Turning the hobby into a part time job.

[granite75]

A little background : I am a special education assistant teacher. Very rewarding work, but for very little pay.

I love collecting and learning about the hobby. What I want to know is whether, with a modest investment, I can make a little extra cash. I don't have a ton of cards or disposable income, so I want to plan things out carefully.

Any advice either here or on PM is greatly appreciated. I really enjoy what I do for a living, despite the many challenges. I'm trying to find some ways to make it work on the financial side as well. Thanks in advance.

Scott

[MikeGarcia]

...you would need to watch out for yard sales , garage sales , new sellers at a flea market , estate sales , moving-to-Florida sales etc. etc. etc. These are all time-consuming ( but really a lot of fun , which is priceless ).

...That's the cheapest way to accumulate stuff to flip ( or keep )

...For selling , you can reach millions of buyers on E-Bay , every weekend evening...

...so a gas-miser car , a couple newspapers , and a great Canon scanner and you're on your way.

...A very understanding wife goes without saying..

...keep us posted ; it's more fun than profit sometimes but you can usually make enough so that you wind up with a less-expensive collection compared to just buying cards on E-Bay...

...good hunting and good luck..

[Leon]

You can definitely do it. Your money will be made on the buys more than the sells. If you buy right then you will be successful. Do a lot of homework, make calculated risks, and hope for some luck. That about should do it. And all of that being said, it's not easy.

[granite75]

Thanks for all the advice so far. The hardest thing is getting started, knowing I need to get off to a good start and not end up in the red early on.

[steve B]

Originally Posted by Leon

You can definitely do it. Your money will be made on the buys more than the sells. If you buy right then you will be successful. Do a lot of homework, make calculated risks, and hope for some luck. That about should do it. And all of that being said, it's not easy.

What Leon said is among the most important things. You can make money on anything if you can buy it cheaply enough.

The stamp guy I learned from told me that as almost the first thing.

The rest he told me?

You don't have a shop to sell. You have a shop to buy.

Become a good guesser. If you take a couple hours to figure out a collection is worth very little you've already lost money. (Most small stamp collections are worth around $20-30 retail) The same sort of thing goes for cards. Can you look at a 5000 count box and tell right away if they're 1991 or earlier? And roughly what condition they're in? And maybe with a bit of breathing room in the box more closely what years they are? That's the bulk of what you'll see, and recent stuff really needs to be bought in bulk and very cheaply. At say $5 for a 3200 or 500 count box you don't even have to check for stars.
Or---Is that item "junk" or something valuable? I've done pretty well with stuff I bought that just seemed to be too cheap.

Don't get married to your mistakes. You'll have that stuff that just won't work for you. Offload it for whatever seems ok to minimize the loss and as long as you've learned from it you'll be fine in the long run. I bought a big box of junk football from him. He had it marked originally at $250, then 200 then 150 then 135. When I told him my offer wouldn't be close he said don't be shy, I know I paid too much and just want them gone. $50, done deal I figured I'd overpaid but still needed a few for those sets. AT the time I could get decent money for random batches of cards on Ebay, $5 for 400, 3 for 100. That sort of thing. It took more work than I'd have liked, but I got around 150 profit by the time I put the last couple hundred with some other stuff.
That lot worked for me, but didn't for him. Different approach different result.

Some of the more complicated stuff involves inventory and what you keep and what gets turned as quickly as possible. I've seen him flip stuff before he got it back to the shop. (Or before he got it back to the table at a show) But I also bought a stamp a couple years ago that I'd priced in maybe 1985

Most of it depends on you. I don't do as well as I should because I'm too slow on the selling end. And often I'm too cheap to buy the sort of stuff that would move quicker. Don't do that

Steve B

[swarmee]

You don't have to pound the pavement if you don't want to; it's very time consuming to drive around looking for vintage sportscards if you live in a sparsely populated area like me. Let eBay become your yard sale.

When I'm searching for cards on eBay, I think to myself "Self, if I didn't know what I had, how would I list them?" So I would start looking for "baseball card lot" and then browse the thousands of listings that come up. Then tweak as necessary to better find the types of cards I'm looking for. Know what's hot currently (like 1914 Cracker Jacks and T206 John Titus cards ;-) ) and how to spot real cards from fakes.

I bought one of the Fro-Joy baseball uncut sheets with the intent of testing it for age (blacklight test and printing test using loupe) and then if it's from the 1970s reprints rather than the original, I'll send it back to the original seller and get my money back. Take a couple of risks, but not with your money. ;-)

[mintacular]

I think it's become harder and harder to make $ on cards due to the increasing fees on eBay/paypal + shipping....You automatically are hit with 15%+ when needing to flip via eBay so picking up a nice $100 card for $85 means you're only breaking even when resellling on eBay...Also, selling dollar cards on eBay which was once a possibility even harder due to fee structure change....I think really the only way to do it is having a large chunk of investment $ and buying very large collections, and then being extremely patient to get a good price on your cards....

[savedfrommyspokes]

Over the past 15 years I have built my collection, at little to no cost, by buying vintage lots/sets/accumulations on ebay, pulling out the cards I wanted for my collection, and reselling the remaining cards in order to cover my costs. Leon's advice was spot on, any profit is made on the purchasing end of things....it boils down to buying smart which for me includes understanding both what I am buying and what it is worth.

Reselling the cards as singles on ebay at fixed prices has been my most effective mode of selling. For this year, I am on pace to sell about 2.5 times my typical inventory level. The quicker I can rotate my inventory, the lower my pct of ebay/pp fees to sales will be. This year (with a little help from free listings), my total ebay and PP expenses combined are less than 20% of my sales. Two years ago, I had a higher inventory level and my rate of sale was less as I only turned my inventory about 1.5 times that year. My ebay/pp expense % of sales was closer to 25% that year.

Developing an effective system/process for listing cards, storing cards, and shipping them will allow you to do more with less time. Most sellers have their own systems in place based on what works best for them.

If you do not want to waste your time with such a venture, ensure you buy smart, research your sell price to ensure both liquidity and profit, work efficiently, and, most importantly, treat the people who buy from you right.

[campyfan39]

I am finishing up a book about collecting with my late father. I interviewed dozens of successful dealers during the research and to a man they told me they don't collect anymore. It was just too hard to be a seller and a collector.
The temptation to keep stuff or upgrade was too high. I know it would be for me as well.

[Footballdude]

Originally Posted by campyfan39

I am finishing up a book about collecting with my late father. I interviewed dozens of successful dealers during the research and to a man they told me they don't collect anymore. It was just too hard to be a seller and a collector.
The temptation to keep stuff or upgrade was too high. I know it would be for me as well.

I think the general rule is "Don't fall in love with your merchandise".

[autograf]

A good key too is when things are going up, sell. Right now, if you're sitting on 1914 Cracker Jacks, it's a great time to sell. The prices will [likely] come back down. T210's is an example of this to some extent. They were sky high a few years back and have retreated some now. 1952 Mantles are hotter than ever now. Study what you want to sell and what you can buy stuff for and what and where you can sell it. What you can sell on the BST of this board, you can ensure discounting it 10-15% over what your starting price is on ebay since you have ZERO fees thanks to Leon's benevolence....joking....Buying lots is great advice and pulling a few, selling the rest. There are TONS of auction houses-Huggins/Scott, Legendary, Lelands, Hunts, etc that do larger lots where occasionally (not often) lots that contain a lot of oddball stuff or quantities of stuff will go for an amount that gives you opportunity to break them up, be patient, and make 30-40% on your $$ (or more) even with ebay/paypal fees. At the same time, you have to be ready to absorb a loss or two on things. And the don't be a collector AND a dealer is great advice. It's expensive. You will not get rich but with research and time, you can offset what you spend with what you sell and maybe pocket a buck or two in the end.

[buymycards]

You will save a ton of money buying your storage and shipping supplies in bulk. U-Line is a great place for padded bags, small photo mailers, and boxes. Buy a case of 250 or 500 and they will be really inexpensive, even with shipping costs factored in.

Buy your top loads and sleeves and team bags and graded card bags by the case.

If you list your cards ebay, make sure they are well organized. You don't want to spend 20 minutes looking for a card that you sold. If you are organized it will only take 30 seconds even if you have 500 items listed.

Get ready for sticker shock at the beginning of the month when ebay sends you their invoice for the previous month. PayPal also takes their cut.

Remember to save all of your receipts for expenses and your receipts for sales. If you are making a profit you will have to pay taxes, so make yourself a spreadsheet and be meticulous about recording every sale and every expense. If you set up at shows you will need a sales tax number. If you purchase items from out of state you will need to pay a "use" tax. Set aside 25% of your sales to pay your sales tax and income taxes. I know that many card sellers don't report this income, but I like to be able to sleep at night.

In reality, if you sell a $10 card and you paid $5 for the card, by the time you pay ebay, paypal, and taxes, you might make two bucks on the card.

Most of the cards you find will be lower grade and lower end, so you need to be able to buy low so you can sell low and still make a few bucks.

Good luck.

[savedfrommyspokes]

Originally Posted by buymycards

If you purchase items from out of state you will need to pay a "use" tax.

With my buying of inventory, my accountant indicated that based on my state's tax laws that I would not be required to pay a use tax on items purchased from out of state with the intent of reselling. This would be the same as me buying product with the intent of reselling within my state and providing my tax exempt ID # to the seller so that the transaction will be exempt of any state sales tax.

Is it possible that different states have different laws regarding their use taxes for out of state purchases intended for resale?

[granite75]

Thanks for the replies. My interest is in vintage cards T206 - 1979. I just don't understand the newer cards. Do I still need to worry about taxes if I'm in a state with no sales tax? I have done a handful of transactions here and I think they were pretty fair. I'm just worried that I'm going to lose money since I'm so inexperienced. I've been going to yard sales, flea markets and no one really has cards. If they do, they're from the late 80s. I'll just have to keep my ears to the ground and keep up with the online auctions.

One question I have is: Should I try to put sets together or buy a set and break it up?

[savedfrommyspokes]

Originally Posted by granite75

Thanks for the replies. My interest is in vintage cards T206 - 1979. I just don't understand the newer cards. Do I still need to worry about taxes if I'm in a state with no sales tax? I have done a handful of transactions here and I think they were pretty fair. I'm just worried that I'm going to lose money since I'm so inexperienced. I've been going to yard sales, flea markets and no one really has cards. If they do, they're from the late 80s. I'll just have to keep my ears to the ground and keep up with the online auctions.

One question I have is: Should I try to put sets together or buy a set and break it up?

Scott, so I can focus on what I know best, cards, I employ an accountant to advise me on accounting matters and handle tax preparation. This cost of this service is money very well spent, as well as being tax deductible.

In most cases, it is more profitable to buy complete sets and break them up as singles versus building sets. However, I find it much more profitable to buy lots, part sets, and accumulations to sell as singles versus buying complete sets to break up.

[buymycards]

Originally Posted by savedfrommyspokes

With my buying of inventory, my accountant indicated that based on my state's tax laws that I would not be required to pay a use tax on items purchased from out of state with the intent of reselling. This would be the same as me buying product with the intent of reselling within my state and providing my tax exempt ID # to the seller so that the transaction will be exempt of any state sales tax.

Is it possible that different states have different laws regarding their use taxes for out of state purchases intended for resale?

You are correct. The use tax isn't for resale items. Thanks for catching that.

[the 'stache]

See, I wouldn't expect to find too many T206 cards at flea markets or garage sales. The modern stuff would be easier, in my opinion, to make money off of.

I made one mistake. I fell in love with my inventory. I started buying Bowman Chrome prospect autos in 2010. I subscribed to MLB.tv so I could watch the preseason games, and see prospects before they reached the Majors. I also subscribed to milb.com, which allowed me to watch minor league games, or at least a large chunk of them. I started looking at the MLB.com top 100 prospects (Jonathan Mayo), and Baseball America's top 100 prospects. I found a number of other sites online that did scouting reports. I learned the 20 to 80 scouting scale. I learned very quickly to identify which prospects were going to have the greatest potential to be stars. I identified some veterans that I felt had upside potential, and bought their prospect autos, too. I picked up Mike Trout's 2009 Bowman Chrome prospect auto for $99. If I'd had a little more cash to start up, I'd have bought another. I bought Clayton Kershaw's 2006 Bowman Chrome auto because I thought it, too, was undervalued. I got that for about $75. I thought Justin Upton was also undervalued. At the time, all I could get below my price was his Bowman Sterling auto. That I got for $25. Somewhere along the way, though, buying all these cards, trying to acquire at least 1 Chrome prospect auto for each guy in the top 100 became my new goal. I loved watching these guys coming through the system and making it to the pros. I decided not to sell those cards, knowing that I could have sold and made a huge profit. I had people messaging me left and right offering me more money than I paid. I could have walked away from the collection with a 30-40% profit at one point.

I've agonized with the idea of selling those cards, and going completely into vintage and pre-war. But I love the game so much, and even though today's baseball player is about the money, and there are PED scandals, I still love the game.

Meanwhile, that Trout is going for $7-800 raw, $1,000 and up graded by Beckett at a 9.5. The Kershaw is selling for $400 +. The Upton spiked for a time when he started last season on a tear, but the price has dropped back down. But there is definitely money to be made if you can identify who to invest in, and when to sell.

As a rule now, if I start to actually prospect for money, which I am considering doing to increase the money I bring in, I'd follow some specific guidelines. No pitchers. No matter how good a pitcher might be right now, there are just too many Tommy John injuries. Then prospects like Dylan Bundy, and Matt Harvey, and Jose Fernandez. They look great. Their cards shoot up in value, and then boom. They're out a year. Too many red flags potentially. Buy them for your collection once they've made it to the Majors a few years from now. Don't risk trying to make a profit from them.

No speed guys. Guys like Billy Hamilton may eventually show to have more than just the speed metric. Dee Gordon is a guy that comes to mind. But I don't see a lot of profit opportunity in them. No second basemen, also. These guys are good with the glove, and they hit light. You might see an exception here and there, but they are not the best investment. No to most catchers unless they show a tool that is overwhelming. Devin Mesoraco showed incredible power potential, was a top 25 prospect, and he flopped. The hobby cooled on him quickly. I saw some things in him I really liked, including his freakish power. I also read that the guy was putting in a lot of extra time watching film, and taking extra batting practice looking to lower his strikeout rate. He's had a breakthrough season, and I think his 2007 Bowman Chrome autos could have a nice upside if he continues on the path I think he's going down. They're cheap right now, so I bought an extra base and refractor, and I'm holding them. Reds fans are passionate, and if this guy starts going to All Star Games, and winning home run titles, the card could go up again.

That leaves the corner infielders, and the outfielders. And the power bats. That's where the money is. Jose Abreu in Chicago, Harper, Puig, Trout. Those are the guys that could skyrocket in value if you get them early.

Good luck with whatever you choose, Scott!

[granite75]

Thanks to everyone for the replies and messages. Have my first lot of cards coming next week. So far have had a poor showing in the few auctions I have listed, hoping my luck changes as I learn the nuances of this.

[mintacular]

Almost always going to have a better chance buying large lots/sets and breaking them down individually than the other way around (i.e. piecing singles/lots into sets)

[granite75]

I learned that the hard way. Pieced together some old team sets and got nowhere with them. That's the collector in me that I need to separate hobby from business.

[Exhibitman]

You need to decide why you are doing this. If you want to cover your collecting costs with profits from resales then your best plan is to buy bulk lots of things you collect and break them up while keeping the items you want. If that is the case then ignore the stuff you don't collect unless it is ultra cheap. If you just want to retail then go with whatever makes money.

The guys who said you make money on the buy are right. That is the key. At the right price you can resell anything at a profit.

[frankhardy]

Do not list as an auction. Build up inventory, use a Buy It Now, and be patient. For the most part, you will lose money by auctioning cards in my opinion. That didn't use to be the case, but it is now.

Something was also said about collecting along with selling and falling in love with your collection. That is true. However, I am a Cardinals team set collector and the fact that I look for many different types of Cardinals cards has helped me learn so much about the hobby, what is rare, what will sell, and what won't.