1947 Bond Bread Cards - Rounded Corner Question

[rascalsally]

I think I've read everything posted on these cards in a VERY old thread (thank you Ted Z.)
I've acquired a set of these and have had the HOF's SGC graded. I've noticed they have been called beveled and rounded and in other research the use of die cut in descriptions etc.
Is it possible that these cards were made square originally and when initially inserting into the bread bags it was discovered they ripped the bags? Thus creating the need to round out the corners? It would explain why some are carefully rounded (good workers pride in details) and others more beveled (easier route) and some cut quite awkwardly (angrily?) Also, that a few may have made it into a "cutters" pocket prior to cutting; explaining the few found that are square yet have the white backs and glossiness?
I have found these cards very interesting indeed due to all the conflicting information and grading as original previously by graders before the realization their were 2 or more "sets".
Any thoughts?

[tedzan]

Hello Sally

Fresh out of the Bond Bread packages, the corners of these cards were always Rounded.

Obviously, the cards were printed in square form, then the corners were rounded using die-cut machinery.


There are two versions of the Square cards......

1st......A 2nd printing of the original 48 cards of the Bond Bread issue were available in stores in 1949 - 1950.
These Square cards were sold over-the-counter in packages of 12 cards each.

2nd......Date unknown, 24 of these cards were re-printed (circa 1980, a warehouse find of these cards occurred).
These re-printed cards were produced with inferior cardboard stock and are clearly distinguishable from the above
two original issues by their "cream-colored" backs.



TED Z
.

[Exhibitman]

and to add to the fun the artwork was reused for various other issues such as the postcard sized 'exhibit' issue, the dual-sided perforated issue, and a variety of picture packs of varying sizes.

[rascalsally]

Ahhh thank you (again) Ted...then the die cuts may have different depending on the machine used, explaining the difference in the rounding, some being a neater round than others?

[rascalsally]

Adam, Yes! making it extremely difficult to weed through auctions new and old to decipher pricing. Basically I ended up taking a crap shoot approach to pricing my collection.

[EYECOLLECTVINTAGE]

I just got in a bond bread Jackie and Kiner. They feel so so flimsy. Are they supposed to be? Does anyone know if these are the 2nd print or the original?

Thanks

[tedzan]

Judging from your scans, and from your "flimsy" feel of them, these two cards are from the 1980 "warehouse find" and are re-prints.

TED Z

[EYECOLLECTVINTAGE]

Originally Posted by tedzan

Judging from your scans, and from your "flimsy" feel of them, these two cards are from the 1980 "warehouse find" and are re-prints.

TED Z

Thanks so much for the help.

[tedzan]

For those of you that are new to this debate regarding these cards, check-out this thread that was posted 7 years ago on this forum......

http://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=92743


TED Z
.

[almostdone]

Originally Posted by tedzan

For those of you that are new to this debate regarding these cards, check-out this thread that was posted 7 years ago on this forum......

http://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=92743


TED Z
.

I want to echo this link. Packed full of great info on this set. It helped me tremendously last year finding a Stan Musial for my Musial collection. Thanks to Ted Z and others for the great info helping all of us newbies out.
Drew

[EYECOLLECTVINTAGE]

Originally Posted by tedzan

For those of you that are new to this debate regarding these cards, check-out this thread that was posted 7 years ago on this forum......

http://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=92743


TED Z
.

Wow what a fantastic thread. Amazing work

[rascalsally]

Originally Posted by tedzan

For those of you that are new to this debate regarding these cards, check-out this thread that was posted 7 years ago on this forum......

http://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=92743


TED Z
.

I second that Drew, there really is very little other information on these cards anywhere else. I've spent hours coming back and forth to this old thread over the last 2 months or so. Starting the first day we found a deck of these among my Dads memorabilia that has sat in a box since he passed in the early 80's.
At first I figured, Oh sure they're probably the "wrong" ones. But in using Teds info I realized we did indeed have something. Then to be sure I scanned a few to SGC and then started the grading process with them.
This site and especially Ted's old thread was my only real resource in identifying them. It's why I thanked Ted at the start of this new thread =]

[Harford20]

Exhibitman,
If you are still keeping a running list of the dual-sided, perforated, I found a new one that I sent in for TPG grading:
Lou Boudreau front/Ingrid Bergman back.

Still looking for new ones to surface.

Dave

[tedzan]

Dave
Here's a Johnny Mize / Victor Mature card....and, another Lou Boudreau / Ingrid Bergman card.


1947 Bond Bread

1949-50 Sports Star Subjects




Sally, et al

The Square cornered Larry Jansen card in the above scan is from the aforementioned 1949-1950 B/W cards issued under the name....Sports Star Subjects.



TED Z
.

[rascalsally]

Thank you Ted, I really did "get" all that info from your 7 years ago archived post. You were very easy to understand and seem to be the most knowledgeable on the subject. I was unable to find anyone else that had the info you did. I suppose it helped you collected them fresh from the bags It makes me think and picture, my Dad possibly doing the same thing in '47. I know his Dad (my Granddad) was a HUGE Yankee fan and they would take trips into NY (from CT) to watch them play when my dad was a boy.
My granddad was blind by the time I was born and I remember sitting on his porch in the 60's listening to the games on his old brown Bakelite radio while he smoked his pipe and yelled at the radio.
Based on the info you "taught" me through that old thread I was able to differentiate that I did indeed have the 1947 Bond Bread Set.
No square corners here.
I had only asked you why (while any ORIGINAL bond bread cards I've seen including my set) the edges are slightly different. I had wondered if they might have been hand cut but you said die cut. Which in looking at it from outside the box makes sense that each die plate may have been slightly different making the corners slightly different depending on the die cutter.
Thank you again for all this knowledge you are willing to share. I've got a few other cards I may be inquiring about soon =)

[Exhibitman]

I had PSA slab my Jackie/Cagney. Definitely a favorite card of mine:



so far the Jackie's I've seen on the perforated issue are bottom left corner cards from the sheet.

And I got a large sized Williams:



If you want to really go nuts you can chase picture pack items that use the same art

[tedzan]

Here are two photos (with their corresponding 1947 BB cards) from the NY Yankees team photo pack (25 photos).

I would love to find out what printing firm produced these Team photos, because I think it would also reveal the resource of these B/W cards.





TED Z
.

[EYECOLLECTVINTAGE]

Ok so being the jackie fan that I am, I obviously have a lot of interest in this card that just popped up on ebay..

http://www.ebay.com/itm/1947-Orig-Ho...sAAOSwr7ZW3kEu


Now the thing is I can not find this card anywhere on google searches and VCP has the last one being sold for 1550 in 2014 and 750 before that in 2012. Is this card really that much? seems steep but im not sure. any thoughts? Does anyone have a good grasp on the value of this card or seen it go at auction in any other grade?

[EYECOLLECTVINTAGE]

Bump Please. I'd love to add this to my collection. Thanks everyone.

[Exhibitman]

You are probably finding results from the Homogenized Bond cards of Robinson with the printed backs. Totally different series.

[EYECOLLECTVINTAGE]

Originally Posted by Exhibitman

You are probably finding results from the Homogenized Bond cards of Robinson with the printed backs. Totally different series.

This is what I see. weird

[Harford20]

The card in your photo post looks like the square corner Robinson.

As far as the ebay listing, I have been buying/selling these SGC graded Bond Bread cards for several years. The Williams, Robinson, Musial and even the Reese sell very well. For a low-grade Williams or Robinson I expect $100-150 range. For a high-grade, Williams and Robinson may reach a lot higher. I saw a Williams SGC 9 sell for $1000 last summer. From your numbers a few posts ago, both could be realistic prices even for this card (although more likely 9+ range cards). As Exhibitman noted, the Bond Bread Robinson series is more popular and much more valuable, but these small Bonds in high-grade can costly.

Dave

[EYECOLLECTVINTAGE]

Originally Posted by Harford20

The card in your photo post looks like the square corner Robinson.

As far as the ebay listing, I have been buying/selling these SGC graded Bond Bread cards for several years. The Williams, Robinson, Musial and even the Reese sell very well. For a low-grade Williams or Robinson I expect $100-150 range. For a high-grade, Williams and Robinson may reach a lot higher. I saw a Williams SGC 9 sell for $1000 last summer. From your numbers a few posts ago, both could be realistic prices even for this card (although more likely 9+ range cards). As Exhibitman noted, the Bond Bread Robinson series is more popular and much more valuable, but these small Bonds in high-grade can costly.

Dave

UGH! That's what I'm afraid of. Don't wanna break the bank!!!! Thanks for the help.

[kevinlenane]

I have the orig Bond Bread Ted that i am about to get re-graded after I thought it looked low in the SGC holder (it had a number grade below 5 i believe) i bought it in. Notice the "beveled" rounded corners which SGC had no problem with:





However i wanted to ask/mention that the square cards aren't necessarily from the warehouse find. PSA calls that large Teddy an "exhibit" however ive heard of the large square one also referred to as "Premiums" by a dealer at the National who claimed they were sendaway prizes for bond bread customer. Im not sure what the exchange was supposed to be but does anyone know anything about this?

Incidentally for some reason PSA doesnt grade the originals they only grade the "exhibits" though im not sure they even do that any more as the population report looks rather stale.

[Exhibitman]

Oh they're not exhibits. That is just the shorthand way of describing them by size. There is no definitive proof of how they were issued or who issued them. They could have been part of a completely different promotion since the artwork itself was licensed to at least a few different companies.

[toppcat]

This is from memory so bear with me. Like with some of the photographic E and W cards, a pool of pictures would be offered to whoever wanted to issue a card set. I would guess that the pictures were licensed for a period of one year at a time in most cases. Printers (lithographers really) probably varied as there is a wide range of quality among issues. There were quite a few lithographic firms extant into the mid 50's, especially on the East Coast so those are your likely printers in many cases.