How Many Vintage collectors Sprinkle in Some Pujols?

[ScottFandango]

Just curious...

i love my old Beat up cards, but i also Love the Shiny PUJOLS ROOKIES also....

Being that Pujols is garnering talk of being the BEST right handed Hitter EVER, i thought it was appropriate to ask if he is being added by members of this forum....

[glynparson]

Though Im not a fool I would buy several different issues to immediately sell , if offered to me at the right price. Plus, I know you hate hearing this, but my honest opinion is he's a juicer. Yes I'm allowed to have that opinion even though I know you completley disagree with me and that's ok.

[sgbernard]

True story: I've bought two new card packs in the last ten years. One was an Upper Deck 2001 pack, and I pulled a Pujols RC. I have it in a top-loader, and I'll be keeping it. It doesn't live with my vintage cards, it lives with its relatives from the late 1980s

[Griffins]

I"m with Glyn. Once Pettite and Clemens got caught I realized everyone is suspect, with Pujols at the top of the list.

[pgellis]

I also agree with others about Pujols and the juice. I am a huge Red Sox fan and have been saying for a long time that Big Papi had to be on the juice. I feel the same about Pujols.

That being said, I would not invest a penny into any modern rookie cards, no matter who it is. Before all the steroid info came out (when I was much younger), I had some Sammy Sosa RCs, Jose Canseco RCs, Mark McGwire autographs, etc., etc. Wouldn't be able to get rid of those for a penny nowadays.

There's just too much uncertainty with any ballplayers that excel way above the average ballplayer.

[teetwoohsix]

I'm glad to see I'm not the only one who thinks Pujols is juicing.

Clayton

[Rob D.]

Simply put, you never know who's juicing:

[alanu]

LaRussa would never let a juicer play on his team!!

[canjond]

Jeter's the last clean star from the early 2000s.

[quinnsryche]

I really hope he's not and he really is that good. Me and my son will stick with Paul Konerko as our fave. WAY too slow to be on the junk!

[sox1903wschamp]

Hi Scott,

There is no "sprinkling" of modern cards for me. Back in 1987 I had diligently collected all of the sets from each year up to that point and then I had to choose because it was just too confusing and crazy to me. I said to myself, I am either in or out collecting current issues. I chose Out and have never looked back. Not to demean modern issues, it was just a personal choice.

[iggyman]

I doubled and tripled checked, but did not see one "T206 Pujols" in my set. Sorry, never heard of him.

Lovely Day...

[HexsHeroes]

.


. . . having started my vintage efforts in the mid/late 1980's, but I'm pretty sure the last post WWII card I purchased was in 1994. A tad before Albert.

[Section103]

Since Im not a pure vintage collector - Im a HOF collector - it makes sense for me to put aside a few cards of Albert and other notable "locks" for the day that will come.

On that note, it's a bit bizarre collecting cards of current Hall of Famers that arent vintage and never even had a vintage card (eg Kirby Puckett). Like it or not, one day the hobby will have to change its nomenclature and/or dividing lines.

[teetwoohsix]

Just wanted to say,I have a bit of a warped sense of humor,but is anyone else laughing at the title of this thread?

[docpatlv]

Clayton,

Didn't catch that at first, and I will admit that I do share your warped sense of humor. With that said, it has been a long time since I have sprinkled in some Pujols

Mike

[ethicsprof]

no shinies here.
the monster wants you to collect shinies.
don't listen to it.

best,
barry

[Woundedduck]

Originally Posted by pgellis

I also agree with others about Pujols and the juice. I am a huge Red Sox fan and have been saying for a long time that Big Papi had to be on the juice. I feel the same about Pujols.

That being said, I would not invest a penny into any modern rookie cards, no matter who it is. Before all the steroid info came out (when I was much younger), I had some Sammy Sosa RCs, Jose Canseco RCs, Mark McGwire autographs, etc., etc. Wouldn't be able to get rid of those for a penny nowadays.

There's just too much uncertainty with any ballplayers that excel way above the average ballplayer.

Actually autos of Canseco, Sosa, & McGwire still do pretty well..... Especially McGwire.

[nebboy]

Im a BIG fan of his charity work. His one of the most stand up guys off field.
If you don't know about him its worth you time to find out. I hope he doesn't caught up in the wrong side of things.


BB could use another good guy without a bunch of ***********************************s

[Anthony S.]

Probably bought my last pack of cards when I was 13 back in 1981. But the countless shoe boxes of cards I collected between 1975 and 1981 remain in my old room at my parent's house, and I know my nephew loves to swing by with his friends and plow through the cards. I've told them they can take whatever they want, but I still receive phone calls from my mom in which she insists on reading off the names of the players on the cards they've just selected, to make sure it okay:

Mom: "Hi Dude*, Lou picked out a few cards today. I'll just read them off to y..."

Me: "Mom, whatever he takes is fine."

Mom: "Well, I just want to make sure that..."

Me: "Mom, trust me, it's fine."

Mom: "Tim Wallach, Dale Murphy, Marc Hill, Manny San...um..."

Me: "Sanguillen. Mom, just let him have them." (Raising my voice) "Lou! Can you hear me, Lou? Take the cards."

Mom: "Jack Clark, Ron Cey, Steve Garvey....Isn't he the one that had all those children with all those different women? Mickey Rivers, Ed Goodson..."

I've received that phone call 10 times, minimum.

* yes, mom calls me "dude." It's a California thing.

[Griffins]

Anthony, I'm starting to wonder if we have the same mother and she gave us both the same name to avoid confusion.

[Kawika]

Originally Posted by Anthony S.

* yes, mom calls me "dude." It's a California thing.

Dude, that is some funny shit.

[dstudeba]

If they don't play in my town's Little League I couldn't care less about them.

[caramelcard]

Originally Posted by alanu

LaRussa would never let a juicer play on his team!!

Where's the smiley face or wink? This is a joke right? LaRussa is the reason that juice is so prevalent in baseball.

[Browncow75]

I have bought a few of his rookies. I wont fall for the $2000-3000 price tag of the "best one" though. As far as being on the juice, with his off field persona, I think he would have to be one helluva actor to get away with it. He is a very religious guy, and Ive actually met his son A.J. at my cousins' house. They go to the same church, and the kids play together. Im not naive enough to say "there's NO way", however, it just seems unlikely when you look at the "man behind the ballplayer".

With that said, having McGwire as the hitting coach - WORST IDEA EVER!!! What can he tell them? Swing for the fences, boys! He is a career .263 Hitter, with only 30 more hits than strikeouts!!! How can you have a batting coach who, himself, is only famous for hitting a bunch of Tainted homeruns? Doesnt make any sense to me. Thats another brilliant "Larussa idea" I suppose.

[ScottFandango]

interesting responses!

But for those who think he is juicin, i think you need to find out a little bit more about Albert...juicing doesnt fit in his life timeline, nor does it fit his persona...

all i can say is, we may be watching ONE OF THE GREATEST PLAYERS EVER...we should enjoy it and tell out grandkids we saw ALBERT PLAY!

his stats already DWARF the great Mantle....

Pujols WORST season is better than MANTLE'S SECOND BEST SEASON

[PWeso81]

Yeah, Pujol's numbers are still there during this heavy testing era. He IS amazing. However, $2000-$3000 for one of his rookies is about $1700-$2700 too much...IMO.

[ScottFandango]

the beauty of Pujols Rookies cards is that there is one for EVERY BUDGET

if you think $3000 is too much, he has serial numbered cards with game used swatches (numbered to 200 only) for about $400...you cant go wrong with that (leaf certified materias)...

also, there is the Upper Deck Pros and Prospects game used Jersey #'d/500 for about $200 !!! good stuff for a future HOF rookie card!

Best right handed hitter ever!

[Browncow75]

If Pujols is on the juice, I would rather pay $200-400 for one of his rookies than $20 for a Gem 10 Bonds rookie, solely based on the type of person he is off the field. Just my 2 cents!

[ScottFandango]

Originally Posted by Browncow75

If Pujols is on the juice, I would rather pay $200-400 for one of his rookies than $20 for a Gem 10 Bonds rookie, solely based on the type of person he is off the field. Just my 2 cents!

great point!


just curious....

what evidence is there that Pujols juices?>

i dont see any? he doent have any of the tell tale signs...

he is UNCUT and has a SMALL HEAD (7 1/4) and has lost weight since his rookie year, not put it on....

[PWeso81]

I have a few of his rookie cards. I am a very active collector of current cards. Having said that, If I have an extra 3 grand laying around...The last card I am buying is a Pujols rookie. Soooo many more cards to be had for that coin.

[teetwoohsix]

There's no doubt Pujols is a decent guy,and an excellent player.But judging by demeanor doesn't always work.Look at Manny Ramirez.Casual,laid back,sense of humor-but come to find out-juicin'.That was a bummer for me,being a Dodger fan.My point is,I wouldn't of known judging by his demeanor.

Clayton

[PWeso81]

Originally Posted by ScottFandango

great point!


just curious....

what evidence is there that Pujols juices?>

i dont see any? he doent have any of the tell tale signs...

he is UNCUT and has a SMALL HEAD (7 1/4) and has lost weight since his rookie year, not put it on....

One tell tale sign is that he is doing things no one else has done before. Is that fair? No. But welcome to 2010. He has never failed a drug test...but neither has Bonds. I hope he is clean.

Other amazing players:
Clemons
AROD
Manny
Big Papi
Big Mac

[Browncow75]

Bonds was on the list of 104 players testing positive for PEDs in 2004? Along with ARod and a few other noteables you listed (including our closer, Ryan Franklin!). Maybe not.

[ScottFandango]

Unfortunately for Pujols, he will always be suspected, because he played in the "steroid era"

He has been the only player to ever publically say "he would give back ever penny he made if he was found to be using Peds".....

Manny showed the signs of steroid for many years : Severe mood swings and odd behavior....Pujols NEVER has had those symptoms...

[PWeso81]

Originally Posted by Browncow75

Bonds was on the list of 104 players testing positive for PEDs in 2004? Along with ARod and a few other noteables you listed (including our closer, Ryan Franklin!). Maybe not.

I didn't know about Bonds on the list. Seems like it would be "case closed" for him if that were true. My point is that everyone who has done the impossible have had some help.

[ScottFandango]

Originally Posted by PWeso81

I didn't know about Bonds on the list. Seems like it would be "case closed" for him if that were true. My point is that everyone who has done the impossible have had some help.

YOU GOTTA BELIEVE!!!

PUJOLS has been putting up the same stat line since he was 12 years old!

he developed strong legs as a youth because he used to carry his drunk father home every night..Pujols' father was a legendary player in DR, and he used to party ALL NIGHT long after the games and Albert used to TAKE CARE of his father and LITERALLY carry him MILES on his back...

[M's_Fan]

Does Pujols have a rookie card? I bet he has about a 100 rookie cards. I bet there are about a 100 different Pujols cards from each month he has played in the big leagues. The card companies of Pujols' era have printed cards like, well, like our government prints money. They printed so many they became worthless, so then they had to invent something else like a "refractor" card.

And my other point is, what the hell is a refractor? I seriously had to look it up:

re·frac·tor
Pronunciation: \ri-ˈfrak-tər\
Function: noun
Date of origin: 1769

Refractor: a telescope whose principal focusing element is a lens

So you put a bunch of tin foil on a card, call it a "refractor" (which it isn't, unless they make a card that is actually a telescope with a lens, which they just might do in a very limited and expensive series coming soon) and that gets people excited?

So the answer is no, I'm never tempted to collect Pujols.

and in my opinion you could combine the misdeeds of Bonds, McGwire, Palrmero, and Sosa and it wouldn't hold a candle to the dirty player that Cobb was, or a few others in the early days.

[Browncow75]

Refraction is the change in direction of a wave due to a change in its speed. This is most commonly observed when a wave passes from one medium to another at an angle. Refraction of light is the most commonly observed phenomenon, but any type of wave can refract when it interacts with a medium, for example when sound waves pass from one medium into another or when water waves move into water of a different depth. Refraction is described by Snell's law, which states that the angle of incidence θ1 is related to the angle of refraction θ2 by


where v1 and v2 are the wave velocities in the respective media, and n1 and n2 the refractive indices. In general, the incident wave is partially refracted and partially reflected; the details of this behavior are described by the Fresnel equations.

[ScottFandango]

the fact is there was a LIMITED amount, SERIAL NUMBERED amount of cards produced...

FAR LESS than then number of T206 CHASE cards..Far less than many tobacco cards....FAR less than the 52 mantles...

FAR FAR less than 1968 RYAN....


point is, there may be MANY DIFFERENT KINDS of pujols rookies (183 to be exact) there are not ten of thousands available...

and for the player he is, that is a SMALL amount based ont he demand...

[Browncow75]

The most expensive Pujols RC was an Autographed Bowmans Best redemption consisting of 500 issued, and according to Bowman, not all were redeemed, and were never issued to the public. Food for thought. Not necessarily validating the enormous price they demand at this juncture of his career.

[ScottFandango]

Actually it was the Bowman Chrome, a soon to be iconic card...

it routinely fetches $3000- $7000 depending on the grade....

since the redemption expired in early 2002, not all 500 were redeemed...

an ON - CARD auto (not a sticker)..from a very popular modern set BOWMAN CHROME

[PWeso81]

Originally Posted by ScottFandango

YOU GOTTA BELIEVE!!!

PUJOLS has been putting up the same stat line since he was 12 years old!

he developed strong legs as a youth because he used to carry his drunk father home every night..Pujols' father was a legendary player in DR, and he used to party ALL NIGHT long after the games and Albert used to TAKE CARE of his father and LITERALLY carry him MILES on his back...

Hey man, I am not bashing. I truly hope he is clean. The steroid topic is sooo worn out...I am finished. Roids or not...he is amazing.

[ScottFandango]

Originally Posted by PWeso81

Hey man, I am not bashing. I truly hope he is clean. The steroid topic is sooo worn out...I am finished. Roids or not...he is amazing.

nuff said

[Browncow75]

Mr. Fandango...Thanks for the correction! I knew it was a Bowman, just the wrong issue! Great points made by all!

[packs]

Although Albert's numbers are ridiculous, I had a lot more fun watching Griffey and Frank Thomas.

[jhs5120]

Originally Posted by ScottFandango

the fact is there was a LIMITED amount, SERIAL NUMBERED amount of cards produced...

FAR LESS than then number of T206 CHASE cards..Far less than many tobacco cards....FAR less than the 52 mantles...

FAR FAR less than 1968 RYAN....


point is, there may be MANY DIFFERENT KINDS of pujols rookies (183 to be exact) there are not ten of thousands available...

and for the player he is, that is a SMALL amount based ont he demand...

Unfortunately, there is evidence of more Pujols rookies being circulated into the public then the initial 500. The latest count for Pujols rookies numbered 005/500 is at 6. It is possible that people are forging the number for an extra few hundred bucks but what is stopping Bowman from printing $7000 for virtually pennies? Upper Deck has shown us that modern card companies are setting their standards lower than the collectors and it is very possible that Bowman could pocket the extra cash. That is why all serial numbered cards should be engraved rather then written on with a blue sharpie.

And Pujols today is better then any right handed hitter to ever play the game. I don't believe he is juicing but I didn't for A-Rod or Manny either.

[teetwoohsix]

Looking at that scan of the rookie card,I am not seeing how you say he's lost weight since then

Anyhow-it was a fun thread,but I'm heading on back to the pre-war area folks

Clayton

[fkw]

The problem with Pujols, is his cards are modern.

They are ALL limited edition collector issues, like Beanie Babies, Franklin Mint, Starting Lineup, etc. with a preconceived value at issue (blame the price guides)

A "true" collectors cards was always included FREE with a product or service of some kind.

For a card to have future value (supply and demand) it has to become naturally rare over time.... it had to have little to no value at issue, used and abused, and eventually a high % trashed. ie Comics, Stamps, Coins, Movie Posters (1 sold for $690K), Beer Cans (one sold for $20K), Cards, Hot Wheels, Pez dispensers (started eBay), etc.

Thats why I dont like modern cards, Most now are intentionally (artificially) rare limited edition collector issues, and 99% are and always will be NRMT+

PS.
Looking at Pujols body, Id say PED, but I also dont care much that players did/do PED's, They dont make the player! Pitchers did/do it too! Plus the average person gains a pound a year from 20-40 yrs old.

[Browncow75]

As far as Bowman printing more of these now and trying to sell them as originals,
They wouldn't necessarily benefit from printing more of these cards directly, unless they sold the particular cards themselves for $2000-7000. Sort of a "Beckett Media" situation where they grade the cards and sell them on their own website. I'm not sure Bowman has the outlet to sell their individual cards to collectors for that sort of money, unless they were to make them, and have a bogus Ebay account they would use to pass them off to the public. Just a thought.