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  #1  
Old 05-17-2003, 11:54 AM
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Default T206 Cobb Back

Posted By: Wade 

Can someone shed some light on the Ty Cobb with Cobb back? I have heard different theories on this back including one that believed these cards were actually from a different set all together. Does anyone own one, or has anyone ever seen one of these? I believe I read an article some years ago about the discovery of several of these, but I can't remember where I saw it. Any thoughts on this subject?

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Old 05-17-2003, 12:15 PM
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Default T206 Cobb Back

Posted By: Marc S.

From March 2001:

Robert Edward Auctions is featuring The Finest T206 Ty Cobb with Ty Cobb Back In Existence. The following is the description:

The T206 Ty Cobb with Ty Cobb back is universally recognized as one of card collecting's greatest rarities. There are currently twelve T206 Ty Cobb with Ty Cobb backs known to exist. Of these, this example is, in our opinion, by far the finest in existence. Close examination of the card has led us to the definitive conclusion that this example is, in fact, actually a proof card which was saved by the printer or someone else closely involved in the printing process. The primary evidence for this conclusion is that the card has no glossy surface coating which is a characteristic of all other examples. While not noted in any reference guide, the surface of every T206 Ty Cobb with Ty Cobb back (with the exception of this unique example) has a glossy coating not unlike a clear shellac, which was applied to the surface as part of the production process. (Another tobacco card issue of the 1910 era which also shares this "glossy coat" quality is the T213-2 Coupon Tobacco series). The offered card was pulled from production prior to this final process, and has never had the glossy surface coating applied. In addition, close examination reveals a very slightly irregular hand cut (as opposed to machine cut) which is further evidence that this card is a proof which was pulled from production by the printer, quite possibly as a sample. The fact that this is a proof and was never actually packaged with tobacco is probably largely responsible for its survival in such extraordinary condition (especially for a Ty Cobb with Ty Cobb back). The card is crisp, bright and clean, both front and back, with perfect registration, no creases, and just a hint of wear to each corner. The existence of this card has long been rumored, but this is its first public appearance at auction. Robert Edward Auctions has known of this card for many years, and has always accounted for its existence both with reference to the number of T206 Cobb with Cobb back cards known, as well with reference to condition. For example, when Robert Edward Auctions offered a Vg to Vg-Ex Ty Cobb with Ty Cobb back which sold for $36,098 in our July 2000 sale, we referred to that example as, in our opinion, the third finest in existence. The second finest example was also sold by Robert Edward Auctions and appeared as Lot #14 in our June 1997 sale. Graded Vg-Ex, that card sold for $32,598. Over the past thirty years Robert Edward Auctions has handled the sale of almost every T206 Ty Cobb with Ty Cobb back in existence. It is a very special privilege for us to be chosen to offer this most extraordinary example of this legendary rarity to the collecting world in this auction.


From March 1997:

"You've heard it before and you'll hear it again: Someone, somewhere has a new "find" to report. So just what is a "find" anyway? For the purposes of the baseball card hobby a "find" is a discovery of a card or cards of substantial importance to or impact on the hobby that finally makes its way into the hobby. Just such a "find" recently occurred in Georgia.

An incredible find of five T206 Ty Cobbs with Ty Cobb backs have been discovered. Previous to this only six examples of this legendary rarity were known to exist. These five newly discovered cards were found by a non-collector who happened to come across them in a book while going through his great-grandfather's old papers and effects.

All five cards have been consigned to Robert Edward Auctions' June 1997 auction. Each card will be offered individually. The T206 Ty Cobb with Ty Cobb Back is universally recognized as one of the most legendary of all baseball card rarities. These five cards represent one of the most incredible and exciting finds in the history of card collecting.

It's interesting to note how the cards were found and what led to their appearance on the hobby scene. The following letter was written by the discoverer of the cards to Robert Lifson, owner of Robert Edward Auctions:

Dear Mr. Lifson:

Enclosed are copies of the old book in which the Ty Cobb cards were preserved. I tried to place the remaining cards back as they were when I got them so you could see how they spent the last 70 or so years.

As I told you over the phone, my great-grandfather, John W. Hudson, operated a mercantile store in Reynolds, Georgia from around the turn of the century until 1917, when he moved the family to Talhotton, Georgia.
A lot of their old stuff was packed up and stored in various places, as they moved frequently in the early 1920's. My father and I acquired
several boxes of the old books years ago, all water damaged, and almost stopped off at the dump with them on the way home.

I still have Grandpa's cast iron bank in the shape of a baseball player holding a bat. My mother has his pocket watch and 11 Confederate five hundred dollar bills. I also have a Reach Baseball Guide for 1909 with front cover missing.

Although Grandpa was the one who smoked the Piedmonts and, eventually, the Ty Cobb Tobacco, it was my mother's brother John Hudson who wore the cards outplaying with them. He would have been the one who pasted and preserved them between the pages of this volume. Miraculously, these cards were glued in place with only a paste mixture of flour and water, so they simply flaked out as I turned the pages.

Ty Cobb was very much revered here as one of, if not the first, national hero to emerge from Georgia during a period of time when the souls of southern folk were still hurting from losses suffered in the war of 1861-65. This more than likely accounts for his popularity here, aside from his playing record. It would he interesting to know what areas of the country the other known Cobb brand backs originated from.

Although there is a degree of sentiment attached to these things, we agree that they're doing no good stuck in a drawer somewhere.

Although the discoverer found the cards about 10 years ago inside a thin, hardbound book of House and Senate Memorial Speeches given in honor of recently deceased Georgia Congressman Rufus Lestcr, it was not until this past year when he bought a price guide that he became aware of
their great rarity and value, another factor in bringing cards out of the closet and into the hobby. After initially discovering the cards, they were offered to several local collectors, but the $10 to $200 offers were not enough to pry them loose from the great-grandson.

So now the five Cobb-back Cobb cards (considerably more rare than even the famous Honus Wagner card) are back in the hands of the hobby. And these five cards will he part of a spectacular offering by Robert Edward Auctions this summer. Each card has a minimum bid of $5,000.

In September of 1994, a Fair-Good example sold in a Robert Edward Auction for $20,123, Over the years there have been only three other
sales of Ty Cobb cards with Ty Cobb backs at public auction. One sold
for $17,000, the other two each sold for slightly more than $60,000 and all of these examples had significant condition problems.

Some might question the wisdom of putting all five cards up for auction at the same time. According to Rob Lifson, offering five cards at once is the fairest to all, in that he is able to avoid potentially creating a situation where the buyer of the first card (and subsequent buyers) would feel disappointed as example after example came to the marketplace. At the same time, offering all five cards at once allows Robert Edward Auctions to create the excitement and "circus atmosphere" this find deserves, and to present a collecting event which will long be remembered as one of the most exciting and special buying opportunities in the history of card collecting. "

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Old 05-17-2003, 01:03 PM
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Default T206 Cobb Back

Posted By: jay berhens

from MarkS post:

> After initially discovering the cards, they were
> offered to several local collectors, but the $10 to > $200 offers were not enough to pry them loose from > the great-grandson.

It's sad to see that things haven't changed much since I got out of the hobby in 1991. It's really sad that people find it neccessary try and prey on the ignorance of people offering vintage cards for sale.

Jay

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