NonSports Forum

Net54baseball.com
Welcome to Net54baseball.com. These forums are devoted to both Pre- and Post- war baseball cards and vintage memorabilia, as well as other sports. There is a separate section for Buying, Selling and Trading - the B/S/T area!! If you give an opinion of a person or company your full name needs to be in your post. Contact the moderator at leon@net54baseball.com should you have any questions or concerns. Enjoy!
Net54baseball.com
Net54baseball.com

Go Back   Net54baseball.com Forums > Net54baseball Postwar Sportscard Forums > Modern Baseball Cards Forum (1980-Present)

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #21  
Old 05-13-2018, 10:22 AM
Peter_Spaeth's Avatar
Peter_Spaeth Peter_Spaeth is online now
Peter Spaeth
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 13,526
Default

Also -- I would be willing to bet if you cracked out all the 9s and 10s, and resubmitted, and somehow could trace each card, you would get a very different group of 10s, and probably some 8.5s or even 8s. At the 9/10 level there is a lot of arbitrariness which is what makes it so artificial in my opinion.
I have seen this first hand, a guy I knew who was a huge volume submitter used to regularly resubmit stacks of 9s of major cards and always would be rewarded with some 10s.
__________________
Buy high, sell low.
Reply With Quote
  #22  
Old 05-13-2018, 10:24 AM
Dpeck100's Avatar
Dpeck100 Dpeck100 is offline
David Peck
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 425
Default

It doesn't matter what it would sell for raw. It doesn't matter what it would sell for in a BGS slab. It comfortably sits in a PSA 10 holder and has been awarded the grade of Gem Mint.

I will never dispute that there are cards that you look at in a holder and think boy I don't see how that was given the grade it got. Some are damaged in the holder while others are simply poorly graded. The most glaring example I have ever seen was a 1974 Topps Dave Winfield rookie that looked like a solid 7 but had a 10 on the holder and it still at the time went for $7,400. Whether you or I or anyone else for that matter agrees is irrelevant. What matters is that card still will change hands for more than a card with a 9 up top.

When I got back into cards in 2009 and switched from baseball to wrestling I saw the writing on the wall. It was clear the only way to radically change the value of a card relative to another example was to get it graded. If anything during this time frame the spread has widened even further and that isn't going to change. Someone can either fight the trend or get on it and enjoy the ride.

There is no doubt that much of the value is in the bragging rights and all one has to do is understand this and the rest makes sense. My card is better than your card and only a small number of people can say they have one that is a 10. Throw in rising prices and you have a perfect storm.


No kicking, fighting or screaming is going to change any of this and as the number of participants expands so do the discrepancies. All one must do is look to the gaming category and the explosion there and see how quickly they have adopted getting cards graded. Simple stuff dude.
Reply With Quote
  #23  
Old 05-13-2018, 10:27 AM
Peter_Spaeth's Avatar
Peter_Spaeth Peter_Spaeth is online now
Peter Spaeth
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 13,526
Default

David, I get it, there is a flip market. I take that as a given. I am not disagreeing with you. I am just opining that its underpinnings are artificial and arbitrary.
__________________
Buy high, sell low.
Reply With Quote
  #24  
Old 05-13-2018, 01:04 PM
Rookiemonster's Avatar
Rookiemonster Rookiemonster is offline
Dustin
Dustin Mar.ino
 
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: Nj
Posts: 1,274
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth View Post
Also -- I would be willing to bet if you cracked out all the 9s and 10s, and resubmitted, and somehow could trace each card, you would get a very different group of 10s, and probably some 8.5s or even 8s. At the 9/10 level there is a lot of arbitrariness which is what makes it so artificial in my opinion.
I have seen this first hand, a guy I knew who was a huge volume submitter used to regularly resubmit stacks of 9s of major cards and always would be rewarded with some 10s.
I couldnít have said it better. ( especially with the 1993 SP jeter) I be heard some crazy stories on the regrade your card game. Give me a grade 8 and 90% percent of the time you canít see itís not a 9. And take a look at a 9 and Iíll make a case for to be a 10 or a 8.(depends if it my card or yours lol.


I donít even see graded cards as mine is better then yours because the grade of it. Maybe 2 to 10 but the difference between 7 and a 8 come on.
__________________
Just a collector that likes to talk and read about the Hobby. 🤓👍🏼
Reply With Quote
  #25  
Old 05-13-2018, 01:20 PM
Peter_Spaeth's Avatar
Peter_Spaeth Peter_Spaeth is online now
Peter Spaeth
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 13,526
Default

For anyone who believes in the "10" I encourage you -- no I double dog dare you -- to do the following experiment. Take 20 PSA 10s of cards of significant value, crack them out, resubmit them (yourself, not through 4SC), and report back what you get. Go on.
__________________
Buy high, sell low.

Last edited by Peter_Spaeth; 05-13-2018 at 01:20 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #26  
Old 05-13-2018, 02:12 PM
Dpeck100's Avatar
Dpeck100 Dpeck100 is offline
David Peck
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 425
Default

I have loads of self submitted 10's that you could send in time and time again and get a 10.

This is not an exactly tough set but it is pretty obvious this card is a 10.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg 8nature388_zpsehikjaa6.jpg (77.1 KB, 220 views)
Reply With Quote
  #27  
Old 05-13-2018, 02:18 PM
Dpeck100's Avatar
Dpeck100 Dpeck100 is offline
David Peck
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 425
Default

What gets lost in the shuffle is some collectors like 10's because many are incredibly aesthetically pleasing to the eye with no wear and perfect centering.

I like them for numerous reasons. I love to collect nice looking cards, they are dramatically better than any other grade for investment purposes, I have active registry sets, I like to uncover raw cards that are beautiful, I can say I have the only copy or one of just a few copies to ever grade that high, huge bank for your buck if you submit them yourself, and on and on.
Reply With Quote
  #28  
Old 05-13-2018, 02:19 PM
Peter_Spaeth's Avatar
Peter_Spaeth Peter_Spaeth is online now
Peter Spaeth
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 13,526
Default

I have a number of 9s that look like 10s. And probably some percentage would be on resubmission. And probably some of my 10s would get 9s. The guy I knew made a good part of his living getting 9s bumped to 10s. Jordan rookies and the like. It was essentially a numbers game.
__________________
Buy high, sell low.
Reply With Quote
  #29  
Old 05-13-2018, 02:20 PM
Peter_Spaeth's Avatar
Peter_Spaeth Peter_Spaeth is online now
Peter Spaeth
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 13,526
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dpeck100 View Post
What gets lost in the shuffle is some collectors like 10's because many are incredibly aesthetically pleasing to the eye with no wear and perfect centering.

I like them for numerous reasons. I love to collect nice looking cards, they are dramatically better than any other grade for investment purposes, I have active registry sets, I like to uncover raw cards that are beautiful, I can say I have the only copy or one of just a few copies to ever grade that high, huge bank for your buck if you submit them yourself, and on and on.
I agree with you on the investment, no question. Where we disagree is whether in terms of the actual card, there is a clear differentiation between a 9 and a 10. From what I have seen in decades of doing this, frequently not. Many many 10s are bumped 9s.
__________________
Buy high, sell low.
Reply With Quote
  #30  
Old 05-13-2018, 02:29 PM
Dpeck100's Avatar
Dpeck100 Dpeck100 is offline
David Peck
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 425
Default

That is where it gets blurry. You are right about that bump game. The most expensive card I have ever purchased was a 9 first.

I think some of that can be chalked up to erring on the side of conservatism and card grading isnít a perfect science. I was naive to that when I first embraced it.
Reply With Quote
Reply



Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Derek Jeter Autographics Purple Foil /50 came back BGS 7.5 -- talk me off the ledge? VintageGamerN00b Modern Baseball Cards Forum (1980-Present) 0 06-20-2013 02:42 PM


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 09:00 AM.


ebay GSB