1939 Ted Williams Play Ball PSA 8 rookie Heritage auctions

[pokerplyr80]

Originally Posted by 1952boyntoncollector

good luck with that as a real sale..so many 6s and 7s in POP

I wouldn't be surprised if it is a real sale. Centering on this card is very hard to find. The 7 on pwcc went for 25k and the one at Heritage is at almost 22k. The 8 I mentioned earlier is over 130k. Crazy stuff going on right now.

[Peter_Spaeth]

.

[MW1]

There are indeed some very real, deep-pocketed buyers in the marketplace right now.

[Peter_Spaeth]

The existence of "real" buyers is not inconsistent with an effort to push market prices. PS There have always been deep-pocketed buyers in the marketplace.

[MW1]

....that are spending money.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by MW1

....that are spending money.

Agreed. But again, that is not inconsistent with an effort to establish higher prices, if in fact that is happening which I have reason to believe.

[MW1]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

Agreed. But again, that is not inconsistent with an effort to establish higher prices, if in fact that is happening which I have reason to believe.

So there's a group of deep-pocketed buyers who are spending large sums of money on key rookie cards, pushing prices higher, in order to establish higher prices? That's circular reasoning.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by MW1

So there's a group of deep-pocketed buyers who are spending large sums of money on key rookie cards, pushing prices higher, in order to establish higher prices? That's circular reasoning.

It's not circular at all. Higher prices greatly increase the worth of an existing portfolio of cards.

And if I had to guess, I would guess some of these sales involve people buying back their own cards, so they are only paying the fees.

[MW1]

Ok Peter.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by MW1

Ok Peter.

Michael there is nobody I respect more in the hobby than you and I mean that seriously. I would defer to you virtually 100 percent of the time. I am pretty confident in this assessment though as I am basing it on direct reliable information not speculation. If I'm wrong, so be it, it won't be the last time.

But even without the direct information, it defies reason that the breathtaking rise in certain prices is just the result of some new buyers. We are talking prices that double in a month, quadruple in a year in some cases. And we are not talking about rare cards, we are talking about cards that are almost commodities. Anyhow, off my soapbox.

[Leon]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

Michael there is nobody I respect more in the hobby than you and I mean that seriously. I would defer to you virtually 100 percent of the time. I am pretty confident in this assessment though as I am basing it on direct reliable information not speculation. If I'm wrong, so be it, it won't be the last time.

But even without the direct information, it defies reason that the breathtaking rise in certain prices is just the result of some new buyers. We are talking prices that double in a month, quadruple in a year in some cases. And we are not talking about rare cards, we are talking about cards that are almost commodities. Anyhow, off my soapbox.

There is no doubt a little bit of everything goes on....investing, collecting, hoarding you name it. I think a lot, if not most of it, is speculation and investing. Many of the high grade cards being bought are being bought solely for their flips.
Its obvious when you see high grade cards (flips) that sell for crazy amounts, which don't come close to lesser graded ones that look better, but still sell for much more due to the number on the paper. Where did aesthetics go in collecting cards? As for the '39 Playball of Williams...I think he tags onto some of the rookie HOF hysteria.

[Snapolit1]

Honestly doesn't seem that complicated to me. Stock market has had a very nice run for 8 years, which is a very long bull market, and it totally on fumes about to plotz. High end real estate in the big cities has gone parabolic because of foreign money and priced out even a lot of well heeled speculators. Hedge fundies and others have scooped up tons of depressed Florida, Las Vegas, etc. real estate and gotten all the juice out of that lemon. The places to make a quick buck are drying up in front of our eyes. (Forget about interest in banks. We may be paying them soon to hold our money.)

Then one day you settle down in front of your computer and read a Marketwatch.com article about some dude flipping a Mantle card and making 100K is how many months. Or one of the recently discovered troves. And the light bulb goes off. "Holy sht. . . . I can make real money in rare baseball cards. . . . how much fun will that be."

Maybe baseball cards are the new gold. No matter how crappy the economy gets there will only be so many 52 Mantle cards and another Billy Crystal around the corner who wants one.

[Snapolit1]

My experience the last few major auctions, including HA last night, was depressing to say the least. If there are bargains out there beats me.

A Koufax 55 Topps rookie card is a $75,000 card PSA 8.5 but a stunning PSA 9 the following year is a $5,000 card? Utterly bizarre logic to me. As other have mentioned, there cards are not that rare population wise. Not sure how these stay parabolic.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by Snapolit1

My experience the last few major auctions, including HA last night, was depressing to say the least. If there are bargains out there beats me.

A Koufax 55 Topps rookie card is a $75,000 card PSA 8.5 but a stunning PSA 9 the following year is a $5,000 card? Utterly bizarre logic to me. As other have mentioned, there cards are not that rare population wise. Not sure how these stay parabolic.

If you stay away from or already own the high powered rookies, and don't need perfect centering on your star cards, I think there are still lots of very good cards to be had at prices that aren't that much different than they have been over recent years. And as has been mentioned elsewhere some great E cards even of the elite HOFers are way down.

[SportsCardsStars]

Originally Posted by Snapolit1

Honestly doesn't seem that complicated to me. Stock market has had a very nice run for 8 years, which is a very long bull market, and it totally on fumes about to plotz. High end real estate in the big cities has gone parabolic because of foreign money and priced out even a lot of well heeled speculators. Hedge fundies and others have scooped up tons of depressed Florida, Las Vegas, etc. real estate and gotten all the juice out of that lemon. The places to make a quick buck are drying up in front of our eyes. (Forget about interest in banks. We may be paying them soon to hold our money.)

Then one day you settle down in front of your computer and read a Marketwatch.com article about some dude flipping a Mantle card and making 100K is how many months. Or one of the recently discovered troves. And the light bulb goes off. "Holy sht. . . . I can make real money in rare baseball cards. . . . how much fun will that be."

Maybe baseball cards are the new gold. No matter how crappy the economy gets there will only be so many 52 Mantle cards and another Billy Crystal around the corner who wants one.

Hey you basically read my story lol!

I came into the hobby with after hearing about the 1952 Mantle ROI.

I was a collector as a kid and very passionate about sports cards.

That passion was sparked again after doing a ton of research.

Honestly, collecting cards make me happier than anything else
I do in my life.. besides my family.

I live in Miami and I had a good run at the real estate but
that bubble is about to blow up.

Stocks will be up and down especially with the election happening...

Also real estate, stocks and many other forms of investing
really stress me out.

I came into the hobby around a year ago...

Have I made the best investments with ALL of my cards? NO

Early on I was excited and I bought over priced cards because
to me that amount of money didn't seem like a lot...

Once I started to learn and connected with more collectors
in the hobby I soon was able to narrow in on how I wanted
my collection to be.

I like to collect vintage RC HOF at the highest grade possible.

Now that is my goal...

and so yes I have to compete with whatever shilling is going
on as I am a legit investor/collector.

It use to be easy for me to win cards at auction as I would
just outbid everyone.

But now I am losing auctions left and right because
the prices are going so high.

I do see some concern here.

I did get the Topps 53 mantle last night on HA
and the Wilt SGC Mint 9.. Both I thought were very
nice cards and worth what I spent.

At first I was just going to hold on to all my cards
for years and years.

But now seeing what is happening with a massive spike
in the value of some key cards.

I can't help but look now to flip some or at least that be an option
since now maybe the collecting bubble might burst sooner than later..

and if it does who knows how long if I don't flip some
I will have to wait before the market recovers.

Again I'm new to the hobby but this is my 2 cents.

I just wanted to post because I wanted everyone to know
there are true legit investors like myself in the hobby as suggested.

That came in for the exact reason mentioned above.

Which in my opinion is the natural way a market should grow.

With that big money also comes big ego and so that means
most likely some shilling is happening which is sad.

So like any commodities market this will be one wild wave!

best of luck to you all!

[Jdoggs]

Congrats on the wilt and 53 mantle!
Ted Williams play ball PSA 8 rookie sold for about $29k in heritage auctions!

[SportsCardsStars]

That Wilt should cross over to PSA 9 I bet... One
of the nicer Wilts Ive seen.. And the Mantle centering
was good enough for me to pull the trigger! Thanks!

[MetsBaseball1973]

Congrats on the 1953 Topps Mantle last night. Serious card.

Centered nice copies of that Mantle rarely surface.

[SportsCardsStars]

Originally Posted by MetsBaseball1973

Congrats on the 1953 Topps Mantle last night. Serious card.

Centered nice copies of that Mantle rarely surface.

I agree! Thank you