Who are the tougher living Baseball HOFers?

[packs]

A player should waste his time signing autographs because they understand those people he's signing for enable them to live the life they are. No one steps onto a baseball field unless there are fans there to pay to see the game. There should be mutual respect between athlete and fan. If that relationship is entirely one sided, someone is being greedy.
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[Bruinsfan94]

And most will sign if you see them in public or at a game, at least the nice guys. Thats very different from going to a card show and sign 100's of items.

[packs]

Obviously. But you said any time you get an autograph from someone that's you trying to make a profit off someone and getting something for free. Your outlook on the athlete and their relationship to fans is skewed. They've made their entire livelihood off people like me. If I'm a bum, so are they. Athletes should sign when they want to sign, not sign when they don't want to sign, but what happens to the autograph after shouldn't factor into anything.

[Bruinsfan94]

Originally Posted by packs

Obviously. But you said any time you get an autograph from someone that's you trying to make a profit off someone and getting something for free. Your outlook on the athlete and their relationship to fans is skewed. They've made their entire livelihood off people like me. If I'm a bum, so are they. Athletes should sign when they want to sign, not sign when they don't want to sign, but what happens to the autograph after shouldn't factor into anything.

I never once said that. I said that if you get something for free then sell it for profit that is taking advantage of someone. What do you want? Athletes to sign items for every fan whos ever bought a ticket or watched a game? If I am an athlete, what makes me more likely and happy to sign, Some kid who has a 2014 topps card and it will become the an awesome memento or some random guy with a $200 bat? Most fans only go to a few games a year, if that or watch on tv. These players should sign when asked, but they have no obligation to sign so that others can make a living off it. Autographs are supposed to connect the fans and the players. Thats why players don't like signing. They see see how much they sell for. The autograph hound/dealer is not the guys they owe anything to.

[packs]

I want an athlete to sign when he is able to at the game. I'd also like for athletes to set reasonable prices for their show appearances so they can attract fans from different spectrums and walks of life. I want athletes to stop caring about what I make or where my money comes from, because they have their own. I don't want to hear one word about my theoretical profits from a person in the top 1 percent.

[Bruinsfan94]

Originally Posted by packs

I want an athlete to sign when he is able to at the game. I'd also like for athletes to set reasonable prices for their show appearances so they can attract fans from different spectrums and walks of life. I want athletes to stop caring about what I make or where my money comes from, because they have their own. I don't want to hear one word about my theoretical profits from a person in the top 1 percent.

Dealers would take advantage of that.But even beside that, these are young guys. Why should they go out of the way to sign 100's of autographs at a card show just so others can profit off it? Thats not their job at all. They sign at games and other places, lots sign through the mail. They don't owe anyone anything. They provide entertainment. We don't own them. I

[packs]

The athlete profits just by being at the card show. They can just be happy with that. Why would they worry about what's in my wallet? How can such minute and inconsequential things matter so much to someone who makes tens of millions of dollars? I think we're different in that I don't think someone should take advantage of their situation to exploit people in order to make money just because they can. When you charge $900 to sign a football, that's what you're doing.

[Bruinsfan94]

Originally Posted by packs

The athlete profits just by being at the card show. They can just be happy with that. Why would they worry about what's in my wallet? Why would they care what happens after a fan leaves the show? How can such minute and inconsequential things matter so much to someone who makes tens of millions of dollars? And why would it matter to them?

I go back to my recycled can analogy. That can is worth 5 cents and I don't need it. But someone else might and I don't feel as though I've lost anything because they're the one returning the can that I bought. And I definitely don't feel taken advantage of.

Really don't think that compares. The player needs to be a able to profit enough to make it worth it. Charging 20$ an autograph for something that will sell for 350$ on Ebay is not worth the athletes time. Your recycling analogy is apples to oranges. It doesn't matter how much money they are worth. I would bet that guys like Trout do card shows mostly for the fans or to give extra money to charity. They charge what the market dictate. Liston to players, most who don't like signing autographs its because they think that the guy is going to turn around and sell them. The players are not going to go to a card show just so guys can have a career in selling autographs on ebay.

[packs]

That's counterintuitive though isn't it? If they charge $20 at the show, why would it sell for $350 later? The reason the business aspect of the hobby exists is because Tom Brady charges $900 to sign.

[Bruinsfan94]

We are pretty much just repeating ourselves. Agree to disagree and lets not hijack this thread further

[bnorth]

I don't collect autographs so here is an unbiased opinion. I have been to a few 100 games and love it when a player comes over and signs for kids. What I hate seeing is that POS adult that is trying to get that player to sign more than 1 item that then turns around and brags about how much $ they just made when they just cost some kid the opportunity to get a players autograph. Right or wrong it is my honest opinion.

[egri]

Originally Posted by Bruinsfan94

Bobby Doerr is the best. I honeslty think that (even though the old joke is about Bob Feller) that Doerr has increased the value of some of his unsigned cards by signing so much.

I don't know about raising the value, but it does seem to me that it is harder to find his low grade cards unsigned than signed. Case in point: a cursory search of current eBay listings for "1949 Bowman Bobby Doerr" yields 3 unsigned low grade cards and 6 signed ones. I noticed the same thing with his 1938 Goudey; I think there was one unsigned low grade and at least a couple signed.

[sycks22]

I realize it's a golfer, but I sent a baseball for Arnie Palmer to sign and got back a letter saying "It upset Mr. Palmer when he saw his autograph baseballs were being sold on auction sites for a profit, thus he will no longer sign them." He sent me an auto 8x10 by the way. I guarantee a ton of the "good guys" who sign for free or cheap through the mail will eventually get sick when they see they're making money for people while they get nothing.

[hawaiian bam bam]

thank you all for your thoughts and input, i appreciate it. any other thoughts?

[obxhouses4rent]

My brother and I used to get autographs on cards at the hotels and ballpark in Philly in the late 70s to 83. At one point we had over 10,000 autographs. We never asked any player or former player to sign a duplicate card. Ever. We felt that even then, it would be obvious what we would do with the dupes. The former players (from the 40's to mid 70's) loved being paid for their signatures as the new guys then were making a lot more than they ever made. But most of them all signed for free and were very nice about it. We have soooo many memories. But these guys owe us nothing. The do NOT have to sign. We always felt if you approached them with respect, called them only Mr. Whomever and acted polite, they would almost always sign for you. There were always some that were hard or impossible. In 1978 or 79 the two hardest on the Phil's were Ron Reed and Steve Carlton. After a while, we stopped asking. They wouldn't sign even if we got to the vet early and we were the ONLY two people there when they went inside to get ready. Nada.
So, we asked Jim Kaat, who was such a great guy, who we have given him some cards from his early career he didn't have, was willing to do us a favor. He got the entire folder we made up of Carlton and reed entire career in cards all signed. He brought it out to us after a game. We freaked. It was like hitting the lottery! Not sure if I would like getting autos today. It's probably wayyyyy different now. It was fun back then.

[homerunhitter]

Any updates to this thread?

[Wrightfan85]

Originally Posted by homerunhitter

Any updates to this thread?

Piazza is high on top of the list for sure. He splits time between the US and Italy now. He does 1 signing per year tops now it seems.

I do not want to publicly reveal how much I paid for my Mike HOF plaque lol. Did not expect it to go as high as it did.

[mrmopar]

Sometimes it's both the joy and sorrow of getting specific items signed. If you have to have that certain rookie card, a framed multiplayer print or a HOF plaque signed to name a few of many possibilities, then you need to be prepared to hunt one down or get it signed yourself.

Using Piazza as an example, I won't claim to know the market on his autograph too well, but his first pack issued autograph that I am aware of (96 SPX Commemorative) can usually be found for $100 or less. I have seen at least a pair or more newer pack issued autographs sell for maybe half that.

[Wrightfan85]

Originally Posted by mrmopar

Sometimes it's both the joy and sorrow of getting specific items signed. If you have to have that certain rookie card, a framed multiplayer print or a HOF plaque signed to name a few of many possibilities, then you need to be prepared to hunt one down or get it signed yourself.

Using Piazza as an example, I won't claim to know the market on his autograph too well, but his first pack issued autograph that I am aware of (96 SPX Commemorative) can usually be found for $100 or less. I have seen at least a pair or more newer pack issued autographs sell for maybe half that.

Totally agree. The item really makes a difference.

[sreader3]

FWIW, here is a non-exhaustive list of living HOF guys who haven’t signed much (if at all) through the mail in the last five years:

Aaron
Alomar
Aparicio
Bagwell
Biggio
Brett
Brock
Carew
Eckersley (very spotty)
Gibson
Glavine
Griffey Jr.
Guerrero
Henderson
Hoffman
Jackson
Jeter
Johnson
Jones
Koufax
Larkin
Maddux
E. Martinez
P. Martinez
Mazeroski (only signs for Pittsburgh locals)
Mays
Morgan
Morris
Murray
Perez
Piazza
Raines
Ripken
Rivera
Schmidt
Seaver
Simmons
O. Smith
Smoltz
Sutter
Thomas
Thome
Trammell
Winfield (very spotty)
Yaztrzemski
Yount

Many other guys will sign TTM (or through their websites) for set fees.

[dgo71]

Tough is a relative term. I always think of "tough" meaning the player isn't a fan of signing autographs (i.e., Mays, Griffey Jr.). But it could also mean the accessibility to that player is extremely limited or non-existent, even if they aren't necessarily bad signers (Piazza, Jeter). Mays and Tom Seaver both have medical issues that basically make them impossible to get now, although neither player can be considered rare by any stretch. Tough could also mean that the price for the player to sign is so astronomical that it would dissuade most casual fans from obtaining the signature at a signing (Koufax, Aaron).

I don't really consider any living HOFer "tough" per se, considering even the grumpiest signers are readily available on the secondary market. A guy like Mays who has not been able (or willing) to sign in recent years might be considered truly tough on a later issue card, for example, a 2019 Allen & Ginter, so the specific item could carry a premium as was previously discussed.

In terms of guys I've encountered who are just plain not friendly, my list would be, in no particular order:

Ken Griffey Jr. (though it seems he may be mellowing a bit in recent years)
Willie Mays
George Brett
Rickey Henderson
Eddie Murray
Ted Simmons
Reggie Jackson
Randy Johnson

[Scott Garner]

Originally Posted by dgo71

Tough is a relative term. I always think of "tough" meaning the player isn't a fan of signing autographs (i.e., Mays, Griffey Jr.). But it could also mean the accessibility to that player is extremely limited or non-existent, even if they aren't necessarily bad signers (Piazza, Jeter). Mays and Tom Seaver both have medical issues that basically make them impossible to get now, although neither player can be considered rare by any stretch. Tough could also mean that the price for the player to sign is so astronomical that it would dissuade most casual fans from obtaining the signature at a signing (Koufax, Aaron).

I don't really consider any living HOFer "tough" per se, considering even the grumpiest signers are readily available on the secondary market. A guy like Mays who has not been able (or willing) to sign in recent years might be considered truly tough on a later issue card, for example, a 2019 Allen & Ginter, so the specific item could carry a premium as was previously discussed.

In terms of guys I've encountered who are just plain not friendly, my list would be, in no particular order:

Ken Griffey Jr. (though it seems he may be mellowing a bit in recent years)
Willie Mays
George Brett
Rickey Henderson
Eddie Murray
Ted Simmons
Reggie Jackson
Randy Johnson

Hi Derek,
Although admittedly it has been a while since I chased any of these guys for an autograph, I recall:

Eddie Murray & Rickey Henderson never signing for me in public, but both were somewhat cordial. Eddie would always thank me for asking even when he didn't sign. But, Murray singled me out and gave me his wristband after a game in Anaheim on Fathers Day when he played for the Angels at the end of his career. I think that was his way of paying me back for the effort of trying to get his sig several times during that season.

In person, I recall that Steady Eddie had a spirited, fun conversation with me about Nolan Ryan being a "Wolf in sheep's clothing" when he spotted a copy of Nolan's autobiography "Miracle Man" at a paid signing after Murray got his 3,000th hit.

While Randy Johnson was terrible to chase for an autograph during his playing era, I found him to be surprisingly thoughtful and engaging at a MAB paid signing in NJ about 8 years ago.

Although Reggie has been given the label of a terrible signer, I was successful at getting his sig several times while he was a member of the Angels in the 1980's and I also got him at the airport in Dallas in the 1990's. The key with him, as I recall it was to approach him with the right attitude. Although he can be cranky, I have seen him also be very approachable at times, FWIW.

[tazdmb]

Not-signing through the mail does not equal tough. Many of the guys you listed will gladly sign for free if you meet them in person. Trammel is a constant around Detroit baseball and I have never read a story of him turning someone down. I was at a (paid) dinner in St. Louis shortly after Ted Simmon's election and he was signing for everyone-granted, he wasn't the friendliest. Other's, like Biggio and Bagwell, are regular on the show circuits. Even Jeter has become become more friendly IP since taking over the Marlins.

IMHO, the only ones that are currently "tough" to add onto a piece now are Koufax, Aaron, Mays and Seaver.

Everyone else may be expensive and/or rude, but not tough.

[scooter729]

I was an in-person autograph chaser in Boston in the 1980s - I had luck on multiple times with Rickey Henderson, Reggie, and Randy Johnson outside of Fenway. Never got Brett (though I don't remember any bad encounters), and never got Frank Robinson (was a grouch on a few occasions, even when I was the only person there).

My uncle was good friends with Fred Lynn at the time when Lynn was with the Orioles. Lynn got me a team signed ball in 1985 - I was so excited looking at it and seeing Ripken and so many others, even coach Frank Robinson! As I was scanning the ball, Lynn said to me, "sorry, Eddie Murray wasn't signing today." I didn't really think much about it at the time (I was 12), but in retrospect it blew my mind to realize Murray wouldn't sign the ball for a teammate!

[mr2686]

Originally Posted by tazdmb

Not-signing through the mail does not equal tough. Many of the guys you listed will gladly sign for free if you meet them in person. Trammel is a constant around Detroit baseball and I have never read a story of him turning someone down. I was at a (paid) dinner in St. Louis shortly after Ted Simmon's election and he was signing for everyone-granted, he wasn't the friendliest. Other's, like Biggio and Bagwell, are regular on the show circuits. Even Jeter has become become more friendly IP since taking over the Marlins.

IMHO, the only ones that are currently "tough" to add onto a piece now are Koufax, Aaron, Mays and Seaver.

Everyone else may be expensive and/or rude, but not tough.

I believe Seaver no longer signs due to Dementia. Whitey Ford no longer can sign due to the same illness.

[dgo71]

Originally Posted by Scott Garner

Hi Derek,
Although admittedly it has been a while since I chased any of these guys for an autograph, I recall:

Eddie Murray & Rickey Henderson never signing for me in public, but both were somewhat cordial. Eddie would always thank me for asking even when he didn't sign. But, Murray singled me out and gave me his wristband after a game in Anaheim on Fathers Day when he played for the Angels at the end of his career. I think that was his way of paying me back for the effort of trying to get his sig several times during that season.

In person, I recall that Steady Eddie had a spirited, fun conversation with me about Nolan Ryan being a "Wolf in sheep's clothing" when he spotted a copy of Nolan's autobiography "Miracle Man" at a paid signing after Murray got his 3,000th hit.

While Randy Johnson was terrible to chase for an autograph during his playing era, I found him to be surprisingly thoughtful and engaging at a MAB paid signing in NJ about 8 years ago.

Although Reggie has been given the label of a terrible signer, I was successful at getting his sig several times while he was a member of the Angels in the 1980's and I also got him at the airport in Dallas in the 1990's. The key with him, as I recall it was to approach him with the right attitude. Although he can be cranky, I have seen him also be very approachable at times, FWIW.

I actually had decent luck with Eddie in the days of Memorial Stadium in the late 80s, but he had gotten much tougher after his retirement. As a coach with Cleveland and Baltimore I witnessed him deny every time he was asked, and even made a racist remark to one collector. I haven't seen him since he stopped coaching so maybe an in person encounter would be different these days. That said, he does a fair amount of signings/shows so he's gettable these days for those who don't mind paying the fee.

To your point, Reggie was not terribly difficult to get an autograph from, if you were willing to listen to him complain and drop more F-Bombs than a Richard Pryor stand-up set. As young teens, my buddy and I used to laugh after the fact at the tirades Reggie would go on while signing autographs. We always felt like he'd be happier if he just walked right by us, but maybe he enjoyed the chance to call us all "motherf*****."

My favorite Rickey Henderson story was a non-success in terms of autographs but man did he engage the crowd. It was a spring training game in St. Lucie when he was with the Mets. Rickey came out into the crowd that had gathered along the fence adjacent from the baseline and just started mingling with everybody. He told people he wouldn't sign anything, but was happy to chat and take pictures. He sat out there for 2 or 3 innings interacting with the fans. The thing I remember most, because it cracked me up, was a guy up in the bleachers yelling out "Hey Rickey!" Rickey replied with "Hey!" and the guy says "You're going into the HOF!" Without missing a beat Rickey responded "I know!"

[packs]

Halladay is probably the top of the new class of HOFers. I was lucky enough to snag him at Blue Jays spring training years ago. I remember when he stopped he signed for me, my dad and one or two other guys from the driver seat of his car. After he drove away the security guard said he'd never seen him sign even one autograph before.

[dgo71]

Originally Posted by packs

Halladay is probably the top of the new class of HOFers. I was lucky enough to snag him at Blue Jays spring training years ago. I remember when he stopped he signed for me, my dad and one or two other guys from the driver seat of his car. After he drove away the security guard said he'd never seen him sign even one autograph before.

The security guard must have been new. I never saw him refuse to sign during his Blue Jays days. I saw him maybe 15-20 times and got him every time, most of the time on multiples. Roy was a fantastic signer.

[packs]

Originally Posted by dgo71

The security guard must have been new. I never saw him refuse to sign during his Blue Jays days. I saw him maybe 15-20 times and got him every time, most of the time on multiples. Roy was a fantastic signer.

Could be. That was my only stop in Dunedin. Snagged Frank Thomas that day too.

[dgo71]

Originally Posted by packs

Could be. That was my only stop in Dunedin. Snagged Frank Thomas that day too.

I'd say that was a pretty good day!

[PowderedH2O]

In 1987 during Spring Training, I was at a Royals game and everyone was chasing Bo Jackson for an autograph. Surprisingly, I was able to speak with George Brett and he posed for a photo for me and signed one of his new 1987 Topps cards. I just got it slabbed a few months ago. The next day I was in Miami and literally sat in a seat behind Eddie Murray at an Orioles game. He chatted with me and laughed and made jokes, but absolutely, positively would not sign an autograph for me or anyone.

I can recall getting many of these guys in Spring Training like Pedro Martinez, Andre Dawson, Gary Carter, Tim Raines, Willie Stargell, Dale Murphy (not a HOF, but he was a huge star at the time). Murray was one of the few to refuse. My dad was at a Florida State League game and came home with a Vero Beach Dodgers team set. He got one card signed - Mike Piazza. He told me that this guy was the best minor leaguer he'd ever seen and I should hang onto the autographed card. I did.