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Reload this Page Mantle forgeries - a game everyone feels comfortable playing
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  #1  
Old 02-05-2015, 12:00 PM
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Default Mantle forgeries - a game everyone feels comfortable playing
OVER/UNDER - 66% of Mantle autographs are fake.

Let us play.
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  #2  
Old 02-05-2015, 12:17 PM
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Over
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  #3  
Old 02-05-2015, 12:24 PM
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If you are judging based on items available for sale through online venues, I'd say OVER.
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  #4  
Old 02-05-2015, 12:30 PM
packs packs is offline
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Under.

You have to think he signed at least a hundred thousand authentic autographs throughout his lifetime.
Last edited by packs; 02-05-2015 at 12:31 PM.
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  #5  
Old 02-05-2015, 12:36 PM
pooh528 pooh528 is offline
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I would say under. He just signed so many autographs at shows and signings
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  #6  
Old 02-05-2015, 01:09 PM
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over and going up. authentic mantle autos stopped 20 years ago, fake ones are still being produced.
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  #7  
Old 02-05-2015, 01:11 PM
btcarfagno btcarfagno is offline
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Originally Posted by chaddurbin View Post
over and going up. authentic mantle autos stopped 20 years ago, fake ones are still being produced.
All of this. Tough to think it has actually been 20 years.

Tom C
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  #8  
Old 02-05-2015, 01:12 PM
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Out of the ones available for purchase, I will go with 'over'. Fortunately, it's way 'under' for the 1950's ones.
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  #9  
Old 02-05-2015, 01:15 PM
VAYankee VAYankee is offline
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Default I was just offered these today....
all fake I believe....I wish the odds weren't probably so overwhelmingly against folks, but I wouldn't be surprised if when Mantle died it was 50% and has been trending up ever since.
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  #10  
Old 02-05-2015, 01:46 PM
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I know mine is real because I watched him sign it I'd say under.
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  #11  
Old 02-05-2015, 04:41 PM
Mr. Zipper Mr. Zipper is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chaddurbin View Post
over and going up. authentic mantle autos stopped 20 years ago, fake ones are still being produced.
Absolutely. The bad rate on eBay is high, but then consider the various other auction sites, sports memorabilia sites, gallery style store fronts, and local auctions that feature 100% fakes...

It's not a pretty picture.
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  #12  
Old 02-05-2015, 04:49 PM
thetruthisoutthere thetruthisoutthere is offline
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Originally Posted by VAYankee View Post
all fake I believe....I wish the odds weren't probably so overwhelmingly against folks, but I wouldn't be surprised if when Mantle died it was 50% and has been trending up ever since.
All of them are forgeries.
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  #13  
Old 02-05-2015, 04:55 PM
thetruthisoutthere thetruthisoutthere is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RichardSimon View Post
OVER/UNDER - 66% of Mantle autographs are fake.

Let us play.
With all of those Mantle "Florida" forgeries produced in the last five years, no doubt it is over 66%.
Last edited by thetruthisoutthere; 02-05-2015 at 04:55 PM.
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  #14  
Old 02-05-2015, 05:02 PM
kengoldin kengoldin is offline
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Not a guess
A fact
WELL over
Might be higher than 90%
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  #15  
Old 02-05-2015, 05:04 PM
thetruthisoutthere thetruthisoutthere is offline
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Originally Posted by kengoldin View Post
Not a guess
A fact
WELL over
Might be higher than 90%
I'd have to agree with you, Ken.
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  #16  
Old 02-05-2015, 05:46 PM
Econteachert205 Econteachert205 is offline
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I'll say under based on ones cognitive bias toward noticing the fakes in a more profound way than real ones.
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  #17  
Old 02-05-2015, 05:53 PM
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I would guess over, just because they are still making them.
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  #18  
Old 02-06-2015, 07:16 AM
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Over, because the guys answering "over" in this thread know .
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  #19  
Old 02-06-2015, 07:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by packs View Post
Under.

You have to think he signed at least a hundred thousand authentic autographs throughout his lifetime.

I'll take the over on your estimate of how many he signed.
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  #20  
Old 02-06-2015, 07:51 AM
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Depends on your perspective. There are plenty of authentic Mantles out there, but most are in collections. The ones for sale on eBay, auctions, etc lean disproportionally to forgery. But I think the number of fakes seems higher than reality, as those are the ones we see everyday.
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  #21  
Old 02-06-2015, 08:46 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jimjim View Post
Depends on your perspective. There are plenty of authentic Mantles out there, but most are in collections. The ones for sale on eBay, auctions, etc lean disproportionally to forgery. But I think the number of fakes seems higher than reality, as those are the ones we see everyday.
Matt,
Unfortunately, there are probably just as many fake Mantles in private collections as real ones, perhaps more. Consider the number of Mantles asked about on the board. The majority are fake regardless of whether they were in someone's collection or on ebay.
It's def over 60% fake. Perhaps Ken is right about the 90%
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  #22  
Old 02-06-2015, 02:05 PM
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I'd have to agree with you, Ken.
Me too!
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  #23  
Old 02-06-2015, 07:57 PM
shelly shelly is offline
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I find that most everyone is right. The thing is that we limited this to Mantle.
How about Williams, Dimaggio, Koufax and the list goes on.
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  #24  
Old 02-06-2015, 08:17 PM
thetruthisoutthere thetruthisoutthere is offline
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I find that most everyone is right. The thing is that we limited this to Mantle.
How about Williams, Dimaggio, Koufax and the list goes on.
Absolutely, Shelly.

The "Florida" forgeries also include Joe DiMaggio, Ted Williams, Willie Mays, Sandy Koufax, etc.
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  #25  
Old 02-06-2015, 08:27 PM
VAYankee VAYankee is offline
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Originally Posted by thetruthisoutthere View Post
Absolutely, Shelly.

The "Florida" forgeries also include Joe DiMaggio, Ted Williams, Willie Mays, Sandy Koufax, etc.
Koufax? Really? I haven't seen that many Koufax balls. I thought he's been known to be fairly stingy about signing stuff, although that would only give the forgers more reason to do so I suppose. I bought a Koufax ball from Steiner a few years ago. Paid a lot for it, but I feel comfortable it's not a forgery.
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  #26  
Old 02-07-2015, 02:11 PM
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I have a photo he signed in Arlington at a National but I maintain that Mickey has signed way more since he died than he did when he was alive!
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  #27  
Old 02-07-2015, 03:44 PM
jimjim jimjim is offline
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Originally Posted by VAYankee View Post
Koufax? Really? I haven't seen that many Koufax balls. I thought he's been known to be fairly stingy about signing stuff, although that would only give the forgers more reason to do so I suppose. I bought a Koufax ball from Steiner a few years ago. Paid a lot for it, but I feel comfortable it's not a forgery.
Check out ebay. There are a ton of fake Koufax items. Most of them have GAI COA. Ever since he started signing in-person some at Spring Training, it has opened the doors to forgers to pass sloppy examples thru the TPA. You can be 100% sure it is authentic, if it has an Online Authentics COA on it, as that is the company of Koufax's agent.
Last edited by jimjim; 02-07-2015 at 03:46 PM.
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  #28  
Old 02-07-2015, 09:02 PM
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I agree with way over. Maybe not the 90% level but the year is still young
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  #29  
Old 02-08-2015, 07:52 AM
thetruthisoutthere thetruthisoutthere is offline
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I agree with way over. Maybe not the 90% level but the year is still young
The "Florida" forgeries of Mantle, DiMaggio, Mays, Williams, Koufax, etc. are still being produced.
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  #30  
Old 02-08-2015, 08:24 AM
111gecko 111gecko is offline
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Default Shame on you
Shame on you if you don't buy one with a COA. I am one of the smart ones that protected myself with a cert on my Mantle/Williams/DiMaggio trio auto on a 2011 All-Star program. When will you all learn?
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  #31  
Old 02-08-2015, 08:50 AM
thetruthisoutthere thetruthisoutthere is offline
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Shame on you if you don't buy one with a COA. I am one of the smart ones that protected myself with a cert on my Mantle/Williams/DiMaggio trio auto on a 2011 All-Star program. When will you all learn?
Are you being facetious?

If not, please explain.
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  #32  
Old 02-08-2015, 09:03 AM
111gecko 111gecko is offline
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Default Mantle Forgery
Just a little Sunday morning humor.
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  #33  
Old 02-08-2015, 09:24 AM
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Just a little Sunday morning humor.
Thank God you said this. I really couldn't tell if you were serious.
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  #34  
Old 02-08-2015, 10:02 AM
thetruthisoutthere thetruthisoutthere is offline
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Thank God you said this. I really couldn't tell if you were serious.
Me neither...
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  #35  
Old 02-09-2015, 11:31 PM
VAYankee VAYankee is offline
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Originally Posted by jimjim View Post
Check out ebay. There are a ton of fake Koufax items. Most of them have GAI COA. Ever since he started signing in-person some at Spring Training, it has opened the doors to forgers to pass sloppy examples thru the TPA. You can be 100% sure it is authentic, if it has an Online Authentics COA on it, as that is the company of Koufax's agent.
I believe mine only came with a Steiner cert. Either way, I know it didn't come with an Online Authentics COA. you think Steiner is moving forgeries too?
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  #36  
Old 02-10-2015, 10:44 AM
jimjim jimjim is offline
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Originally Posted by VAYankee View Post
I believe mine only came with a Steiner cert. Either way, I know it didn't come with an Online Authentics COA. you think Steiner is moving forgeries too?
Does it have an online authentics sticker on it? Might have a sticker from Steiner and online but only a Steiner COA card.
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  #37  
Old 02-13-2015, 11:29 PM
VAYankee VAYankee is offline
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Does it have an online authentics sticker on it? Might have a sticker from Steiner and online but only a Steiner COA card.
It only came with Steiner sticker and COA. They said they had a deal with Koufax to sign some stuff. I had assumed, perhaps incorrectly, that the Steiner stuff was legit.
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  #38  
Old 02-14-2015, 05:29 AM
thetruthisoutthere thetruthisoutthere is offline
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I believe mine only came with a Steiner cert. Either way, I know it didn't come with an Online Authentics COA. you think Steiner is moving forgeries too?
Steiner Sports does not "move forgeries."

Many Ebay sellers will pair up their forgeries with Steiner certs to sell their garbage.

Most people who buy autographs don't have a clue about autographs. They have no idea what they are looking at.
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  #39  
Old 02-14-2015, 12:50 PM
Maddog Maddog is offline
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There have been reports of bad items being sold on Ebay with forged Steiner cert cards.
I and some others reached out to Steiner a while back but never got a response.
Some of the items were indeed bad and I doubt VERY much that Steiner would sell it, especially if they have a contract with the player.
Also I remember a number of years ago getting an email from Steiner regarding a signing with Koufax so at one point they did have a contract with him.
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  #40  
Old 02-14-2015, 01:18 PM
thetruthisoutthere thetruthisoutthere is offline
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There have been reports of bad items being sold on Ebay with forged Steiner cert cards.
I and some others reached out to Steiner a while back but never got a response.
Some of the items were indeed bad and I doubt VERY much that Steiner would sell it, especially if they have a contract with the player.
Also I remember a number of years ago getting an email from Steiner regarding a signing with Koufax so at one point they did have a contract with him.
I've reached out to Steiner numerous times over the years and they do not want to get involved.
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  #41  
Old 02-15-2015, 03:16 PM
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Kind of makes you wonder?

Look at how aggressive the apparel industry has been regarding forgeries of their products. Who wouldn't want to know if their brand is being damaged.

Steiner worked hard to build his company so I think he would be very concerned if there were confirmed forgeries of his certs.

The only thing I can think of is that he never saw the emails we sent to him and therefore is not aware of the situation.
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  #42  
Old 02-15-2015, 03:51 PM
thetruthisoutthere thetruthisoutthere is offline
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The only thing I can think of is that he never saw the emails we sent to him and therefore is not aware of the situation.
He (Brandon) knows what is going on.
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  #43  
Old 02-16-2015, 10:12 AM
Maddog Maddog is offline
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I agree Chris.
Brandon is a control freak. That is why I have a problem with his lack of response and can't explain why?
I know a while back when I reached out to him regarding doing an auction for our local Little League I couldn't get him to STOP getting back to me. Now I can't get a single response from ANYONE at Steiner (unless I want to buy something).
If Steiner Certs are indeed being forged, I'm sure the same applies to Tri-Star, Mounted Memories and who knows who else.
It truly baffles me that with all this going on the Feds won't take action?
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