Grading 1951 Topps Red & Blue backs

[rdwyer]

Unfamiliar as to how to grade these cards. Since the cards were issued 2 connected to each other, how do you grade them after they been disconnected? TIA

[ALR-bishop]

Some people collect them in panels and some collect them as singles. You can find graded examples of both on ebay. Another Topps issue that came in 3 card perforated strips was the 67 Punch Out set. Singles can be graded in that set too, but not the 3 card strips, presumably because it would require a huge slab.

Other examples would be the 61 and 62 Topps Stamp inserts that came in two panel perforated form but can be graded as separated singles as well

[jthorst75]

Wow Al are these yours? That set is awesome and I have never seen it before. Also were the panels distributed in the pack on the top right or just in the bagged set? I've seen and owned penny packs before but never knew how the panels were packed or seen them offered before in pack form. Thanks

[rdwyer]

My concern is where the cards were separated. How is that grading done on single cards?

[mrmantlecollector]

Here's one thats been graded by itself. Hope this helps.

[ALR-bishop]

The 51s separate neatly . The 67s have jagged edges but I have seen them cut even and still get high grades. The 61 and 62 Stamps have prominent perforations but still get graded highly.

The 51 large pack above has a full set of 52 red backs in panels, plus a game board. Also has 4 or so 51 Current or Connie Mack All stars. The panels were often packaged with the larger 51 Team Cards or All Star cards, like in the last wrapper below

[aelefson]

Hi-
Please note that the Red Backs and Blue Backs were not connected when issued in the small pack form. That is why panels or singles can be graded. Topps issued them in both ways. This is at least from my experience of opening a couple of packs of the Red Backs.

Alan

[ALR-bishop]

Right, Alan. There is a singleton unopened pack in post 2

[Volod]

Originally Posted by rdwyer

My concern is where the cards were separated. How is that grading done on single cards?

When I was putting together redback and blueback sets back in the 1980's (pre-grading era), I had the impression that the cards were graded then based mostly on whether examples showed discoloration or paper wrinkles, which are common defects with these 64-year-old sets. Which is to say that most graders would not give any thought to what the little stubs left at the separation points looked like to any extent. I have to wonder if, in 1951 at the Topps plant, a crew of guys separated panels with a cutting implement, or just became practiced at neatly ripping the stubs by hand.

[ALR-bishop]

Steve-- the PSA 5 Berra posted above shows the separation nubs, but looks like it may have some other blemishes as well.

Since I do not do graded cards this issue does not mean a lot to me, but in collecting the 67 Punch Outs set it did seem that cards with ragged separations got dinged some by graders. Those cards came in 3 card strips so the top and bottom cards would have one straight edge and one perforated edge. The middle card would have two perforated edges. I have seen cards with 2 straight edges, which had to be cut or trimmed get high grades from PSA. On the other hand, the perforation stubs are much more prominent on the 67s then the 51s. You had to cut or bend the 67s multiple times to separate them

[rdwyer]

Thanks for all the help.

[Volod]

Originally Posted by ALR-bishop

Steve-- the PSA 5 Berra posted above shows the separation nubs, but looks like it may have some other blemishes as well.

Since I do not do graded cards this issue does not mean a lot to me, but in collecting the 67 Punch Outs set it did seem that cards with ragged separations got dinged some by graders. Those cards came in 3 card strips so the top and bottom cards would have one straight edge and one perforated edge. The middle card would have two perforated edges. I have seen cards with 2 straight edges, which had to be cut or trimmed get high grades from PSA. On the other hand, the perforation stubs are much more prominent on the 67s then the 51s. You had to cut or bend the 67s multiple times to separate them

Right, Al - All of mine are unslabbed, as well, so a little fuzziness on the stubs is meaningless. But, i guess the question is about how the stubs would look to someone assigning an official grade: i.e., a "rip" vs a clean cut - if that were perceptible. I have some with stubs that look as if they were cut with a knife edge, so maybe Topps actually used a cutting tool to separate them for the small packs, or perhaps a collector at some point took a pair of scissors to the stubs to clean them up. On the other hand, since many, if not most, of the Redbacks around today probably came from the full-size packs, that is, from panels used to buffer the delicate All-Star and team cards in the packs, they were most likely "ripped" apart by young collectors in 1951.

[toppcat]

When Topps issued the set, I would say the panels of 2 were machine separated for the Baseball Candy nickel packs and possibly the penny's. I suspect the 1952 Doubles reissue contained hand separated cards and machine separated to a degree as some of the pulls from Doubles packs have looked raggedy (nubwise) in my experience. Did I just type nubwise?