feel that progress has been made compared with a couple of years ago.

So again good luck--I might be back at some point and maybe not too.

Jim

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  #17  
Old 04-13-2009, 07:13 AM
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Posted By: leon

Good luck in your endeavors. I think a lot of good has come from Net54 with reference to alterations and other bad things in the hobby. I will help you with the new forum if you need it. I think it's going to be better than this one....but I am biased. Take care

Corey- you are a friend and we will get through this small situation. I am here to help also. Plus when we do talk you don't want me holding this over your head do you? happy.gif

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  #18  
Old 04-13-2009, 07:46 AM
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Posted By: T206Collector

I am sure the move makes a ton of sense from an administrative point of view, but from a usage point of view it is like moving away from simple Google searches.

I concur that the new website is way too busy and that is always a bad thing in cyberspace. Keeping the board as close to a black and white, no frills, system should be the goal -- text and baseball card images is all we need.

Our audience is not the cyber-literate. I think this change is almost like asking people to give up their Sunday paper for a Kindle. While some will applaud the new technology, you'll be killing some of the audience.

Put another way -- you lose no contributors keeping this website; you certainly lose some by moving. And I fear the difficulty of use will have an impact on viewership and contribution. Our board is only as strong as its regular contributors.





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Old 04-13-2009, 07:53 AM
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Posted By: JimCrandell

Wow! For once, I actually agree 100 percent with T206 collector happy.gif

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  #20  
Old 04-13-2009, 08:26 AM
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Posted By: T206Collector

...the new website rewards/encourages contribution from more tech-savvy individuals and discourages contribution from less tech-savvy individuals. I suspect that as a population of pre-WWI baseball card collectors, we fall on the less tech-savvy end of the spectrum.

I will say that I think the loss of contribution will be subtle, at least at first.



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  #21  
Old 04-13-2009, 08:40 AM
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Posted By: Matt

It would help if someone could verbalize what exactly are you guys finding too difficult to do on the new forum. Sure there are a ton of bells and whistles, but the process of clicking on the home plate (the same as we had at the top of this forum), clicking the thread you want to read and clicking reply seems straightforward to me. I don't doubt it seems that way because I am a "computer guy" but helping us understand which part of those steps is causing the confusion will help us try and solve it.




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  #22  
Old 04-13-2009, 09:13 AM
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Posted By: dstudeba

Despite being in the computer industry for over 10 years I have no problem understanding where Jim is coming from. For a new user, myself included, the new forum is intimidating. There appears to be much more text and icons and the information one is seeking is tougher to find. (Paul's Google analogy was excellent) As Jim alluded to, if the information is there he and others will somehow overcome the design/layout obstacles and get the information. I liken it too the Net54 site many years ago with the popup problems. The content was so good that you would wade through all the popups and get to the site. If the content on the new site is as good as it was then, I don't think there will be a problem with participation. If the quality of the information does not get to that level, then as Paul said there will be a reduction in quality participation.

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  #23  
Old 04-13-2009, 09:23 AM
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Posted By: Joann

Paul has some very good points. The change may have an unintended side effect of changing the demographic of the board. The less tech savvy may also tend to be the older collectors, and vice versa. So ultimately the change may lower the average age of participants while it raises the average tech-savviness.

I think the community overall is doing a great job trying to help with the transition. Craig W has started some awesome threads over on the new board for name transitions, how-to's, etc. A few of us have offered to help individuals get acclimated. Matt has made several posts on the new board describing settings that result in more familiar user interfaces and better ease of use. I'm sure the mods really appreciate the general board helping this way while they chase the technical issues.

I think the tranistion is going well and that the mods and the rest of the board has a lot to be proud of for being willing to help out. I can't think of many changes-to-environment moves I've made in my life that I didn't dislike at first and then grow to like. I think it will be the same here. We just need to help people get used to it. I thought the transfer of the original navigational icons was genius for this.

Joann

PS. Although I agree with Paul on a lot of things he said ... what's wrong with exchanging the Sunday paper for a Kindle?? hahaha. Kidding. I do have a Kindle 2 though and really like it for traveling and reading books.

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  #24  
Old 04-13-2009, 09:37 AM
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Posted By: T206Collector

...the new forum is broken or doesn't work. I can log on and post with almost the same ease as I am able to here. But in terms of being able to scroll through posts it is not as clean.

The "product" is text and images. On the current board, you could post text and images in one thread on one page and scroll top to bottom, moving cleanly from text to text. Now there are at least two impediments to an easy read:

1: "The Blue Bar," which separates with images, include a big blue bar and an avatar, the readable text. Don't underestimate the value of Network54's scroll, which shades every other text box for ease of reading.

2: "Posts-per-Page", which though can be lengthened in preferences to some degree, cannot encompass the whole. This one is far more serious, because people will not read previous pages before posting. You will have a loss of information and much will be needed to be repeated. That is, most people will click to the last page, read that and reply. Few will comb through page after page within a thread. That was impossible under this forum. In order to post here you had to at least scroll through the entire page.

Again, it is not that I find the forum "difficult to use," per se, it is that it is more cumbersome and distracting towards my goal of getting information quickly. In my view, a change for an improvement in administrative functionality is not worth the loss of contribution and information that is surely going to result.

Am I forecasting gloom and doom on the new site? Well, no. But I do think the new site will be a diluted product.

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Old 04-13-2009, 10:00 AM
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Posted By: Matt

Paul - that's great constructive feedback - I'm sure we'll try and address both of those issues once we resolve the performance issue.




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  #26  
Old 04-13-2009, 10:12 AM
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Posted By: T206Collector

Also, for whatever it's worth, I used to view Net54 via my brand new Blackberry Bold all the time and there is no question that the old site was easier to view and faster loading from a mobile device than the new site. To the extent the future is about mobility of information from wireless handheld devices, my experience with the new site is a loss of efficiency and utility.

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  #27  
Old 04-13-2009, 10:29 AM
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Posted By: Jason L

the ease of reading the Net54 posts has been a major attribute, IMHO.
I love the fact that there is only a simple grid, with a single line, separating differently shaded posts. It is far far faster for me to scan thru, pick out posts where I left off during my last visit, etc...and I find the style of the new board tremendously tiring to find my way down a page and keep myself oriented as to the flow of a thread...now, I haven't spent alot of time at it yet, and I'm sure I can learn it, but the new one appears far too irritatingly busy for my liking at first use...just

to the degree the new forum presentation can be simplified, I will be interested in any of those pre-sets...
thanks

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  #28  
Old 04-13-2009, 10:32 AM
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Posted By: JimCrandell

One more small point is that for those collectors who use the PSA Set Registry, they went to a new system three months or so ago. For me, it has been horrible--_I lose sets;I can't register my cards and it is infinately harder to use.

Now except for aol here is the only other website I look at that wants to make my life more difficult. It is just too frustrating for me.

People retire from their jobs--this will have the same effect--move people out who are not computer savvy and make it more of a young person's board.

One last question--what is an avatar--everybody talks about an avatar but I have no idea what they mean.

Its all good--as Leon said only 20% said not to change so the majority want a "techy" board--but you will leave guys like me behind.

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Old 04-13-2009, 10:34 AM
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Posted By: Dan Bretta

I've never seen so much handwringing over something as simple as an internet forum. You have to get used to it...this site was outdated and the Net54 people don't offer enough support. There will be no trolls on the new site and if there does happen to be a poster you don't care for instead of 300 post threads complaining about that poster you can simply click a button and they're gone. There will be no scrolling from left to right, there will be no images posted that are so large it crashes your computer...there is even an area for you to store your photos in albums for easy retrieval.

You guys weren't afraid of power steering and anti-lock brakes were you? The change is for the better...if you can use ebay, you can use the new Net54, if you can use facebook, you can use the new Net54...heck if you can use THIS site then it's not much of a stretch to use the new site.

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Old 04-13-2009, 10:37 AM
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Posted By: Dan Bretta

Jim, that little photo of Sam Crawford next to my name here is called an Avatar. You don't need to use one so that's one less thing you have to worry about. You see even this site used Avatars and you love this site.

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Old 04-13-2009, 10:44 AM
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Posted By: Jeff Lichtman

"You guys weren't afraid of power steering and anti-lock brakes were you?"

Holy ****, my car has what?????

Jim, seriously, the PSA Set Registry site is a disaster compared to the new Net 54. It's really easy to get around and to do the same stuff that you do on here.

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Old 04-13-2009, 10:57 AM
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Posted By: Steve Murray

that is is sooooo slooooooooooooow to load. Suspect that will work itself out eventually.

Oh, another thing, we need more smilies!!! happy.gif

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  #33  
Old 04-13-2009, 11:16 AM
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Posted By: Anonymous

Much ado about nothing. It took me one minute to register, with Leon's help when the link didn't work, and two minutes to get used to, and I am hardly tech savvy.

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  #34  
Old 04-13-2009, 11:16 AM
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Posted By: JimCrandell

Thanks Dan,

Maybe thats the only thing I don't like about this site are the Avatars. I never had problems reading posts; my computer never crashed and I don't care about storing photos because I don't have any.

No sour grapes--

It is what it is.

Jim

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Old 04-13-2009, 11:23 AM
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Posted By: Joann

Jim et al,

I completely agree with everything you guys are saying. I think that a lot of people are okay with the move - despite the loss of simplicity, the "busy look" to threads and all the other changes - because we are willing to trade those things off for some of the improvements.

On the new site, you can find all the posts one person has made. You can have new posts at the top of the page instead of bottom so you can see them right away. There is a PM system. That's a private messaging system which is sort of like a little mini-email box right on your forum page. You can trade private notes with one other person quickly without having to be going back and forth on your regular email.

I think a lot of people like these things and are willing to sacrifice the simplicity to get them. However, for those that are not interested in these features and weren't affected by some of the issues with this board, I can absolutely see that there is nothing to "trade off". It is simply a loss.

The best comparison I can make is the house I have been in since 2000. It is my second house. My first house was a small little starter house on a city lot. The whole house was full of character - arched doors, nice woodwork, a great little lawn that I could keep up with. It was so cute and just felt like home from the minute I stepped in it.

My new house is "better". It's bigger, in a better neighborhood, is newer, is a better investment, lots better layout, more storage space, double garage, better fireplaces - the list goes on and on. But it has never felt as comfortable as my first little house in the city, and I don't think it ever will. But I still wouldn't trade back. I think the new board/old board will be the same way for a lot of people.

We will have the speed situation resolved in the next few days and then maybe some of the "creature comfort" settings can get tweaked. Then it may look a lot friendlier. At least it will be easier to hop on and start clicking on things to experiment and see what they do.

Again, if there is anything I can do to help, let me know. I am in favor of the new board, but completely understand a sense that it may never quite feel like home the way this one does.

Joann

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Old 04-13-2009, 11:25 AM
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Posted By: Dave F



I don't understand practically begging people to go. Jim, you have quite a bit of card knowledge and a world class collection. But if you don't want to go to the new board, don't go.


I don't know why it has to be any more complicated than that.

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  #37  
Old 04-13-2009, 11:49 AM
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Posted By: Dan Bretta

Well said Dave. If people don't want to go why twist arms? The new forum is not hard to learn or use. I can understand not liking the look of it, but it's not going to suit everyone.

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  #38  
Old 04-13-2009, 11:53 AM
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Posted By: dstudeba

Dave -

The board is only as good as the content providers. I see begging people to come to provide content. If I ran a board I would pay people like Mark Macrae for every post they made. Some people think that the move will reduce the quality of content; others don't, time will tell. It is similar to the banner ads debate. Some felt it would hurt the site others said it didn't matter. Each person has their own opinion on that change and other decisions made.

In the end we will each make our own decisions on the amount of content we will provide. Elliot, Bill, and Leon should be the ones making the decision on the hosting of this site. If the rest of us don't like it enough we can go somewhere else. It has happened before and it will happen again.

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  #39  
Old 04-13-2009, 11:56 AM
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Posted By: Alan

I was able to register & post, so I'm all set. There are some other forums with this same format, so I'm familiar with it. It is extremely slow, but hopefully that will improve.

It will be interesting to see how many Net54 members from this old board we end up losing...

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Old 04-13-2009, 12:02 PM
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Posted By: JimCrandell

Dave,

I won't--just explaining to people why I'm not going. Not to worry. Maybe see you in Alpharetta some time--I will buy you lunch or dinner.

Joann,

Thanks again. You're right--I would never use pm's nor do I care about post counts or whether someone is a junior or senior member --I will let you know if I decide in the future to rejoin.

Jim

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  #41  
Old 04-13-2009, 03:52 PM
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Posted By: joe

The new board is slow and sometimes I just quit because it does not go anywhere. But, I am willing to wait and see, I'm sure all the kinks will be worked out.

Joe

Ty Cobb, Spikes flying!

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  #42  
Old 04-13-2009, 04:05 PM
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Posted By: Dave F

Would suit me just fine Jim. Pick your poison.....



http://www.barnacles.net/index.html

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  #43  
Old 04-13-2009, 04:19 PM
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Posted By: Bruce Babcock

Leon, which way do I turn at the light?

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  #44  
Old 04-13-2009, 05:16 PM
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Posted By: JimCrandell

Dave. Please send me your e-mail and cell phone and I will call you on my next visit down. Not quite sure when that will be though.
jdc122@aol.com

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  #45  
Old 04-13-2009, 06:00 PM
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Posted By: Rob D.

I've never seen so much handwringing over something as simple as an internet forum.

Good point, Dan. It'd be great if everyone was open-minded and free-thinking, wouldn't it?

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  #46  
Old 04-13-2009, 06:39 PM
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Posted By: leon

I have to agree the new board is busier than I wanted it. You know what? There was no choice. It's like buying a car and saying you don't want seat belts. Guess what? You are getting seat belts. I absolutely understand that a few folks might not come over. Well, that is their choice but I do hope everyone does. Once the slowness issue gets worked out then I have no problem sleeping well at night knowing this was the best decision for the masses and for Net54. Change is not easy and the older I get the less I like them. This was for the best though. Whether you see it or not is the question, because it's not even debatable imo. For anyone saying it's difficult to use I have to agree. It's difficult for me right now (slowness aside) and I am the owner/moderator. I also know that like every other thing I have ever done it will get easier with time. Once we know how it all works it will completely blow this old site away. I have absolutely no doubt whatsover about it. best regards and remember....The only thing to fear is fear itself!!

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  #47  
Old 04-13-2009, 06:54 PM
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Posted By: CoreyRSh.anus

Jim,

Hope you come on over. I am not computer literate and understand where you're coming from. And, as Leon will confirm, at present the new forum has kinks that need to be resolved. But they will be, and then it will be an improved forum, which if I can enjoy it I suspect you will too.

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  #48  
Old 04-13-2009, 07:30 PM
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Posted By: Steve Murray

Well...bye.

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  #49  
Old 04-13-2009, 08:04 PM
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Posted By: Josh Adams

See ya!

Go Go White Sox

2005 World Series Champions!

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  #50  
Old 04-13-2009, 08:10 PM
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Posted By: JimCrandell

Thanks Corey.

Will consider in future,

Jim

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