NonSports Forum

Net54baseball.com
Welcome to Net54baseball.com. These forums are devoted to both Pre- and Post- war baseball cards and vintage memorabilia, as well as other sports. There is a separate section for Buying, Selling and Trading - the B/S/T area!! If you write anything concerning a person or company your full name needs to be in your post or obtainable from it. . Contact the moderator at leon@net54baseball.com should you have any questions or concerns. When you click on links to eBay on this site and make a purchase, this can result in this site earning a commission. Affiliate programs and affiliations include, but are not limited to, the eBay Partner Network. Enjoy!
Net54baseball.com
Net54baseball.com
ebay GSB
T206s on eBay
Babe Ruth Cards on eBay
t206 Ty Cobb on eBay
Ty Cobb Cards on eBay
Lou Gehrig Cards on eBay
Baseball T201-T217 on eBay
Baseball E90-E107 on eBay
T205 Cards on eBay
Baseball Postcards on eBay
Goudey Cards on eBay
Baseball Memorabilia on eBay
Baseball Exhibit Cards on eBay
Baseball Strip Cards on eBay
Baseball Baking Cards on eBay
Sporting News Cards on eBay
Play Ball Cards on eBay
Joe DiMaggio Cards on eBay
Mickey Mantle Cards on eBay
Bowman 1951-1955 on eBay
Football Cards on eBay

Go Back   Net54baseball.com Forums > Net54baseball Main Forum - WWII & Older Baseball Cards > Net54baseball Vintage (WWII & Older) Baseball Cards & New Member Introductions

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 11-19-2011, 04:51 PM
drumback drumback is offline
Mark Peavey
Member
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Wichita, KS
Posts: 908
Default M101-2 Sporting News supplement backs

I am trying to document information regarding the M101-2 Sporting News set, in particular, the various backs that exist. If anyone on the board has knowledge of other back variations, or other verified fronts with ads on the back, please let me know. Here is what I have been able to document so far:

M101-2 Sporting News backs

There are five known back variations for M101-2 Sporting News supplements.

The first back, issued sometime after the 1912 season, has the heading, “FREE! FREE!! FREE!!!” at the top. The publisher is offering 20 free pictures as incentive to subscribe to the Sporting News. Near the bottom, above the publisher’s name, is printed, “Additional pictures will cost five cents each.”

84 different supplements are listed as available on this back. The 16 NOT available include #1 Bresnahan, #3 Mathewson, #4 Cobb, #5 Lajoie, #8 Walsh, #10 Wagner, #35 Cobb/Wagner, #49 Cole, and all of the last eight in the series, #s 93-100. The first seven of these were extremely popular players, and were no doubt snatched up very quickly. The omission of Cole is a mystery, but very likely it was just an error, and he was meant to be included. Cole IS available on back #2.

The fact that #s 93-100 were not available is almost certainly due to the fact that they had not been printed yet. Therefore, this back was printed sometime after #92 Herrmann (issued 12-26-12) and prior to #93 Daubert (issued 10-23-13). Most likely, it was sent out in the mail to entice new subscribers during the 1913 season.

Confirmed fronts with the first back are limited to #87 Griffith and #88 Hauser.

The second back is very similar to the first in that it also has the heading “FREE! FREE!! FREE!!!” at the top. However, there are differences of note. On this back, the words “Additional pictures will cost five cents each” is no longer present. Also, the new subscriber is given the choice of 20 pictures for a one year subscription, or 90 pictures for a two year subscription.

93 different supplements are listed as available on back #2. The seven NOT available are #1 Bresnahan, #3 Mathewson, #4 Cobb, #5 Lajoie, #8 Walsh, #10 Wagner, and #35 Cobb/Wagner. Included for the first time are #s 93-100.

Since the last supplement, #100 Birmingham, is included and was issued on December 11, 1913, this back was most likely mailed to potential subscribers during the 1914 season.

Confirmed fronts with the second back include #55 Wallace and #84 Wood. There are also unconfirmed reports of #65 Schulte, #88 Hauser and a second of Wood.

The third back is quite different from the first two. At the top is the heading “DO YOU WANT seventy-five baseball action pictures free of all charges?” Significantly, the new subscriber no longer gets to choose which ones he wants, almost certainly an indication of an overall dwindling supply. Near the bottom, these 75 are referred to as “a complete set of 75”.
The number of popular subjects no longer available is increased to 16, and now includes #2 Young/Criger, #7 Chance, #9 Rucker, #11 Jennings, #17 The Pirates, #18 The Tigers, #38 Plank, #39 Johnson/Street, and #51 The Athletics.

This back can easily be tied to the year 1914 in that several players are now listed with their Federal League teams. 1915, the second and final year of the Federal League, can be probably be ruled out by the fact that Plank and Bender are still listed as playing for the Athletics - not St. Louis and Baltimore, respectively, where they played in 1915.

Confirmed fronts with the third back include #66 White, #76 Callahan (2), #79 Wheat, #83 Stahl and #84 Wood.

Thus, Hauser and Wood are the only players to be pictured with two different advertising backs.

The fourth back is printed in red and black and features a drastic change in design. No longer is the potential subscriber given a list of supplements available. Instead, he will receive “a set of 75 baseball pictures”, and a set of M101-3 postcards as well, plus a copy of the 1916 Sporting News Record Book. This back includes picture, printed in red, of the supplements featuring Carrigan, Lobert and Zimmerman.

Most likely, this back was mailed late 1915 or early 1916.

The fifth back, though printed in green, not red, is very similar to the fourth. The only notable change in content is that the new subscriber will now receive “a set of 70 baseball pictures”, not 75, as indicated on the fourth back.

Thus, the dwindling supply of supplements confirms this as the last back in the series, mailed to potential readers in 1916.

Finally, this chronology of distribution seems reasonable:

1. Back one distributed during the 1913 season.
2. Back two distributed during the 1914 season.
3. Back three, distributed later in 1914 to note Federal League players
4. Back four, distributed late 1915 and/or early 1916.
5. Back five, distributed during the 1916 season.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg scan0031.jpg (80.5 KB, 1517 views)
File Type: jpg scan0032.jpg (76.3 KB, 745 views)
File Type: jpg scan0042.jpg (78.1 KB, 743 views)

Last edited by drumback; 11-19-2011 at 07:53 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 11-19-2011, 06:33 PM
tiger8mush's Avatar
tiger8mush tiger8mush is offline
Rob G.
Member
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Connecticut
Posts: 2,032
Default

Awesome writeup Mark!

So a couple of remaining questions:

1) Which Supplements are possible with an ad-back? It seems like the ad-backed Supplements were of ones already issued that they must've had extras of. Since none were available of #1 Bresnahan, #3 Mathewson, #4 Cobb, #5 Lajoie, #8 Walsh, #10 Wagner, #35 Cobb/Wagner, and #49 Cole, we can probably assume they wouldn't have ad backs. #2 Young/Criger, #7 Chance, #9 Rucker, #11 Jennings, #17 The Pirates, #18 The Tigers, #38 Plank, #39 Johnson/Street, and #51 The Athletics, as you mention, weren't available by the 3rd ad-back so a guess may be that we may not find those either with ad backs since the supply may have already been low to begin with on those and they went fast. With #55 Wallace (printed 21-Dec-1910) being the earliest known with an ad back, there is probably a good chance that none predating this very much will surface.

2) Distribution method for the advertisements? So perhaps they took some of the Supplements, threw ads on the back, and included them in future issues of The Sporting News? Or put them on newsstands? One thing they all seem to have in common are the two vertical and two horizontal fold lines. Why would they have been folded in such a way? Perhaps they were included in some sporting product like ball gloves or baseballs?

3) Why is #49 Cole not available in the first ad-back release but it is available in the 2nd release?

Thanks again for the interesting writeup!
Rob
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 11-20-2011, 08:12 AM
doug.goodman doug.goodman is offline
Doug Goodman
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: On the road again...
Posts: 4,550
Default

Thank you for the info, and the hard work, very interesting.

I've been working on the set for years (96 down, 4 to go) but have never seen an ad back.

Doug
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 11-21-2011, 08:06 AM
thegashousegang thegashousegang is offline
Jimmy M
member
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 148
Default Nice job

I don't have anything to contribute, but great work so far. I'm about 40% into the set, and no ad-backs yet.

Doug, good luck in completing your set.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 11-23-2011, 05:00 PM
drumback drumback is offline
Mark Peavey
Member
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Wichita, KS
Posts: 908
Default M101-2

It seems reasonable to assume the double sized team supplements will not be found with ad backs, as the ad is the same size as the other 96.

With such a small sampling of ad backs, it's really not possible to draw any clear conclusions. I'm guessing, though, that since there doesn't seem to be any rhyme or reason to the players with ad backs, there are many other different front/back combinations to be found.

It would great to find out how they were distributed. Perhaps they were mailed? I wonder if the Sporting News has an archivist that could provide some answers. Seems like a long shot, but who knows?
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 11-23-2011, 07:57 PM
Runscott's Avatar
Runscott Runscott is offline
Belltown Vintage
Member
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 10,651
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by doug.goodman View Post
Thank you for the info, and the hard work, very interesting.

I've been working on the set for years (96 down, 4 to go) but have never seen an ad back.

Doug
Doug - excuse my ignorance, as I've never collected these, but why are the ad backs so tough to find (I assume, since you haven't seen any), given that they were issued for 1913? Is it because they weren't the normal ones included as supplements, but had to be ordered?

Which ones are you missing?

Just asking all these questions because I have some of these arriving in the mail some day and would like to understand the issue better.
__________________
$co++ Forre$+
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 11-23-2011, 09:10 PM
doug.goodman doug.goodman is offline
Doug Goodman
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: On the road again...
Posts: 4,550
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Runscott View Post
Doug - excuse my ignorance, as I've never collected these, but why are the ad backs so tough to find (I assume, since you haven't seen any), given that they were issued for 1913? Is it because they weren't the normal ones included as supplements, but had to be ordered?

Which ones are you missing?

Just asking all these questions because I have some of these arriving in the mail some day and would like to understand the issue better.
Everything I know about ad backs I learned in this forum, and most of that knowledge came from this thread.

I am missing the Cobb, Pittsburgh team and Detroit team from 1909, and the Cobb / Wagner from 1910.

I think all four of them might be listed on ebay right now in buy-it-nows for just short of the cost of my right arm.

Doug
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 11-23-2011, 09:58 PM
Runscott's Avatar
Runscott Runscott is offline
Belltown Vintage
Member
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 10,651
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by doug.goodman View Post
Everything I know about ad backs I learned in this forum, and most of that knowledge came from this thread.

I am missing the Cobb, Pittsburgh team and Detroit team from 1909, and the Cobb / Wagner from 1910.

I think all four of them might be listed on ebay right now in buy-it-nows for just short of the cost of my right arm.

Doug
Thanks Doug.
__________________
$co++ Forre$+

Last edited by Runscott; 11-23-2011 at 10:03 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 01-01-2012, 12:01 PM
Danny Smith Danny Smith is offline
Danny Smith
Member
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: St. Louis, MO / Washington, DC
Posts: 526
Default

Is there anywhere that lists exactly when each of the supplements in the set was issued? I have a couple blank backs.

Danny
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 01-02-2012, 10:18 AM
doug.goodman doug.goodman is offline
Doug Goodman
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: On the road again...
Posts: 4,550
Default

Each supplement has a date on it, here's the list :

1909-07-22 Roger Bresnahan, St. Louis
1909-07-29 Denton Young / Louis Criger
1909-08-05 Christopher Mathewson
1909-08-12 Tyrus Cobb
1909-08-19 Napoleon Lajoie
1909-08-26 Sherwood MaGee, Philadelphia
1909-09-02 Frank Chance
1909-09-09 Edward Walsh, Chicago (AL)
1909-09-16 Nap Rucker
1909-09-23 Honus Wagner
1909-09-30 Hugh Jennings
1909-10-07 Fred Clarke, Pittsburg
1909-10-14 Byron Bancroft Johnson, Pres. AL
1909-10-21 Charles Comiskey, Owner White Sox
1909-10-28 Edward Collins, Philadelphia
1909-11-04 James McAleer, Washington
1909-11-11 Pittsburgh Team
1909-11-18 Detroit Team
1909-11-25 George Bell, Brooklyn NL
1909-12-02 Tris Speaker, Boston
1909-12-09 Mordecai Brown
1909-12-16 Hal Chase, New York (AL)
1909-12-23 Thomas Leach
1909-12-30 Owen Bush, Detroit
1910-01-06 John Evers
1910-01-13 Harry Krause, Philadelphia
1910-01-20 Chas. B. Adams, Pittsburg
1910-01-27 Addie Joss
1910-02-03 Orval Overall
1910-02-10 Samuel Crawford
1910-02-17 Fred Merkle, New York (NL)
1910-02-24 George Mullin, Detroit
1910-03-03 Edward Konetchy, St. Louis
1910-03-10 George Gibson / Arthur Raymond
1910-03-17 Ty Cobb / Hans Wagner
1910-03-24 Connie Mack
1910-03-31 Evans, O’Loughlin, AL; Klem, Johnstone, NL
1910-04-07 Edward Plank, Philadelphia
1910-09-01 Walter Johnson / Charles Street
1910-09-08 John Kling
1910-09-15 Frank Baker, Athletics
1910-09-22 Charles Dooin
1910-09-29 Wm. F. Carrigan, Boston
1910-10-06 John McLean, Cincinnati
1910-10-13 John Coombs, Philadelphia
1910-10-20 Joe Tinker
1910-10-27 John Taylor, Owner, Boston
1910-11-03 Russell Ford, New York (AL)
1910-11-10 Leonard Cole, Chicago (NL)
1910-11-17 Harry Lord, Chicago White Sox
1910-11-24 Philadelphia American Team
1910-12-01 Chicago National Team
1910-12-08 Charles Bender, Philadelphia
1910-12-15 Arthur Hofman, Chicago (AL)
1910-12-21 Bobby Wallace, St. Louis
1910-12-28 John J McGraw
1911-01-05 Harry Davis, Philadelphia
1911-01-12 James Archer, Chicago (NL)
1911-01-19 Ira Thomas, Philadelphia
1911-01-26 Robert Byrnes, Pittsburg
1911-02-02 Clyde Milan
1911-02-09 John Meyer, New York (NL)
1911-02-16 Roger Bescher, Cincinnati
1911-02-23 John Barry, Philadelphia
1911-03-02 Frank Schulte
1911-03-09 Harris White, Chicago (AL)
1911-03-16 Lawrence Doyle, New York (NL)
1911-03-23 Joe Jackson
1911-10-26 Martin O'Toole / William Kelly
1911-11-02 Vean Gregg
1911-11-09 Richard Marquard
1911-11-16 John McInnis, Athletics
1911-11-23 Grover C Alexander
1911-11-30 Del Gainer
1911-12-07 Fred Snodgrass, New York (NL)
1911-12-14 James Callahan, Chicago (AL)
1911-12-21 Robert Harmon, St. Louis
1911-12-28 George Stovall, Cleveland
1912-01-04 Zack Wheat
1912-01-11 Frank Bodie
1912-10-10 Boston American Team, AL Champions
1912-10-17 New York National Team
1912-10-24 Jake Stahl, Mgr., Boston
1912-10-31 Joe Wood, Boston
1912-11-07 Charles Wagner
1912-11-14 Lew Ritchie
1912-11-21 Clark Giffith
1912-11-28 Arnold Hauser
1912-12-05 Charles Herzog
1912-12-12 Jas. Lavender, Chicago (NL)
1912-12-19 Jeff Tesreau, New York (NL)
1912-12-26 August Herrmann, Owner Cincinnati
1913-10-23 Jake Daubert
1913-10-30 Heinie Zimmerman
1913-11-06 Ray Schalk
1913-11-13 Hans Lobert
1913-11-20 Albert Demaree
1913-11-27 Arthur Fletcher
1913-12-04 Charles Somers
1913-12-11 Joe Birmingham

Last edited by doug.goodman; 01-02-2012 at 10:18 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 01-02-2012, 10:34 AM
Danny Smith Danny Smith is offline
Danny Smith
Member
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: St. Louis, MO / Washington, DC
Posts: 526
Default

Awesome. Thank you!!!!
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 11-25-2017, 03:34 PM
Leon's Avatar
Leon Leon is offline
Leon
peasant/forum owner
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: near Dallas
Posts: 34,196
Default

Very old thread, very new pickup to add to the party....guess it is #5 on the list.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg m101.jpg (81.2 KB, 347 views)
File Type: jpg m101b.jpg (75.9 KB, 1121 views)
__________________
Leon Luckey
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 11-25-2017, 03:55 PM
cardinalcollector's Avatar
cardinalcollector cardinalcollector is offline
Randy Trierweiler
Member
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Columbia, Missouri
Posts: 569
Default

Nice find Leon.
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 11-25-2017, 05:21 PM
doug.goodman doug.goodman is offline
Doug Goodman
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: On the road again...
Posts: 4,550
Default

Good one, Leon
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 11-25-2017, 05:29 PM
johnmh71 johnmh71 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 552
Default

How rare is a set of the five postcards referenced in the ad Leon posted?
__________________
John Hat.cher
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 11-25-2017, 05:45 PM
nolemmings's Avatar
nolemmings nolemmings is offline
Todd Schultz
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Phoenix
Posts: 3,720
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by johnmh71 View Post
How rare is a set of the five postcards referenced in the ad Leon posted?
Moderately. They're m101-3.

http://www.oldcardboard.com/pc/pc757...?cardsetID=963
__________________
If we are to have another contest in the near future of our national existence, I predict that the dividing line will not be Mason and Dixon's but between patriotism and intelligence on the one side, and superstition, ambition and ignorance on the other. - Ulysses S. Grant, military commander, 18th US President.
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 11-29-2017, 09:42 AM
Leon's Avatar
Leon Leon is offline
Leon
peasant/forum owner
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: near Dallas
Posts: 34,196
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by doug.goodman View Post
Good one, Leon
Thanks. It was a BIN on ebay for 82 bucks delivered, from a large dealer who is a member here. Thanks for the card, Steve!!
__________________
Leon Luckey
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 12-05-2017, 06:45 PM
drumback drumback is offline
Mark Peavey
Member
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Wichita, KS
Posts: 908
Default

Wow, very cool! That’s only the second one I’ve seen available in the last several years. Congrats!
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 02-11-2024, 02:38 PM
drumback drumback is offline
Mark Peavey
Member
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Wichita, KS
Posts: 908
Default M101-2 backs

With the current interest in M101-2 high, I thought I might bring this back up. If anyone has any ad backs not listed here, it would be interesting to know what players can be added.
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 02-21-2024, 09:26 AM
pawpawdiv9's Avatar
pawpawdiv9 pawpawdiv9 is offline
Chr!$ M!ll!c@n
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: GA
Posts: 2,707
Default

Tagging onto this....
I saw this today on X (twitter) from
Sacreseller, (AUCTION MONTHLY)who was involved doing the Strip Card Find.
https://twitter.com/Sacreseller/stat...74675953262932
On a recent buying trip, we were connected with a gentleman who apparently had a "handful" of 1909-13 M101-2 Sporting News Supplements. After meeting our customer in person, we were extremely surprised to find 91 out of the 100 cards in the set, including every HOF besides Clark Griffith! Page after page, more names began to appear, like (Shoeless) Joe Jackson, Ty Cobb, Honus Wagner, Grover Alexander RC, etc. The condition overall was also extraordinary compared to other examples sold in the past. Our customer was gifted this entire collection from a family friend nearly 60 years ago, and he managed to keep them well preserved. The following video is a small highlight of some of the key stars we will be sending too
@PSAcard
for grading before we begin the selling process at Auction Monthly!
VIDEO
https://twitter.com/i/status/1760074675953262932
__________________
LOOKING TO BUY:
1916-20 UNC Big Heads
Need List:
Ping Bodie, Sam Rice

Last edited by pawpawdiv9; 02-21-2024 at 09:27 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #21  
Old 02-21-2024, 01:14 PM
doug.goodman doug.goodman is offline
Doug Goodman
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: On the road again...
Posts: 4,550
Default

I completed the m101-2 set, but had never seen any with backs (that I recall) until recently. Very cool.
Reply With Quote
Reply



Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
1909 M101-2 Sporting News Supplement Honus Wagner Assistance/Request Archive Net54baseball Vintage (WWII & Older) Baseball Cards & New Member Introductions 2 09-08-2005 08:44 AM
M101 Sporting news help Archive Net54baseball Vintage (WWII & Older) Baseball Cards & New Member Introductions 25 11-25-2003 08:58 AM
M101 Sporting News Issues - New Twist Archive Net54baseball Vintage (WWII & Older) Baseball Cards & New Member Introductions 39 09-22-2002 08:47 AM
M101 Sporting News info sought Archive Net54baseball Vintage (WWII & Older) Baseball Cards & New Member Introductions 0 11-12-2001 11:41 PM


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 02:37 AM.


ebay GSB