T207 Irving Lewis known backs

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Posted By: RC McKenzie

Was wondering if there is a checklist for known backs of the T207 Irv Lewis? I have a w/ emblem anon3. There are the 2 on ebay, a cycle and the one from davidbvintage (which I think is anon3 but can't see well enough to determine if it is 3 or 25 but looks like 3)Which backs do you guys have? regards.

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Posted By: bcornell

There are 3 possible backs for Irving Lewis, as with 49 other t207's: Anonymous, Broadleaf or Cycle. The one that David has on eBay now, like yours, is a Factory 3 (Louisiana), which is definitely the scarcest of them all. Cycle's are the most popular, Broadleaf's the most common, Anonymous the least popular but the toughest to find.

The "no emblem" is a printing freak, in my opinion.


Bill

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Posted By: RC McKenzie

Bill, Thanks very much for the information on the t207 Lewis, you are a gentleman and a scholar, sir... Best regards

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Posted By: scott brockelman

Now you know we agree on almost everything, but I do not think the Lewis no emblem is a print flaw. Last year when the no emblem card was discussed I went thru all of my auction catalogues to find as many as I could. Found 3 and all had Boston perfectly in postion, if it were a color shift or color omission none of the red would be present.

Also you will see mine has a small print mark in the lower quadrant which looks exactly like the frame corner of the card. I was hoping that all Lewis no emblems would have this same flaw and perhaps show that they were from the same plate, but none of the others had it.



Scott

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Posted By: Dave Hornish

Is it just me or are those two Lewis cards cropped ever-so-slightly differently? It could be the scan but his left elbow seems minutely closer to the right side card border on the rightmost card, even allowing for the registration problem.

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Posted By: Bruce Babcock

I've got a Lewis w/emblem with a Broadleaf back.

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Posted By: Scott Elkins

Red Cross. Technically, the Lewis can be found with a Red Cross back as well, although none are currently confirmed to exist as I know.

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Posted By: jay behrens

If I remember correctly, all known Red Cross cards are of White Sox players. It's possible that only players from that team were issued with Red Cross thus removing Lewis from the list of potential players with that back.

Jay

I love pinatas. You get to beat the crap of something and get rewarded with candy.

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Posted By: Scot Reader

This is an fascinating thread. Bill, Where can I find a list of the 49 T207s that are possible with only Cycle, Broadleaf and Anon (and possibly Red Cross)? Thanks, Scot

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Posted By: MVSNYC

i don't know much about this set, but i always assumed the "no emblem" card was a printing error/freak...that the emblem broke off of the printing plate, so future printings of the card, simply had no emblem...?

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Posted By: Bill Cornell

Scott B - I bow to your theory on the missing emblem. I still think it's weird, but that's otherwise...

The full list of Anon/Broadleaf/Cycle backs is below. A couple of interesting points: 1) There isn't one HOFer in the group. Almost every one was a very marginal player. 2) Cleveland, Chicago AL, Pittsburg, and Boston NL have the largest number of players; these are also the teams that tend to have some of the hardest Recruit backs. Maybe that's just a coincidence.

I think Jay is correct that all known Red Cross backs are White Sox. The ones I know of are Blackburne, Lange (on Mastro now), Weaver, Benz. I bet these are all one-of-a-kind.

Anonymous 3 (LA) is a super hard back to find, but they're usually ratty due to humidity and no one cares much about the scarcity since the set is hard enough already to put together. This applies to Napoleon backs, also. Anon. 25 (VA) is difficult, probably a little more than Cycle, and a lot more than Broadleaf.

There are some very tough Recruit/Nap commons (Ellis, Graham, Block, Stovall, Steele and ~15 others), but I believe that not one of them is as difficult as any of the 50 Anon/Broadleaf/Cycle (with apologies to Tim Newcomb's extensive research).

The Big 3 (Lowdermilk, I.Lewis, W.Miller) should actually be a Big 5 that includes Donlin and Ragan. Donlin is the single toughest card in the set, in my opinion. Actually, Lowdermilk should drop out of that group.

Bill


Boston AL: (none)
Boston NL: Roy Miller, Irv Lewis, Kirke, Bushelman, Houser, Sweeney, Tyler, Donnelly
Brooklyn: Otto Miller, Ragan
Chi AL: Mogridge, Kuhn, Blackburne, Fournier, Benz, Lange, Weaver, Peters, Doc White, Rath
Chi NL: Ward Miller
Cincinnati: Almeida, Phelan
Cleveland: Butcher, Ryan, Adams, Blanding, Birmingham, Gregg
Detroit: Bauman, Works, Moriarty
NY AL: Hoff
NY NL: Hartley, Herzog
Phil. AL: (none)
Phil. NL: Downey, Moore, Rasmussen
Pittsburg: Kelly, Donlin, McCarthy, Hyatt, Owen Wilson
StL NL: Woodburn
StL AL: Kutina, Pelty, Nelson
Washington: Cunningham

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Posted By: Scott Elkins

He is also from Chicago. However, I truly believe this is just a coincidence that all the known Red Cross backs are of Chic. players. More will surface I feel - we just have to be patient.

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Posted By: Bob

Bill- Agree with you on the toughest but I'd have to include Pelty in my final 5. Having put together 2 complete sets, card by card, Pelty was the last card both times.
Hope to see you in Cleveland!
tbob
P.S. A Red Cross Mogridge is rumored to exist, I have been trying to track it down but so far no luck....

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Posted By: Scot Reader

Bill,
Thanks for listing the 49 or 50 cards that are Cycle, BL and Anon only. I noticed that Lowdermilk is not on the list. Pardon my ignorance of the T207 issue, but is this an oversight or is he possible with Recruit and/or Napoleon? Also, is Tim Newcomb's research published anywhere? Thanks,
Scot

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Posted By: barrysloate

Bill- good analysis, and interesting point about the Lowdermilk, because you do see a fair number of them at auction. Maybe it should just slip down to the second tier of toughies.

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Posted By: RC McKenzie

Was interesting that the anon3 Lewis back sold for 25% more than the red cycle back even though the red cycle back appeared in better condition. Thanks for all the info provided guys.