Hall of Fame Ballot Announced

[bigtrain]

Could be a crowded induction in Cooperstown next July. In addition to the Committee ballot discussed a couple of weeks ago including Cox, LaRussa, Torre, Marvin Miller etc., the BWAA ballot was announced today and includes Maddux, Glavine, Frank Thomas, and Jeff Kent in addition to holdovers from last year Biggio, Piazza, Jack Morris, Bagwell, Raines, Mussina, McGriff, Larry Walker, Schilling, Trammell, Edgar Martinez. A lot of guys worthy of consideration and that does not include the bad boys like Bonds, Clemens, Sosa and McGwire.
So...who gets in?

[midwaylandscaping]

Stacked ballot, unreal. Maddux, obvious. Frank Thomas was an absolute terror for a decade, looks pretty obvious. Glavine I think makes it. Biggio, Piazza, Bagwell, Bonds should also but I know that's not going to happen with the holier than thou sanctimony of many voters. Which is fine, everyone has different opinions. If I were pressed, and had a vote I won't list 10 but I'll list who I think should be in this year:
Maddux
Thomas
Glavine
Biggio
Piazza
5 would be a lot though. Wouldn't be totally shocked if it were only Maddux. And yeah, being serious.

[7nohitter]

Maddux, Glavine, Thomas...

[EvilKing00]

I think the hof should induct the best players of their time. Weather they took speed, coke, stuffed their bats with cork, threw spit balls, used vasoline on a ball, scuffed the ball, sharpened their cleats, or used peds

[bn2cardz]

Originally Posted by EvilKing00

I think the hof should induct the best players of their time. Weather they took speed, coke, stuffed their bats with cork, threw spit balls, used vasoline on a ball, scuffed the ball, sharpened their cleats, or used peds

I was talking to my wife last night about this. I don't like that my entire childhood watching baseball is becoming insignificant in the history of the game because the hall of fame has decided that PEDs are now all of a sudden punishable as if players hadn't been looking for an edge since the beginning of the game. I don't agree with PEDs, but if everyone in the game is doing it then it doesn't give you much of an advantage it just makes sure you aren't playing at a disadvantage.

[lsutigers1973]

Would be a baseball travesty if Maddux and Glavine don't go in together.

[bnorth]

I would like to see Maddux, Clemens, Bonds, Biggio, and McGriff. Make it this year. My guess is Maddux is the only one to get in this year.

I really do not think Glavine is a HOFer despite his numbers. He like all Braves pitchers for several years got that foot off the outside ball called a strike and with out that his numbers would be more average. Remember when the TBS guy got fired for showing the Braves expanded strike zone during the playoffs?

[Lgarza99]

I agree with no Glavine this year. I'd go with Maddux, Thomas, and Biggio this year. When Glavine goes in so should Mussina.

[HRBAKER]

No offense to MM but Tommy was a better pitcher.
That's what makes this fun, there is no right answer.

[UnVme7]

Originally Posted by 7nohitter

Maddux, Glavine, Thomas...

I second that all the way, except Biggio is tempting.

[HRBAKER]

Tom Glavine is the 4th winningest lefthander in MLB history behind Spahn, Carlton and Plank and ahead of Grove. He won 2 Cy Youngs, finished 2nd twice and third twice in an era dominated by Maddux and Randy Johnson. That's an awful lot of generous strike zones for a long time.

Sheesh!

[bnorth]

Originally Posted by HRBAKER

Tom Glavine is the 4th winningest lefthander in MLB history behind Spahn, Carlton and Plank and ahead of Grove. He won 2 Cy Youngs, finished 2nd twice and third twice in an era dominated by Maddux and Randy Johnson. That's an awful lot of generous strike zones for a long time.

Sheesh!

Even with being a lefty myself I have never understood statements like "4th winningest lefthander in MLB history". To me it sounds like us lefties have a disability. He is #21 on the all time wins list and even though I never liked him that is very impressive for a pitcher.

[EvilKing00]

Id give a yes vote if I had one to Maddux, Frank Thomas, Biggio, Piazza, Bonds, Clemens, and McGwire.

all of whom were the top players of their day.

[HRBAKER]

Glavine is every bit as compelling a case for a pitcher as Biggio is for a position player. Where's Biggio's MVPs or his second or third place finishes? His is a case of sustained well-above averageness and stat accumulation. Not saying he is not deserving but saying Glavine is not a HOFer is nuts. Kudos to Biggio for playing three different positions as well.

edit to add: Biggio did have a 4th and 5th place finish in the MVP vote

[BradH]

Originally Posted by bnorth

I really do not think Glavine is a HOFer despite his numbers. He like all Braves pitchers for several years got that foot off the outside ball called a strike and with out that his numbers would be more average. Remember when the TBS guy got fired for showing the Braves expanded strike zone during the playoffs?:eek:

You can debate all you want whether Glavine's 300+ wins and multiple Cy Young Awards mean much (seems foolish to me to argue against him, but to each his own), but this statement about people being fired simply isn't true. And it wasn't during the playoffs. It was in the middle of the season. But no one was fired and it was pretty blown out of proportion.

Anyway, my guess of who we'll see inducted in July (not saying these are my personal choices, but who I think the voters will choose):

Cox
La Russa
Maddux
Glavine
Thomas

Very close (maybe 65+ pct of the vote):
Piazza
Biggio
Morris

Also, guessing Torre and Steinbrenner get close in the December vote, but might have to wait three more years.

[maniac_73]

Kind of ridiculous to say Glavine isn't a shooin. His stats are unbelievable and make him a first ballot slam dunk.


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[mattsey9]

I can't get behind La Russa. There's no doubting his W-L record in Chicago, Oakland & St. Louis but as a large portion of his work was made possible by guys like McGwire & Canseco, who are all but banned from the HOF, I need to hear from the man what he knew and when he knew it.

He'll get in this time or next, but I'm not behind it.

[bnorth]

Originally Posted by BradH

You can debate all you want whether Glavine's 300+ wins and multiple Cy Young Awards mean much (seems foolish to me to argue against him, but to each his own), but this statement about people being fired simply isn't true. And it wasn't during the playoffs. It was in the middle of the season. But no one was fired and it was pretty blown out of proportion.

Anyway, my guess of who we'll see inducted in July (not saying these are my personal choices, but who I think the voters will choose):

Cox
La Russa
Maddux
Glavine
Thomas

Very close (maybe 65+ pct of the vote):
Piazza
Biggio
Morris

Also, guessing Torre and Steinbrenner get close in the December vote, but might have to wait three more years.

I believe the mid season debacle you are referring to involving the Braves expanded strike zone was in 2000. That was about them making the catchers box wider than regulation so the catcher could set up way out side to get the outside ball called a strike call. Nobody was fired for that. The Braves TV and radio crew did get banned from flying with the team after that though.

[almostdone]

My question is about Maddux. He is an obvious shoe in but does anyone think he could get the highest % of all time?

Currently Tom Seaver has that distinction. It was Ty Cobb until Seaver toped him but to date Nolan Ryan and I believe Cal Ripken Jr. have also topped the Cobb % mark. I always have wondered if anyone could top the Seaver number.

My only guess with players we know of it might be Maddux. He dominated for such a long time, was a WS champion, friend to the media and adored by his fans. He never really rocked the boat but went about his business day in and day out. Sounds an awful lot like Seaver so maybe there is a chance.

Any thoughts?

Drew

[autograf]

I don't know how you could put Cox in before Torre. If Cox goes in, Torre has to go in. Torre has 4 WS and 2 more Pennants. Cox 5 Pennants w/ 1 WS. Cox has a few hundred more wins but seems like the WS wins would override that. I like

Cox
La Russa
Maddux
Glavine
Thomas
Torre

And Miller and Steinbrenner could/should get the call too. But, like most, I don't think they'd put 6-8 or even more in there......should be interesting......Glavine & Maddux have to go in together.

[ibuysportsephemera]

To me, Maddux and Thomas are pretty definite. Not sure about the rest for this year.

Jeff

[Runscott]

In order of percentage, but I think only the first four get in this year

• Thomas
• Maddox
• Biggio
• LaRussa
• Cox
• Glavine

[HRBAKER]

I would be shocked if Thomas got a higher % of the vote than Maddux. You think so?

[BradH]

Originally Posted by Runscott

In order of percentage, but I think only the first four get in this year

• Thomas
• Maddox
• Biggio
• LaRussa
• Cox
• Glavine

Scott - You might be right about the first four being the only ones to get in this year, but I don't think this is quite an "apples to apples" comparison. Cox and La Russa are on a different ballot than the players. The will still need 75% of the vote, but it's from a 16-member panel that will be announced on Dec. 9, not the usual group of several hundred writers that will be announced in January.

Jeff - I agree - I don't see any way Thomas gets a higher percentage than Maddux.

Ben - yes, it was either 2000 or 2001, and it was mid-season. The TV crew (not radio) was barred from traveling with the team on the start of a trip the next day. That lasted literally just for one city - Montreal - and then it was smoothed over and they were back on the flights again.

[bnorth]

Originally Posted by BradH

Scott - You might be right about the first four being the only ones to get in this year, but I don't think this is quite an "apples to apples" comparison. Cox and La Russa are on a different ballot than the players. The will still need 75% of the vote, but it's from a 16-member panel that will be announced on Dec. 9, not the usual group of several hundred writers that will be announced in January.

Jeff - I agree - I don't see any way Thomas gets a higher percentage than Maddux.

Ben - yes, it was either 2000 or 2001, and it was mid-season. The TV crew (not radio) was barred from traveling with the team on the start of a trip the next day. That lasted literally just for one city - Montreal - and then it was smoothed over and they were back on the flights again.

In all honesty I only rag on Glavine and Maddux because I am a Braves hater from way back. Every body looks at things different and I believe only the really greats should get in on the first try. Maddux is one of those players but Glavine is not. I would not have a problem with him getting in next year, but no way first ballot. The second saddest day in baseball for me was when Maddux passed Clemens on the all time wins list.

[HRBAKER]

Yeah imagine how many more wins Maddux might have if Roger hadn't experienced such a "miraculous" second wind after getting to Toronto. How fitting that Maddux ended up with more wins IMO.

And I agree by the way that Glavine is no where near the pitcher that Maddux was.

[chaddurbin]

well i just voted on deadspin's hof vote...so that makes me qualified to talk here. i think thomas and maddux go in as 1st timers for sure, glavine will probably sneak in. biggio will be in because he was so close last year. piazza's not getting in with the ped rumor. for the ped era i hope bonds make it (he was griffey b4 ped, and babe ruth ted williams hybrid after), clemens started his decline upon leaving the sox already and without ped i don't think he would've made it.

[HRBAKER]

I'd be shocked if Bonds gets anywhere close to the HOF for several years.

[chaddurbin]

bonds and pete rose will make it around the same time 20 yrs from now...then we'll work on joe jackson. i think i'll be alive to see all 3 inducted.

[Runscott]

Originally Posted by BradH

Scott - You might be right about the first four being the only ones to get in this year, but I don't think this is quite an "apples to apples" comparison. Cox and La Russa are on a different ballot than the players. The will still need 75% of the vote, but it's from a 16-member panel that will be announced on Dec. 9, not the usual group of several hundred writers that will be announced in January.

Doh - you're right.

Jeff - not sure. I think it will be close. Something's making me think that either Glavine or Maddox would do better if they weren't both on the ballot together.

[AMBST95]

I thought it'd be a good time for a bump, given the vote is tomorrow. I think we will see Maddux get inducted but I think the sheer number of quality candidates makes it hard for anyone else to hit the 75% threshold.

[dgo71]

I think it'll be a crowded stage this year. Maddux and Glavine are locks as I see it, Thomas should get in but could be on the wrong end of the writers who don't believe in guys getting in on the 1st ballot, and I think Biggio gets the handful of votes he missed last year. Piazza and Bagwell are deserving but will likely have to wait with this year's stacked ballot, and I don't think Morris will (or should) get to the 75%.

[Paul S]

Voters of the HOF are not obligated to divulge their respective choices. Some divulge and some do not. I was listening to sports radio this morning and they extrapolated results from the divulged sect. The winners are...

[AMBST95]

Stolen off of CU Forum

Updated: Jan.8 - 7:00 ~ 194 Full Ballots ~ (34.1%* of vote ~ based on last year) (*new pct. record!)

99.5 - Maddux
95.4 - Glavine
89.7 - F. Thomas
78.4 - Biggio
———————————
68.6 - Piazza
61.3 - Jack Morris
58.2 - Bagwell
54.1 - Raines
42.3 - Bonds
40.7 - Clemens
36.6 - Schilling
26.3 - Mussina
25.8 - E. Martinez
24.2 - L. Smith
22.7 - Trammell
15.5 - Kent
11.9 - McGriff
10.8 - McGwire
8.2 - L. Walker
7.7 - S. Sosa
6.2 - R. Palmeiro
5.2 - Mattingly

[chaddurbin]

ok so not much debate next year...biggio gets in with pedro and randy (i'd take pedro/randy combo over maddux/glavine)