Do EXMT cards ever have creases?

[tbob]

I was just wondering. I bought a group of cards off the internet and was ok with the fact 5 of the 6 described as exmt were vgex to ex because they were tough cards but the vg one was hammered, I'd say P-F. I sent that one back and the guy politely sent another to me that was close to vg. Bolstered by this fact, I ordered 2 more EXMT cards. One has a small wrinkle/crease and the other has multiple creases. Have I suddenly forgotten the grading system? I think vgex cards should not have creases (maybe a lite wrinkle) but certainly not EXMT ones. The seller is an ebay regular vintagefootballcardguy who has an ebay store and a lot of experience. Have I wandered back in to the pre-SGC world where grading is so subjective that you just throw out the grading guides? I am tempted to send at least the one back but it's getting to be a real pain. The cards were $16 each. What's the consensus? Eat them and chalk up another lesson learned or return one/both? Just wondering.....

[Rob D.]

Originally Posted by tbob

I was just wondering. I bought a group of cards off the internet and was ok with the fact 5 of the 6 described as exmt were vgex to ex because they were tough cards but the vg one was hammered, I'd say P-F. I sent that one back and the guy politely sent another to me that was close to vg. Bolstered by this fact, I ordered 2 more EXMT cards. One has a small wrinkle/crease and the other has multiple creases. Have I suddenly forgotten the grading system? I think vgex cards should not have creases (maybe a lite wrinkle) but certainly not EXMT ones. The seller is an ebay regular vintagefootballcardguy who has an ebay store and a lot of experience. Have I wandered back in to the pre-SGC world where grading is so subjective that you just throw out the grading guides? I am tempted to send at least the one back but it's getting to be a real pain. The cards were $16 each. What's the consensus? Eat them and chalk up another lesson learned or return one/both? Just wondering.....

As to what to do with the cards, I have no opinion. But I don't see how an excellent-mint card can have a crease.

[botn]

We need a poll for this one. No question.

[Jim VB]

Originally Posted by Rob D.

As to what to do with the cards, I have no opinion. But I don't see how an excellent-mint card can have a crease.

Did Bruce say it was OK for you to talk?

[Peter_Spaeth]

I would eat them (preferably with some spice to make them more palatable).

[Rob D.]

nm

[HRBAKER]

I would say no, an EX-MT card cannot have a crease, raw or graded.

[Section103]

....they're all pretty much the same

6 Surface: Noticeable print spots. Minor color or focus imperfections. Minor border discoloration and color or focus imperfections. Minor wax stains or extremely subtle ink marks. Relatively solid gloss with minor scratches, but devoid of scuffing. Noticeable metallic print lines.
4 Surface: Heavy print spots. Hairline creases. Moderate color or focus imperfections. Moderate border discoloration. Moderate wax stains. Very light ink mark or tape stain. A good deal of gloss lost from surface. Very minor scuffing or an extremely subtle tear in the form of a touch of broken surface paper.

Hairline creases start at 4. With that said, Im reminded of the fact that lots of sellers on eBay use their own grading standards (same numbers, same abbreviations) which differ greatly from the standards.

[Browncow75]

Depends on if PSA is grading them, as evident by some of the "iffy" grading standards theyve shown of late. Ive seen a PSA 6 1940 PB Joe Jax this weekend at a card show that would barely get a 3 at SGC normally. Hard to say tho.

Brandon

[martyogelvie]

EX cards shouldn't have creases much less EXMT.. jmo.

[Bosox Blair]

I'm not aware of any published grading standards anywhere that allow for creases on an EXMT card.

Frustrating experience, Bob.

Cheers,
Blair

[ethicsprof]

should have no creases.
unfortunately, many folks have their own grading standards which tend to err on the side of being much too high for what they're selling.
Bob, you said that sending them back, etc. is a bit of a pain--i'd say let it go, particularly since you and i are on the dinosaur side of life and love our peace.
best,
barry

[Beatles Guy]

The general rule I use (and most that I've dealt with use) is if there is any crease at all, no matter the size, it automatically knocks it down to VG.

[E93]

About twelve years ago I got a PSA 6 on a card that I was sure was going to get an 8 or 9. Under magnification the corners are sharp and come to a point with no hint of wear or flaking. I was upset and had it reviewed at a show and they said there was an extremely minor wrinkle that accounted for the downgrade. All I could see under 10x loupe at the point indicated was what looked like a natural bump in the paper mulch. A year or two later I re-submitted it raw and got the same response. The PSA guy at the show said ex/mt 6 was the highest grade a card could get with a very slight wrinkle. They were certainly consistent.
JimB

[tbob]

Originally Posted by ethicsprof

should have no creases.
unfortunately, many folks have their own grading standards which tend to err on the side of being much too high for what their selling.
Bob, you said that sending them back, etc. is a bit of a pain--i'd say let it go, particularly since you and i are on the dinosaur side of life and love our peace.
best,
barry

Barry I think, as usual, that you are right. Another lesson learned. I guess in the future if I buy cards without scans I am going to have to specifically ask if the card has any creases and not rely on the fact they are described as EXMT. I have asked guys selling vintage baseball cards described as vg or vgex if the card has any creases or if it is just corner wear, etc., I guess I'll have to expand my questioning in the future.
Thanks for all the responses to my post, I appreciate it.
Bob

[ethicsprof]

glad to be of help, ole buddy.
i do love the cards but peace is mighty enticing!!
best,
barry

[autograf]

No creases on EX much less EXMT. I do note, however, that EYE APPEAL will sometimes cause a seller to give much more esteem to their cards than technical grade. Some VG cards look fantastic and I could see where someone would puff up a grade or two. Still.....no creases on EX or EXMT. I have had in the past a couple of PSA cards that were 5's that had paper loss on the back......does that count? Or different thread?

[Thrill-of-the-Hunt]

i rarely buy raw cards , and if i do i try to pay less for them, for this reason. all these oldtime or longtime dealers definetly know about psa/sgc grading standards and use them to their advantage when it suits them. when they sell ungraded material they revert back to 1974 standards. all in all, if a dealer has a good return policy its worth the risk if the cards are over graded, if the cards are graded appropriately then the buyer got solid cards.

return the cards if you dont want them in your set, keep them if its not that big a deal in the big picture to you.

[36GoudeyMan]

I'm with E93 on this, in my experience... I've had several (ok, many) pre-war cards that were visually at least a solid PSA 7 come back in PSA 6 because of a wrinkle I missed on the front or back. However, these were wrinkles, not creases. I think if there is a wrinkle, but not arising to a crease which breaks the surface, it can get a PSA 6 grade.

[bbcard1]

That's easy! Depends on who is sending them to the grading company

[Anthony S.]

Casey Stengel's later cards had lots of creases.