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  #1  
Old 08-17-2019, 03:48 PM
Jakrauss44 Jakrauss44 is offline
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Default 1991 topps desert shield cards need help

Hey guys I initially posted this in the for sale section by accident so hope this isnít a problem re making it here. I need some help with the 91 topps desert shield set. My cousin just inherited a bunch of stuff from his great uncle who happened to be a military vet, One of the things was some packs of what appeared to be 1991 topps baseball. We figured we would open them as we didnít think they had much value. To our surprise they were actually 1991 topps desert shield and not regular topps. Now I had posted in the pre war thread about one of the cards which was a babe Ruth sporting news rookie that ended up being fake, therefore my concern is these desert shield cards may be fake as well. Out of the packs we have opened We pulled 4 chippers and was hoping everyone that knows anything about the set to give input as what to check for and all that. Iím trying to attach pics but it keeps telling me file failed no matter which way I try or how many different pics I take so Iíll try to get those up. In the mean time if theirs anything I can look for to distinguish let me know, thanks
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  #2  
Old 08-17-2019, 04:11 PM
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Completely allowed discussion here. The Chipper is the crown jewel of that very large set, so hitting 4 in some packs is pretty crazy.

People who would have fake Chipper Desert Shields would be very unlikely to attempt to sell them in rewrapped packs; they'd sell the fakes individually to make the most money.

Since the only difference between the Chipper and the normal 1991 Topps card is the foil stamping, you need to inspect the gold foil. There are a bunch of websites dedicated to showing you the difference between fake and real.

Type in "fake real desert shield cards" into Google and you can see a bunch of articles.
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Last edited by swarmee; 08-17-2019 at 04:12 PM.
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  #3  
Old 08-17-2019, 04:55 PM
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here is a few pictures trying to get the others posted still having issues with the file type on the others.
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File Type: jpg 4Chippers.jpg (57.8 KB, 226 views)
File Type: jpg chipper_front.jpg (55.1 KB, 228 views)
File Type: jpg chipper2_back.jpg (63.7 KB, 225 views)
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  #4  
Old 08-17-2019, 05:18 PM
Jakrauss44 Jakrauss44 is offline
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ok pretty sure i got this to work finally. these pics are mostly of the desert shield logos 2 of which are 2 of the chippers while the other 2 are from other random cards from the packs. Also the glow back picture is of another card as well, wasnt trying to pull the chipper out of the sleeve and risk damage as I would like to send them off to PSA. Also would like to build a set if these end of checking out. please any and all feedback related to the topic would be appreciated, thanks everyone.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg chipperLOGO.jpg (76.5 KB, 223 views)
File Type: jpg ChipperLOGO2.jpg (73.5 KB, 226 views)
File Type: jpg LastLOGO.jpg (80.2 KB, 224 views)
File Type: jpg OtherLOGO.jpg (76.6 KB, 226 views)
File Type: jpg Glow.jpg (68.3 KB, 229 views)
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  #5  
Old 08-18-2019, 01:50 PM
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I can't give a exact reason but they look bad to me, several small things look off about them.

That don't mean PSA wont slab them or that I could be wrong.

Here is a pic of your Chipper logo beside 2 known real ones that came from the foremost expert on DS cards.

Did you get any Wade Boggs in those packs? If so I would really like to see them.
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File Type: jpg DS1.jpg (83.3 KB, 212 views)
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Last edited by bnorth; 08-18-2019 at 03:03 PM.
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  #6  
Old 08-18-2019, 06:37 PM
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I have a DS set but am not expert on the many fakes out there. If I had an authentication issue I would contact a fellow board member, Zach Wheat. He does not post a lot but his contact info can be found in the Community/Members list under on the first page of the Zs.There are several DS threads in here that discuss what to look for to spot fakes but if I had a question I would check with Zach. He is my go to guy on DS
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Old 08-18-2019, 10:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bnorth View Post
I can't give a exact reason but they look bad to me, several small things look off about them.

That don't mean PSA wont slab them or that I could be wrong.

Here is a pic of your Chipper logo beside 2 known real ones that came from the foremost expert on DS cards.

Did you get any Wade Boggs in those packs? If so I would really like to see them.
Iíll check and see if I do for sure but think I did get one. What is it about the Boggs that would make that the deciding factor. My biggest thing is something looks off to me as well thatís why Iím asking, however everything Iíve read says the fakes donít show the stars or the coconuts and The cards I got all have both, as well as the bottom of the shields arenít pointed as they say the fakes are. There so much info out there but it all contradicts and honestly has me even more confused lol.
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Old 08-19-2019, 07:32 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jakrauss44 View Post
Iíll check and see if I do for sure but think I did get one. What is it about the Boggs that would make that the deciding factor. My biggest thing is something looks off to me as well thatís why Iím asking, however everything Iíve read says the fakes donít show the stars or the coconuts and The cards I got all have both, as well as the bottom of the shields arenít pointed as they say the fakes are. There so much info out there but it all contradicts and honestly has me even more confused lol.
The biggest giveaway on the fakes is the "operation" is shifted. On authentic cards the palm should point between the R and A in operation. Not saying they are good or bad but your cards pass the first test.
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Old 08-19-2019, 08:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jakrauss44 View Post
Iíll check and see if I do for sure but think I did get one. What is it about the Boggs that would make that the deciding factor. My biggest thing is something looks off to me as well thatís why Iím asking, however everything Iíve read says the fakes donít show the stars or the coconuts and The cards I got all have both, as well as the bottom of the shields arenít pointed as they say the fakes are. There so much info out there but it all contradicts and honestly has me even more confused lol.
I collect Wade Boggs is the only reason.
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Old 08-19-2019, 01:22 PM
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They look good to me. Nice pulls!

Sorry to flip on you, but after taking a close look at the DS cards in my collection, I don't think these are legit.
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  #11  
Old 08-19-2019, 01:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ALR-bishop View Post
I have a DS set but am not expert on the many fakes out there. If I had an authentication issue I would contact a fellow board member, Zach Wheat. He does not post a lot but his contact info can be found in the Community/Members list under on the first page of the Zs.There are several DS threads in here that discuss what to look for to spot fakes but if I had a question I would check with Zach. He is my go to guy on DS
I got a hold of Mr Wheat and in his opinion they are 100% fake. He is out of town so posting is a PITA for him and he said I could post his opinion.
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  #12  
Old 08-19-2019, 02:58 PM
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I got a hold of Mr Wheat and in his opinion they are 100% fake. He is out of town so posting is a PITA for him and he said I could post his opinion.

Yea I talked to him thru pm, again my biggest thing is they pass all the tests that any of the online info says to look for. The bottoms of the shield arenít pointed, you can see the stars in the flag, you can make out the coconuts and the bottom leaf of the palm tree doesnít touch the line and falls between the R and the A. So what exactly is it that makes them fake? I guess these would have to be some of the best fakes out their considering the psa article says every fake they have come across doesnít have the dots for stars and canít make out the coconuts. Iím completely confused on all this, if someone is going to say their fake ok thatís fine but why? What makes them look fake? I havenít gotten that part just ďtheir fakeĒ.
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Old 08-19-2019, 03:01 PM
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I got same response from Zach, who admittedly was reviewing them on the road on an I Phone. Zach has been reluctant to list specific reasons on public boards for thinking posted cards may be fakes in order to not aid ongoing fraudsters improve their product. But if you google" Topps 1991 Desert Shield fakes you will get some input


Not sure if PSA is any good in telling the real thing from the many fakes out there
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Old 08-19-2019, 03:18 PM
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Quote:
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Yea I talked to him thru pm, again my biggest thing is they pass all the tests that any of the online info says to look for. The bottoms of the shield aren’t pointed, you can see the stars in the flag, you can make out the coconuts and the bottom leaf of the palm tree doesn’t touch the line and falls between the R and the A. So what exactly is it that makes them fake? I guess these would have to be some of the best fakes out their considering the psa article says every fake they have come across doesn’t have the dots for stars and can’t make out the coconuts. I’m completely confused on all this, if someone is going to say their fake ok that’s fine but why? What makes them look fake? I haven’t gotten that part just “their fake”.
Post a pic of all 285 you have from the opened packs and I will give you a few of the laundry list of problems they have.
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Last edited by bnorth; 08-19-2019 at 03:20 PM.
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  #15  
Old 08-19-2019, 04:40 PM
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.

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Old 08-19-2019, 04:41 PM
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Post a pic of all 285 you have from the opened packs and I will give you a few of the laundry list of problems they have.
alright then lets get this out of the way right now. I am trying to attach pictures of all the cards I pulled as well as the packs, however it keeps saying upload failed. when this was happening the other day its b/c the files were HEIC files and not supported by the site, however these are JPEG files so shouldn't be an issue. Honestly had I known I was gonna get mostly sarcastic smart ass comments insinuating that I am full of shit I wouldn't have even bothered on this board and would of went elsewhere. I am a legit collector trying to get legit feedback and that's it. Again had I realized that was such a problem on this board I would of gone elsewhere but unfortunately this is where I started thinking that this was the best place to get the best feedback, am I wrong? I am used to helping other collectors when I am in the position to be able to, guess most others are just negative skeptics but too each their own.
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Old 08-19-2019, 04:50 PM
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Quote:
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alright then lets get this out of the way right now. I am trying to attach pictures of all the cards I pulled as well as the packs, however it keeps saying upload failed. when this was happening the other day its b/c the files were HEIC files and not supported by the site, however these are JPEG files so shouldn't be an issue. Honestly had I known I was gonna get mostly sarcastic smart ass comments insinuating that I am full of shit I wouldn't have even bothered on this board and would of went elsewhere. I am a legit collector trying to get legit feedback and that's it. Again had I realized that was such a problem on this board I would of gone elsewhere but unfortunately this is where I started thinking that this was the best place to get the best feedback, am I wrong? I am used to helping other collectors when I am in the position to be able to, guess most others are just negative skeptics but too each their own.
I don't think you have got a single bad comment. The photo file is too big if they are not uploading. Try to shrink them if that does not work PM me your email and I will email you so you can send them to me. Then I will upload them for you.
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  #18  
Old 08-19-2019, 04:52 PM
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plus my other thing on this is, if they are fake, why would someone stuff those chippers in packs? Especially when they can sell them by themselves for way more than what they can get for a pack?
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Old 08-19-2019, 05:02 PM
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Seems to me you got a couple of opinions that the cards are fakes, a couple that they looked good, and at least one not sure ( me). If you have some nice Chipper Jones cards send them to PSA. If they grade them then it should not matter what the nays say. I personally don't think it fair on your part to categorize the feedback you asked for and received here as smarts ass in nature.
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Old 08-19-2019, 05:06 PM
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Is this the best place to get information? Maybe. But many scammers post on this board and others (like blowout or collectors unlimited) to gain information about how to make their fakes better.
Your first strike against you is that you're a new account. Second strike, that you posted about an obvious fake Ruth. So you should understand that you're going to get heavily inspected and criticized. Grow a thicker skin if you're going to post on message boards.

But yes, many experts will not publish their findings because fraudsters will use that to make better fakes. All we have up to now is your claim that you opened up packs. That's why you were requested to upload pictures of the other cards in the packs.

Send one in to PSA, one into BGS, and one into SGC to see what they say.
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Old 08-19-2019, 06:02 PM
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And again as I stated give me another option to get the pics up. Everything I e I’ve tried posting comes back as upload failed. I’ll be more than happy to email the pics to someone else if they can get them posted or send to anyone else by phone doesn’t matter which to me. I get being questioned, however the need to post smart ass remarks is unwarranted. Has nothing to do with needing thicker skin and everything to do with showing a little respect, as to this point I’ve done that but I guess none of you have ever had a fake card or ripped off before so excuse me on that part. I didn’t get on here in any sort of derogatory tone or attitude I’m simply looking for information/feedback. Everyone has to start somewhere don’t they? Everyone starts off as new at some point, do they not? But I guess all the “people In the know” so to speak started off with a 1000 posts and veteran status. That kind of bullshit right their is why true collectors that happen to be “new” get turned off by these boards. Like I said at first if someone has another option to post the pics I’m all ears otherwise I guess I’ll just send them in to be graded and use that as being legit or not. Was just hoping to not have to spend over priced rates and wait a month if I could keep from it. However Those kind of comments are the exact reason I’m new and will stay new, sorry I don’t get down with the whole “my shit don’t stink” and “I’m better than you” attitude simply bc I haven’t posted a lot.

Last edited by Jakrauss44; 08-19-2019 at 06:16 PM.
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Old 08-19-2019, 06:18 PM
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You have to shrink the file size down to around 1MB each for.them to upload.
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  #23  
Old 08-19-2019, 06:32 PM
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Quote:
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You have to shrink the file size down to around 1MB each for.them to upload.

thank you for the input I will try to work with these and go from there
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Old 08-19-2019, 06:41 PM
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this should come thru now. thank you for pointing out the files had to be under 1mb as i didnt know that. also didn't take individual pictures of every single card as doing so and then moving them one by one to my computer to post would take me all week. if there is something specific wanted or needed just say so. also just so its clear when I posted the pics before of the shields and cards they were taken from more cards than just the chippers.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg 1st.jpg (41.8 KB, 151 views)
File Type: jpg 2nd.jpg (43.9 KB, 151 views)
File Type: jpg 3rd.jpg (44.1 KB, 152 views)
File Type: jpg 4th.jpg (41.9 KB, 149 views)
File Type: jpg 5th.jpg (44.3 KB, 153 views)
File Type: jpg 6th.jpg (41.4 KB, 153 views)
File Type: jpg OpenedPacks.jpg (42.1 KB, 154 views)
File Type: jpg singlePack.jpg (41.6 KB, 152 views)
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  #25  
Old 08-19-2019, 06:43 PM
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also there duplicates triples and quads of other cards besides chipper and I had started to put everything in order as again I was going to start building a set
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Old 08-19-2019, 06:58 PM
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Quote:
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also there duplicates triples and quads of other cards besides chipper and I had started to put everything in order as again I was going to start building a set
Can you post a better picture of the 2 Boggs and then take any one of the other players you have 4 of and post them with the logos showing beside each other?

Do all the logos look like the ones on the chipper cards or do some appear different?

I am about to head out for supper so it could be a hour or 2 before I can get back to you. Thanks for posting the pictures.
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Old 08-19-2019, 07:21 PM
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Quote:
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Can you post a better picture of the 2 Boggs and then take any one of the other players you have 4 of and post them with the logos showing beside each other?

Do all the logos look like the ones on the chipper cards or do some appear different?

I am about to head out for supper so it could be a hour or 2 before I can get back to you. Thanks for posting the pictures.:)

Yah no problem at all, will do. I ran out for food as well so when I get back home Iíll throw them up their. As I said in the beginning they donít appear or feel right to me either thatís why Iím searching to begin with. The thing Iím completely confused on is they appear to check all the boxes anyone says to look for. That palm tree just looks weird to me. Iíve talked to a couple other family member thatís were in the war at that time, they both said they appear to look right but they also said it was a long time ago and baseball cards were the last thing on their minds so to remember specific little details like that they didnít want to say yeah itís def legit when it wasnít any where close to being on their priority list at the time.
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Old 08-19-2019, 07:26 PM
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And legitimately appreciate the feedback and input. If I didnít I wouldnít be on here just seemed like compare to other boards there was better material and more knowledge here idk. Especially pertaining to this topic.
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Old 08-19-2019, 08:37 PM
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alright sorry that took me a little while but here is what I pulled together. first up will be the 4 of a kind, honestly didn't look to see who it was lol but here is that. also when I talked to Zach thru PM he mentioned to look at the other threads to see what sheets the chippers were printed on and see if they match. however I wasn't able to locate those other threads. I know where the letter is located would you maybe happen to know? or the Boggs even? I have the Boggs pics as well, bout to post those too.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg 1stQuad.jpg (44.8 KB, 143 views)
File Type: jpg 2ndQuad.jpg (65.4 KB, 147 views)
File Type: jpg 3rdQuad.jpg (73.1 KB, 143 views)
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  #30  
Old 08-19-2019, 08:40 PM
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why did those rotate? and why didn't all of them come thru? oh well heres another try
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File Type: jpg 1stQuad.jpg (44.8 KB, 144 views)
File Type: jpg 2ndQuad.jpg (65.4 KB, 142 views)
File Type: jpg 3rdQuad.jpg (73.1 KB, 143 views)
File Type: jpg 4thQuad.jpg (64.1 KB, 142 views)
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  #31  
Old 08-19-2019, 08:47 PM
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yeah not sure why those pictures rotated like that, they were oriented just as if you were looking at the card the right way. anyways here are the boggs pictures. I started shaking so theirs two of each Boggs card.
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File Type: jpg Boggs1A.jpg (34.2 KB, 146 views)
File Type: jpg Boggs1B.jpg (73.9 KB, 139 views)
File Type: jpg Boggs2A.jpg (77.9 KB, 145 views)
File Type: jpg Boggs2B.jpg (36.5 KB, 143 views)
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  #32  
Old 08-19-2019, 08:49 PM
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I give up man lol, zero clue why those are rotating like that, hope that isn't a huge problem. let me know if you know how to fix that as well, thanks man.
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Old 08-19-2019, 08:54 PM
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They are 100% fake. Now this part is just a guess. These have been a hot item from the beginning. Your cousins Uncle got screwed when he purchased them. The guy probably had him open a few packs to show they were DS cards. It is very easy to open and reseal the wax packs. They were going for good money even back then. Even the commons demanded good $ so scam artists would make fakes of all the cards.

The reason there are 4 Chipper Jones cards is because back in the day they were not worth big money like they are now. They are real 1991 Topps cards because the only difference is the foil stamp. The wax packs were also exactly the same so without opening them you would have no idea.
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Old 08-19-2019, 08:54 PM
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Double post
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Last edited by bnorth; 08-19-2019 at 09:20 PM.
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  #35  
Old 08-20-2019, 07:07 AM
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Jim65 Jim65 is offline
Jam.es Braci.liano
 
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Compare the palms. Genuine cards, the palms stand out like 3D effect, yours the palm are totally flat.

I say fake as well.
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  #36  
Old 08-20-2019, 09:27 AM
Jayjones82 Jayjones82 is offline
Jason Jones
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Send 1 or 2 to PSA for grading. You'll either be out $50 or find out they're real (or, at least, gradable by PSA...if that's worth anything)
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  #37  
Old 08-20-2019, 04:04 PM
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Tripredacus Tripredacus is offline
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I do not know which is which, but I want to point out in this comparison:
http://www.net54baseball.com/showpos...05&postcount=5

That the OP's pictures show a palm tree with rounded or circular features, while the stamp shown in bnorth's post are more angular.
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  #38  
Old 08-20-2019, 04:08 PM
Jakrauss44 Jakrauss44 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tripredacus View Post
I do not know which is which, but I want to point out in this comparison:
http://www.net54baseball.com/showpos...05&postcount=5

That the OP's pictures show a palm tree with rounded or circular features, while the stamp shown in bnorth's post are more angular.

Yeah totally get what your saying. It looks like the ones that are more angular have crisp outlines and it almost looks like mine bleed out somewhat and as you stated are more round like.
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  #39  
Old 08-20-2019, 04:09 PM
Jakrauss44 Jakrauss44 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jayjones82 View Post
Send 1 or 2 to PSA for grading. You'll either be out $50 or find out they're real (or, at least, gradable by PSA...if that's worth anything)

True, still debating on it honestly.
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  #40  
Old 08-20-2019, 06:38 PM
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Ben North
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jayjones82 View Post
Send 1 or 2 to PSA for grading. You'll either be out $50 or find out they're real (or, at least, gradable by PSA...if that's worth anything)
Unless he gets a completely incompetent grader it would be like throwing cash out the window of a moving vehicle.

If you look at the small details in post #5 you will see the only thing that is correct is they spelled OPERATION DESERY SHIELD correctly. Counterfeit logo is on the left and the other 2 are real. I could easily list 20 things wrong with the counterfeit one.

I sent the OP 2 real ones so he can compare his fake ones to them in hand.
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  #41  
Old 08-20-2019, 07:46 PM
Mike D. Mike D. is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jayjones82 View Post
Send 1 or 2 to PSA for grading. You'll either be out $50 or find out they're real (or, at least, gradable by PSA...if that's worth anything)
Someone on the board is organizing a group submission - $9 a card plus return shipping - so not too big an investment to try!
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  #42  
Old 08-20-2019, 09:52 PM
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Ben North
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike D. View Post
Someone on the board is organizing a group submission - $9 a card plus return shipping - so not too big an investment to try!
I would hope Bobby doesn't want someone sending in obvious bad cards with his group submission.
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  #43  
Old 08-21-2019, 06:19 AM
Mike D. Mike D. is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bnorth View Post
I would hope Bobby doesn't want someone sending in obvious bad cards with his group submission.
Well, if thereís really no doubt, sure. Iím just saying if there IS doubt, it wouldnít cost $50 to find out.
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