William Bustos, Whittier, CA - eBay: callofduty2005 AVOID AVOID AVOID

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Posted By: DR

I am having a problem transaction with William Bustos, Whittier, CA, callofduty@charter.net. A card purchased on eBay has writing (someone tried to erase) on the reverse and minor paper loss. The auction description stated no paper loss. The card is graded PSA 7 and William refuses a refund stating 'I am just getting tired of coming out on the short end of each transaction'. Does anyone know this seller, able to help or have suggestions? Please let this serve as a warning!

<a href="http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ih=018&sspagename=STRK%3AMEWN%3AIT&viewitem=&item=280043805283&rd=1&rd=1</a" target="_new" rel="nofollow">http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ih=018&sspagename=STRK%3AMEWN%3AIT&viewitem=&item=280043805283&rd=1&rd=1</a&gt;

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Posted By: Judge Dred (Fred)

Do you have the ebay item description number? How did it get encapsulated into a PSA7 holder if it has paper loss and writing on the back?

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Posted By: warshawlaw

too easy

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Posted By: DR

I just filed a claim with eBay. This seller should be avoided unless you want to buy from someone that does not have a return policy. What a jerk! Told me I want a refund because I overextended myself. Please. This guy is not only a crook but arrogant fool. The no Paypal should have been a clue to me. Once again, DO NOT BUY FROM WILLIAM BUSTOS unless you want to be in my situation!

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Posted By: edacra

In the same situation, only the cards I bought were raw T201's with light pencil writing on the back that wasn't visible in the auction. Looked like someone made a swirly M on all of his cards.

He took a long time to respond, to the several emails, I sent, then finally agreed to a refund. I have yet to get my money back.

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Posted By: DR

The same swirly M on the reverse. Obviously this could not have come as a shocker to William Bustos. However, he feels PSA is at fault. My opinion is BOTH of them are at fault. I would think the card should have been taken to PSA or checked in lieu of the other cards (likely from the same deal) having writing on the backs. My first email to William Bustos was ignored. Only until eBay was involved did he reply. All in all...as you can plainly see....AVOID!!!

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Posted By: Bryan

but, you bought a PSA 7 and got a PSA 7. If the card has been entombed, why is any further description nessesary?

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Posted By: DR

The seller in the listing contract stated NO PAPER LOSS. It has writing, eraser marks and paper loss. If the seller did not state NO PAPER LOSS I would have sent an email asking about the return policy and any back damage before the auction ended. However, when the seller stated in the description NO PAPER LOSS, I assumed the back was inspected. Talk about critical details being left out and an outright LIE about the NO PAPER LOSS. If the scans were high resolution, we would not be having this discussion. The low resolution images might be an attempt to hide flaws. Also, another Net54 member had the same problem with the same seller recently and my card was a different issue. Seems like I am not the only person being taken advantage of by the seller.

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Posted By: Judge Dred (Fred)

Can you give us an item number so that we can look at the item description? Bryan, in the previous post, made a very good point. If it's in a PSA7 holder then there shouldn't be much to worry about. Or is that line of thinking flawed? Ut-oh, does this sound like the beginnings of another PSA bashing thread? I suppose we should hold off until we at least see a scan of the card.

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Posted By: ScottIngold

"I want a refund because I overextended myself"

Seller might have a problem with the above. I am assuming that was your statement to him of course.

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Posted By: steve f

D R has a valid complaint. He didn't inquire about the slab, but of the card. The seller, malicious or otherwise, erred... 100% refund should be granted.

D R, Provide the seller the link to this thread and if he's a sensible fellow, I'd bet you'll recieve compensation. Good luck

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Posted By: DR

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=280013839205

Card identified as misgraded by many. Seller knew but tried to force sale NO WAY
Buyer starseeker15( 1237) Oct-21-06 15:38 280013839205

William Bustos is simply banking on PSA. If PSA states a card is such and such it must be. I do not think this is right. What if the cards was SGC, PRO, ASA, etc.? Are we just buying holders? If you are not going to have a return policy, state it in the auction. Also, do not list a card as NO PAPER LOSS when it clearly has paper loss. Maybe William Bustos need his eyes checked?

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Posted By: Judge Dred (Fred)

CAN YOU PROVIDE AN EBAY ITEM NUMBER FOR THIS CARD?

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Posted By: Judge Dred (Fred)

That's another example... so where's the first example (yours)....

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Posted By: Dan Koteles

is it possible that you bought a card in a switched holder ?

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Posted By: DR

Item #280043805283

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ih=018&sspagename=STRK%3AMEWN%3AIT&viewitem=&item=280043805283&rd=1&rd=1

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Posted By: DR

I do not think the card or holder has been switched. The pencil mark on the back is consistent with other cards by the seller (see above post by another board member going through the same problem). I will post the scan of the card below very soon. Please check out the image:

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Posted By: edacra

In case anyone missed it the first time I said it...

I returned 2 cards with pencil mark on the reverse from the same seller.

The pencil was very light and did not appear in the auctions scan (and I was careful since every other card had some markings). One can reasonably deduct that this seller has a group of cards signed by some kid the same way you see Zeenuts marked by the original collector.

While I personally can't see any pencil in the scan above using my Ibook, there is NO REASON to doubt the accusation just because PSA is involved.

You now have two board members experiencing the same problem. The poor guy who spent three thousand dollars on a card shouldn't be the one in question.

Oh, and if Mr. Bustos is reading this, I'm looking forward to my $74 refund via paypal, that you promised me, and hope you mean well.

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Posted By: DR

The mark is on the top right of the card with the dreaded W or M more likely. Mr. William Bustos handled this situation is a less then professional manner. My original request was for a $100 partial refund or a full refund. $100 was just to be done with this situation.

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Posted By: Cat

Folks:

We had a huge thread on this card before. I remember the listing. I used to own this card, in the holder shown below, and sold it to a dealer (skips my mind at this point as to who it was specifically). That dealer sold it at the National (about 90% sure it was at the National). The card was cracked and regraded to its present PSA 5 state and sold. Notice that one of the questions in the listing asks about the tear on the lower right side of the card.

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Posted By: Bob

There was a thread recently thrashing GAI. Looks to me like they have moved up in to the number 2 position in grading as far as honest and impartial grading goes. Who would use PSA any more? Oh yea, I forgot, their slabs bring more money. That is the only reason to buy PSA graded cards- if you want to flip them...

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Posted By: Cat

The old thread:


http://www.network54.com/Forum/153652/thread/1154548012/last-1155261924/Seriously%2C+how+is+this+a++5-

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Posted By: Judge Dred (Fred)

David got screwed on this one.

And we're off....

PSA graded this a "7" - I think they are somewhat responsible for this problem because if I were to see a PSA7 card for sale (lower res scan) I would make a few basic assumptions and a couple of those would include no marks (or indications of erased marks) or paper loss. The seller in this case is a real A-hole because he went out of the way to indicate NO PAPER LOSS.

With that said - let the PSA bashing begin!

Why don't we see a PSA banner at the top of the page?

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Posted By: Jeff Lichtman

Won't PSA just agree to make good on this? I would think they'd want to remove this card from circulation.

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Posted By: Todd Schultz

it is a reasonable assumption that a PSA 7 will have no marks or erasures. PSA will put a mk qualifier on any card with a mark or erasure, even a PSA 1, and of course, this slab had no qualifiers. They blew it on this card, and yes, the seller knew he pulled one over on them. Another black eye for the hobby.

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Posted By: jay behrens

PSA make good? LMFAO!!! That means admitting they made a mistake and we all know that they don't do that.

Jay

I love pinatas. You get to beat the crap of something and get rewarded with candy.

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Posted By: edacra

Strange.

Now I do see that little swirly marking...but the markings I was talking about covered the entire back of the cards I was sent. One end to the other, with what might have been a dull library pencil.

If we're ruling out the idea he's selling off a collection of this pencil marked stuff, then I don't even know what to think.

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Posted By: James Gallo

Well I guess it really does come down to by the card not the holder.

I agree that since no paper loss was stated then you should get a refund.

And there is NO WAY GAI is more accurate then PSA. PSA may make more mistakes but when you get a GAI 4 card with two pin holes in it then you know how bad they really are. I won't buy a GAI card unless I see it in person.


Regardless this guy does sound like scum.

James Gallo

Looking for 1915 Cracker Jacks and 1909-11 American Caramel E90-1.

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Posted By: Bob

That's funny Jim, I have the same attitude about PSA cards, I won't buy them unless I at least see a scan. Their grading has slipped with regard to pre-war cards, although I believe they are better than PRO.

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Posted By: quan

but i will never buy a graded card unseen. if there's a problem the seller can just absolve to the grading company. however i will buy raw cards from a few people unseen because i trust their grading as long as they give a thorough description.

for what it's worth i think the bustos dude sells cards for a "friend". gave him a bank cashier check one time but he said his friend would only take postal money orders...(which is far easier to counterfeit and can't be verified on the spot like the cc).

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Posted By: edacra

My refund arrived today in the form of a check.

He may have taken a few bucks out for either the postage, or his listing fees (though I'd have to double check that, maybe he did refund in full). I'm assuming it will clear. I paid him via paypal and expected the refund to appear there.

Hope there's some resolution with the PSA graded card. Good luck.

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Posted By: edacra-arcade

The seller in question just contacted me in response to this thread, via Ebay.

He's under the impression that it took a month for me to pay for his auction, and that this is relevant enough that I should have disclosed that to the board, for some reason. My recollection is that I paid promptly via PayPal, since it was an option using "pay for ebay items", and I mailed promptly to let him know. He took a month to claim the money, since he normally doesn't accept paypal at all.

Mr. Bustos, if you're reading this, I hope this is the clarification you feel you deserved, and that this somehow vindicates you. Thanks for the refund, and I hope you have better luck representing your merchandise accurately in the future, as I'm sure that's your intention.

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Posted By: DR

If WILLIAM BUSTOS is aware of this message board and has yet to reply my guess is he has reservations about the way he treated me and others. Get a backbone, do what is right and defend yourself. eBay called me on the phone tonight to see if they could help. Wow. This amazed me! It has now become my mission to inform everyone about Mr. William Bustos and plan to do everything in my power to legally ruin his chances on eBay or message boards. Was it worth it? I have posted on PSA, plan to post on SGC, Beckett, and will also contact others. My original request was for a full refund OR just a $100 partial refund and to admit the card was not graded correctly. For $100, I would have jumped at this chance to avoid the bad press and fallout.

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Posted By: T206Collector

If you buy a card from the Big 3 (PSA/SGC/GAI) and it does not meet your expectations in terms of standards, then your beef is with the grading company, not the seller. If PSA won't make it right, SGC certainly would. That is why so many of us don't buy PSA graded pre-war cards.

The headaches described in each of these threads could have been avoided if you concentrated on building an SGC based collection. The reason I switched from PSA years ago was because I got tired of picking up creased or trimmed T206 cards graded PSA 5.

Has it occurred to anyone that the only cards being sold in PSA holders are those that would not crossover into SGC slabs? If I dumped 10 PSA cards on ebay like this in my modest collection, how many other SGC fans have done the same?

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Posted By: steve b

Everyone has their own card company they like. Why would PSA grade a trimmed card. If they measured it and it was trimmed they will not grade it. If i am correct, PSA has 2 people grade it and if there is a problem a 3rd person will check it out. I don't think they are in the buisness to grade altered cards, of course they may make a mistake but i would say 99.5 percent are not trimmed or altered. In my opinion.

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Posted By: DR

T206Collector. You are full of hot air too! In this case the seller in the listing contract decided to state a LIE. This is NOT the same situation. By the way, I have overgraded SGC graded cards too. I know this may come as a shocker. My GAI graded cards are almost all overgraded ready for crossing. This is NOT a PSA bashing thread. It is about WILLIAM BUSTOS and to make people aware of his tactics and possibly criminal (and questionable) business practices. From your reply, hopefully one day you get screwed big time too.

Thanks,
David

BUY / SELL / TRADE -> 1878 TO 1911 NON & MULTI SPORTS : N28, N29, N43, N162, N165, N184

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Posted By: cmoking

I like PSA and SGC equally. At times, I find myself defending PSA on this board because of B.S. statements by guys like T206Collector. Here is one such statement:

"Has it occurred to anyone that the only cards being sold in PSA holders are those that would not crossover into SGC slabs?"

This is just a freaking laughable and stupid comment.

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Posted By: Jeff

I'd gotten ungraded cards from him. The description claimed the backs were clean. I bought a STACK of '33 Goudeys from him based on this, only to find that they ALL had writing on the back. He refused to refund. I returned them anyways with a note saying that he could avoid these problems simply by noting the writing on the back. He ended up refunding my money after getting tired of arguing about it, and then threw in a few cuss words asking that I never bid on his auctions again....NO Problem there.

Simply put, he is a slimeball as far as I'm concerned. Writing on the back was obvious, and not only did he not mention it, he said the backs were clean. Then, it was my fault.

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Posted By: T206Collector

"From your reply, hopefully one day you get screwed big time too."

Again, since I do not purchase PSA graded cards and will take SGC at their word, regardless of what a seller says, I will not "get screwed big time" in the manner that you allowed yourself to get screwed.

<<"Has it occurred to anyone that the only cards being sold in PSA holders are those that would not crossover into SGC slabs?"

This is just a freaking laughable and stupid comment.>>

While I was exaggerating, my point was that I, for example, have sold at least ten PSA 5-6 T206 cards with visible creases or evidence of trimming on ebay because those cards would (obviously) not cross into an SGC holder. And I am not a dealer by any stretch. Can you deny that there are a lot of failed grading dumps out there? Because of that, it is best to go with a company that will right the obvious mistake and pay you the difference in the full value of the card.

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Posted By: Dave

All the grading companies make equal mistakes period. I've had two T206's that I sent to PSA, one came back trimmed and the other came back altered. I sold both on ebay, stating that neither graded for me. The guy that bought them sent both to SGC, one came back a SGC 60 and the other a 84. Yes....they ALL make mistakes.

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Posted By: quan

that just means the psa monkeys didn't know what they were doing and the cards were fine because SGC is always right...umm i think 115% of the time

...and to be fair if SGC said the cards were trimmed and PSA put them in numbered holders....then well PSA have stupid monkeys who don't know what they were doing and the cards were in fact altered!

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Posted By: T206Collector

I piggyback what you said, without the sarcastic/friendly smiley faces. For every trimmed card PSA misses I am certain there are an equal number of untrimmed cards that PSA mislabels. If you're making errors in one direction, it's because you don't understand what to look for -- this means you will make the same errors in the other direction. Most of the time, I believe SGC will catch those mistakes in both directions.

Ultimately we all know the grading companies all make mistakes, and you can say what you will about PSA volume versus SGC volume, but I have never -- really, never -- had an issue with an inconsistent grade by SGC -- I currently own 300 T206 cards graded by SGC from "A" to "80" and I can honestly explain why each card graded the way it did. When I had my 40 PSA graded T206 cards, that was an impossible endeavor -- 5's and 6's with creases, and 3's and 4's without creases, were the hardest to explain away. And when I sent them all into SGC for crossover, SGC couldn't explain it either, agreeing with me that PSA had incorrectly graded at least 25% of my submission.

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Posted By: DR

This is NOT a PSA, SGC or GAI bashing thread rather a thread about WILLIAM BUSTOS placing in the description NO PAPER LOSS when the card has PAPER LOSS, a pencil and eraser marks. I do not care if a card is raw or graded. If you list a graded card AS IS...fine! However, if you do NOT, claim to have a return policy, blatently misrepresent a card in writing (contract), it is FRAUD.

This thread was started to alert everyone to WILLIAM BUSTOS'S very questionable character and possibly criminal business tactics. When eBay renders a verdict, I will be sure to let everyone know. Maybe I am in the wrong but do not think so (at this point) and feel a crime took place.

AVOID AVOID AVOID --> WILLIAM BUSTOS.

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Posted By: quan

seems like when i spoke to WB he did not know much about vintage cards and the stuff he was selling, someone just gave him some cards to list. when i bought from him 6 or 7 months back his feedbacks consisted mostly of modern shiny stuff. I do agree that if u misrepresent what you're selling then you should give a refund back to the buyer.

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Posted By: Lee Behrens

I am with DR on this one because it was stated in his auction no paper loss and there is no policy of return on graded cards listed.

Now on to T206 Collectors point, way is it when we have a problem with a graded card transaction it involves a PSA card. The company has big problems and the biggest reason it is supproted is the price they command on resell. Too me buying from any graded company other then SGC is buyer beware. Yes, I buy them on occasion if I feel they are cheap enough, nothing high grade though.

Lee

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Posted By: Judge Dred (Fred)

Double post - I posted this in the Chet Wood thread also:

Do you know what I find is funny here?

We all admit to not being experts and we rely on the grading service "experts" for a subjective opinion. We place great faith and value into these "expert" opinions.

These are the same graders (for PSA, at least) which we all accept as being people that have no clue to what these cards are.

Did I miss something here?

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Posted By: T206Collector

...my only point is that when you buy a PSA 7 card, that is your guarantee that there is no paper loss. It does not matter what the seller says at this point, because when you get your PSA 7 in hand you have a claim against PSA that is ripe. Of course here the seller made a mistatement, and it may be that a fraud was committed, but the larger issue here is PSA graded a card with paper loss a 7.

In short, today there have been two posts blasting the sellers of PSA cards as bad people -- the real problem in the industry is PSA, which provides the means for a bad transaction, not the sellers.

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Posted By: Jeff Lichtman

I'm starting to think that Quan and King are the two smartest people out here...

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Posted By: edacra

The idea that this issue might be better taken up with PSA sounds like a constructive one.... but I think the compulsive debate over grading company conduct has been covered elsewhere in more appropriate threads.

The fact is, PSA is the most dominant slab on the market, and buying one is about as inevitable as buying a raw card at some point. Your personal preferences shouldn't enter into your judgement on this or other transactions.

Normally, I do think we're all more forgiving to sellers when there's an error on a graded card. However, three board members purchased cards with markings on the back from this seller, both graded and ungraded. That changes the situation somewhat. The error was not that someone bought or sold a PSA graded card.

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Posted By: DR

I left negative feedback today for WILLIAM BUSTOS. Other people are returning cards too and upset. Today, neutral feedbacks were left for misgrading also. WILLIAM BUSTOS charged shipping both ways. Go figure! The low resolution images are the way he is able to perpetrate fraud. It is obvious callofduty2005 (eBay ID) does NOT know how to grade cards or treat people. Once again, AVOID AVOID AVOID!