Auction dollars spent vis a vis ebay dollars spent

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Posted By: leon

Just curious as to folks thoughts on what all of the auctions currently will do to ebay prices currently. Might it make the prices go lower....higher ?? regards

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Posted By: vetekbob

In my opinion for what its worth lol, I have been a part of auctions outside of Ebay and in comparing results from outside auctions to the same or similar ones on Ebay, it appears to me that Ebay final price is lower. Granted there are exceptions depending on rarity and grade offered at times on Ebay. I see the shift moving outside of Ebay as to prewar vintage cards. I like Ebay and have been able to amass some great cards from there over the years but from what I have seen in the last 6 months to a year, Ebay doesnt offer the selection in graded vintage cards that it used to and that is a shame. For people like me who are usually upper middle of the road grade collectors and buyers, the auction house prices are well out of my range. It would be nice to see someone come up with an auction site that fills in the nitch between Ebay and the big auction houses. Maybe I am just totally way off base here but I dont see the so called big hitter sellers on Ebay that once were previlant.

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Posted By: Bottom of the Ninth

No doubt that ebay final prices will suffer for anything that is not rare or unique. Most collectors do not have high 6 figure card budgets. I think there will also be an increase in listings in an effort for some to free up cash to acquire some of the amazing offerings in Mastro, Lipset, Edwards, Goodwin, etc etc.

I cannot think back to a time since collecting where I have seen so much being offered, with little duplication, by so many different auction houses.

I am just sitting back waiting to find anything that is priced right. Don't care where it comes from. There are things that I want (actually need is being more honest) out of the current auctions but I will only chase them to a point. There will always be another one...I hope.

Greg

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Posted By: Scott Forrest

The prices paid in Mastro, etc. auctions for large card lots are tied to the price that the dealer-purchasers think they need to get in order to make a profit breaking them up on ebay. Ebay prices drive Mastro,etc. rather than the other way around.

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Posted By: Dave Williams

There are nearly 3000 different auctions for cards pre 1940 on Ebay right now.

That is nearly double the auctions for 1940 to 1979 stuff.

Simple supply and demand says for average, run of the mill vintage stuff that the price would seemingly go down as the numbers go up.

However, there are certainly more people such as myself back actively buying on a limited budget as well. But since there a lot of items, unless there is something I really want I just pass and wait for bargains.

I'd say Ebay seems to be a better place to pick stuff up than to sell it, unless it's been graded and comes in pretty high.

I know I can't afford much in those Mastro and other auctions.

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Posted By: warshawlaw

As a bidder, I am pretty much shut out of the major auctions for reasons of budget and lot size. I don't want to buy 100+ cards in each lot and I don't feel like spending my entire year's card budget on a mass lot that I have to break up on ebay to get the ten cards I want. And some of the lotting in these auctions is plain nuts. I can't believe the consignors are happy with it. For the same reasons I don't think I would ever consign to the major auctions. I think my collection would do better pieced out over ebay than mass lotted in a major auction because it is lots and lots of nice items but no spectacular five-figure items. There is also the issue of $ on the table with 30% total juice (buyer and seller combined) and outrageous shipping fees.

I have to disagree with the conclusion that ebay card prices are depressed. I sure haven't seen it on the cards I look for; more often than not I am skunked on the bidding for them.

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Posted By: martin dalziel

There are two (maybe more) classes of cards - mid/lower grade and then high grade.

I think a lot of the new collectors coming into pre-war aren't/can't collect the high grade stuff. I expect to see mid and lower grade auction lots sell higher. As Scott says, the lots get broken up and then put on Ebay. The new collectors are fueling the buying so the prices are going up.

Re. high grade - as more and more new collectors come into the market seeking mid/lower grade cards, its causing an overall market momentum, hence many more lots at auction and many more auctions, as sellers want to cash in on the good market conditions. I don't think so many of the higher grade cards will make it to Ebay, as they're being bought at auction as singles versus lots.

I have no idea whether the number of higher end market collectors is increasing or not. If not, then we'll see lower Ebay prices for items making it there.

I've always been a mid grade collector and know i'm having to pay more at auction and on Ebay.

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Posted By: barrysloate

Everything still boils down to supply and demand. Good material does extremely well in any context, particularly when a couple of very aggressive collectors are working on a registry set. Then the price of a card will go nuts no matter where it is listed. The very best material that is in short supply will do great on ebay and anywhere else. The major difference, however, between ebay and the large auction houses is that ebay lots are typically single cards, whereas auction houses offer huge lots. So many collectors buy the large lots from the big auction houses and sell them as singles on ebay, and while the mark-up may be only slightly above cost on most lots, a few of them will go crazy, and that will justify the whole expense.
Here's a corollary question to pose, one that Leon and I discussed the other day: How many collectors feel that prices for vintage material will continue to rise indefinitely, and how many collectors feel the market is a bubble that will one day undoubtedly burst? I have to say even as a veteran I am astonished by the amount of money that is being funnelled into vintage material, but I have also seen the market fall many times before. What about this market? At what point do cards get so expensive that only the very rich can afford them? At what point do prices get so high that the average collector say 'I've had enough, I just can't do this anymore?' At what point do the zillionaires burn out and just get out of the hobby altogether (rich people have short attention spans when it comes to lavishing themselves with luxuries). Just food for thought.

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Posted By: jay behrens

It will burst. If I could predict when, I'd be a very rich man. In the late 80s everyone was going to retire and send their kids to college with their baseball collections. Then the whole thing blew up and it's just now gotten back to where it was around 1990 or '91. Now is definately not the time to be buying if you are an investor. This is very much a sellers market. When the bubble bursts, 90% or more of the new money will leave because it's no longer a good investment and they will move on to the next flavor of the month. Those of us around for the long haul won't be hurt by the cycles.

Selling off rarities at any time is not a good idea if you are in the hobby for the long term. They very tough, if not almost impossible, to reaplce. Selling off easy (a realative term) items isn't a bad idea. Especially if you are using the money to buy rarer cards because you can easily replace them at a cheaper price when the bubble finally does burst.

Jay



I've just reached Upper Lower Class. I am now officially a babe magnet for poor chicks.

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Posted By: Chuck R

Personally, I wouldn't expect a huge burst in the vintage bubble. Baseball card investors in the late 80's were buying cases of new and recent cards, hoping for the hot rookie. You can't give that stuff away now. If you look back at prices for the last few decades for things like T206, Old Judge and 33 Goudey, I'd expect you'd see a steady climb a lot like the stock market. Quality, vintage stuff may level off some but I think we're dreaming to think the prices will go way down from where they are now.

I'm looking right now at a book I've had since those crazy days (called "The Top 100", written in 1990), telling would-be investors the best cards to own. 1984 Donruss Don Mattingly is just ahead of the 1914 CJ Joe Jackson; 1975 Topps Mini George Brett is well ahead of the E90-1 Mike Mitchell; Wade Boggs and Tony Gwynn rookies are miles in front of the Old Judges, T207s and E102s. I think the late 80's was an aberration...people were blinded by the rookie card speculation thing, much like the tulip craze back in Holland centuries ago. The stuff that is old, desirable and produced in relatively small quantities will hold up in value.

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Posted By: Patrick McMenemy

For those of us on a budget or for those of us chasing only a handful of type cards, EBAY is where most of my "card money" ends up. Although I enjoy window shopping the major auction companies catalogs, the inflated prices, together with the added "buyers fees" as well as the reality of having to buy a large lot to obtain a single card has placed bidding beyond my reach.

So EBAY auctions and buying directly from dealers like Mark Macrae and Larry Fritsch are my only viable alternatives.

Patrick

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Posted By: vetekbob

Barry and Jay, you both bring up some very good points that I have wondered about lately myself. As someone that doesnt have a huge amount of money to spend on prewar cards, I have wondered where the ceiling is and are we nearing it. I personally agree with Jay, that if you are a true prewar collector you are in it because you love it and are not concerned about flipping cards all the time for money. Granted, if some sellers on ebay didnt flip like they do, I wouldnt have the ability such as it is to get a nice card here and there and for that I am thankful for. I buy graded for the authenticity issue realizing that at times mistakes can and are made by the grading companies. If I buy a card I want to see the beauty of the artwork and style of it without lots of handling and wear to distract from and handling cards holdered allows me to sit and appreciate such without worry about an accident happening that might would spell disaster if not holdered. I have been known to flip some cards when the scope of my collecting changed and or I had the opportunity to acquire something that struck my eye as a collector even more.
What I am sad about and miss is being able to actually walk into a card shop and look at true vintage cards and look at them up close and do business face to face and share and swap information. There isnt a card shop here in atlanta that I am aware of that has good prewar cards but thank god for ebay and other collectors who provide their knowledge as well as sharing from the heart to help collectors like me.
As to auction house purchases, I would like to do more in that venue when the opportunity arises but the 15 - 20% fee really hits me with a limited budget. The buyers fee on some places has kept me from being able to get that one card or cards that I really wanted. I have no problem at all with nice catalogues and such to promote but at the same time, I also think sometimes less is better from the collectors standpoint.
As I mentioned in a previous posting, I personally feel there is a gap widening between the average collector such as myself and one those that are high end which many of the houses seem to cater to in only offering up high end examples of prewar cards. I have recently seen Barry's site as well as Seth's and Lew's and it does my heart good to see they are doing what they can to help fill that gap and I hope I can get involved in some of those auctions. Call me old fashioned but personal one on one trading or buying is something I think has suffered over the years but its good to see the spirit and the heart of the people here that seek to help each other out not because an extra dollar can be made but because they have a true desire to help a fellow collector.

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Posted By: jay behrens

True, you when the bubble bursts, you are not going to see a huge drop in prices on vintage cards. But you will see a dip and flattening of the market. There is just no way that the price increases we are seeing can be sustained. When the bubble bursts is going to depend more on the economy, than anything else. With gas prices going the way they are, a lot discretionary income is going to disappear from the economy. This will lead to a potential bubble burst.

Jay

I've just reached Upper Lower Class. I am now officially a babe magnet for poor chicks.

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Posted By: Julie

THIS time, although the great demand had brought 19th century cards to the marketplace--the price will probably not go down (he was speaking specifically of Old Judge, but I think it applies to all of it), because the demand is so great, with no end in sight. There just ain't that many 19th century cards!

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Posted By: barry arnold

Barry Sloate has penned quite eloquently what i have been incubating for some
time. The skyrocketing prices of the 206's ( which are my love ) and even
the 210's have made me wonder if the dot com/Nasdaq fall is about to hit
us vintage lovers.
One part of me smiles when i realize cards like those i have are selling
at tremendous prices; a more realistic part of me grimaces as i note
that red border 210 commons (PSA 5 or SGC 60) can sell for $100 which is
just too unbelievable.
certainly, we who love them know the cards are 'priceless'. still, the fact
that they are getting so pricey reminds me of my buying not only dotcoms
but kmart (right before it fell) and krispy kreme (same story).

Thankfully, most of us would love our Johnson's, Cobb's, Mathewson's,
and quite truthfully any of our incredibly aesthetic wonders no matter what
someone says their dollar value might be.
Still, i think it is wise to realize the bubble is so very,very thin.
While, we also realize that the card is strong in itself.



Best

Barry Arnold

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Posted By: barrysloate

A lot of good points have been made on this thread, and of course nobody knows the answer, not even me. Vetekbob regrets that there are no baseball card shops anymore and is thankful for ebay; the fact is ebay may be the reason that the baseball shop can no longer survive. Why pay high rent when ebay costs pennies to list and can reach thousands of people who would never even know your store exists? That is how the information age has altered the landscape. As far as a bubble bursting I feel that there can certainly be an exodus of well heeled collectors and investors one day if their collections aren't performing the way they would like, but there can't be a bubble bursting at the level of the dot.coms. When a stock tanks, you have nothing but a worthless piece of paper that says you own the stock. But if vintage cards lost value, you still have your collection and you can still enjoy it; and of course, some won't care and will continue collecting, others will have a bad taste in their mouth and bail out. That increases the supply, and lessens the demand, and there's your market cycle. It's like real estate- it seems to go up forever, but even if it went south, you still have a house to live in. I just think that the incredibly high prices you see for great rarities is populated by a very thin market; those cards are more volatile than a T206 in VG-Ex condition, which will never go too high or too low. But how about the guy who is buying a 1955 Topps common in PSA-9 for a $1000 for his registry set? After he's spent 150K to put his 55 Topps set together, where does he go to sell it when the market tanks? It's a matter of recognizing a good value and a bad value. The whole set registry craze is an amazing coup and marketing scheme for the grading companies, but that is probably the area of the market where someone is going to get his head handed to him. The N172's, T206's, and other classic sets will probably hold their value a little better. There's just something intrinsically appealing about them and they will always be collected. There can always be market dips but I don't think the classics will tank.

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Posted By: warshawlaw

A very interesting discussion.

I do not see a bubble forming in the traditional sense simply because the cards are not concocted out of thin air. Vintage postwar cards are a good example of this; they have been in a recession or at least a holding pattern price-wise for several years. There has not been a wholesale devaluation. People simply keep the cards they like and add new ones when they find them cheaply.

I think after 70+ years of "serious" collecting and a 30 year run of collecting as a "serious" investment it should be apparent that we are not going to wake up tomorrow back in the church basement with $10 T206 HOFers. There are too many people into it. All of us would pounce on examples of what we collect if they came up even slightly below "market" and when things go badly, we sit on our collections and enjoy them. I was on the "front lines" of the dot.com disaster in my practice because I represented a lot of service providers whose lucrative contracts suddenly went into default when their customers came apart at the seams. I filed approximately 20 cases in a two month period, all seeking to collect on these companies and learned there was NOTHING underlying these companies; I literally did not have the time to serve many collection cases before some of the defendants went into bankruptcy.

I don't think gas prices have any real impact on the serious collectors who spend thousands of dollars a year on cards. In all candor, those of you who spend on a very limited budget are not the market-setters anyway. You don't factor in financially. No offense, just math.

We are at a point where vintage material is rightfully recognized as rare and desirable by everyone involved. I definitely see a bubble on the high grade slabbed stuff because the prices are so high and the market so thin as a result. If a few of those guys quit, the last one holding the bag is going to get hurt. For middle and low grade cards, however, the market is robust. I know because I am not winning auctions at a pace suggestive of a weakening market.

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Posted By: leon

For some reason, in about 95% of your posts, I completely feel the same way and agree with you. That's scary. I agree about the price of gas not affecting prices too much either. At my restaurants (fast food)it's another story. For those folks it's sometimes either gas or a dinner out. Not so in our space...for the most part.....see ya later

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Posted By: warshawlaw

You know how you make a small fortune in retaurants? Start out with a large one

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Posted By: barrysloate

Vintage cards are what they are but here is an area of the market I don't understand. Let's take T210's as an example of this. Years ago they sold for $10-20 apiece because very few collectors cared about them and most never heard of the players. Now they are red-hot and often sell for $100 each. Why? Is it that these suddenly obscure players became so appealing or is it that everything else has become so expensive they are the only cards left that anyone can afford? If the latter is the case, what does that say about the market? And if a set is red-hot, does that suggest it will eventually cool off and become less appealing, and therefore less expensive? To this day I don't get what makes a set that's been around a century suddenly get hot.

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Posted By: leon

Adam- I've heard that before. How true it is.

Barry- Food for thought. It only takes about 2-4 people to get interested in a set then, for the immediate future, they look real expensive relative to just prior to that. Then once the 2-4 people have what they want/need the market cools off a little. I saw it happen with some E253's most recently ( a few months ago ). That is at least one scenario. I think the technology age has made the vintage card market exhorbitant for more than a few reasons.....regards

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Posted By: warshawlaw

The same could be observed for T207 and E cards. I remember scoffing at a grouping of Tinker-Evers-Chance portraits because they were E cards not T206. Now, I would have to reverse my thinking on the two lots.

Card collectors are not like normal "investors"; they don't shift from cards to oil futures based on the perceived returns on inveetment in the two. Collectors are going after regionals, PC's, minor league cards, etc. because there has been such a run-up on MLB prewar cards. You will see some of the same shifting into other sports cards and even non-sports too. Once they are into those issues, they develop enthusiasm that does not wane over time. If anything, it increases. I think the prewar obscure stuff and especially 19th century boxing card market has run up dramatically over the last two years in part because it is so much cheaper to collect them and the set designs are identical in many cases to the baseball cards from the era.

Brings up another point about why we are not likely to see a bubble and burst bubble: card prices are driven by factors mostly unrelated to investment returns. The areas of investment action get the press and the hype because their promoters can make the most money with it, but they are not relevant to most collectors. My prediction is that people who run with the trendy stuff that every dealer can turn out (new cards in the 1980s; high-grade postwar stuff in the 1990s) will be burned when the fever ends but collectors of rarer vintage materials will end up doing just fine financially.

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Posted By: Robert

I personally have not paid much attention to EBAY for the past few weeks because of the bug Auction houses all seem to be happening at the same time. Superior just ended then Mastro, now we have REA, Goodwin and if I was not banned from Oldjudge that as well. With them having so much quality product and I have placed a lot of bids and waiting to see how they are all going to play out, I just don't want to even mess with EBAY at the moment. It would be nice if the auction houses could some how get together and work out a schedule so that they are not all running at the same time. I think that would be wise for them and probable would bring in more $'s. I was wondering how many people that buy on EBAY know about the auctions in a percentage basis, do you think it is less of more then 50%. I don't think that the people who buy lower quality are effected or partake in the big auction houses only the high enders and wholesale dealers. Once the big house auctions ends you will start seeing a lot of that material on EBAY.

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Posted By: barrysloate

Leon and Adam both make good points and I agree with Adam that vintage cards will always outperform Mark McGwire rookies in the long run. But there is still another aspect of the market that troubles me: can't the cost of vintage cards, at every price tier, become so expensive that collectors just get tired of laying out so much money and just give up? There's a mortgage to pay, the kids need braces, the older ones are off to college, and common E94's are $300-400 apiece and Youngs are $2000 apiece and I've had enough and I'm throwing in the towel. Is everyone getting so rich that price is no object? I still maintain prices can't go up forever. At a certain threshold, and please don't ask me what it is, collectors start dropping out. I did; I can afford some of today's prices but cards at these levels have lost their appeal. I'd rather do something else with my money. Granted, as a dealer I get a chance to handle great cards and since I subsequently sell them I'm not actually tying up my money. But at today's levels, someone else can own them. Are there others who feel the same way? Or have I just been doing this too long?

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Posted By: runscott

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Posted By: LGB

Its really a matter of supply and demand...I too have some trouble believing that there are lots of people paying the prices that are on ebay...but I also remember stamps in the mid and late 70's...same type of runup on older material...much of it bought initially by investors and later both investors and collectors. But in the early 80's in combination with some tough economic times (less demand) and a combination of investors unloading their holdings and older collectors passing away (supply) prices tanked...and when they tanked they went down big-time...I can remember a UN mini-sheet that at one point sold for about $700 that now routinely sells for $40....even some of the "classic" early US stamp series lost 50%-60% of their value and have never reached the same levels. I do believe that much the same thing will happen with cards..with true scarcities of popular sets/players holding up but everything else getting back to levels that collectors only will sustain.

When the prices start going down I think you'll see a flood of material as people that aren't really collectors try to get out. It won't be $10 T206 HOFers in nice condition, but it might be $10 HOF in weak vg condition, or good condition....How many people grew up dreaming about completing an E96 set? Not too many.

Of course my investment history is nothing to stake your future on

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Posted By: barrysloate

Don't mean to hijack this thread, but with Leon's permission I'd like to comment on the stamp analogy and will try to wind it back to baseball cards. Coincidentally, I have a major American stamp collection (my own) going up on ebay late this Monday night. And since I check stamps on ebay nearly every day (but with the sale of my collection I will be done),I can say that stamps that were once considered rare- the first American stamps from 1847, the $5 Columbian,etc., can be bought off ebay several times a day, seven days a week. They in fact are beginning to look rather common. Imagine if the same thing happened with baseball cards, where every day you could buy half a dozen T206 Cobbs and the supply seemed limitless. That would surely affect prices. As you said, it all boils down to supply and demand. No guarantee the demand for baseball cards will always be at this fever pitch.

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Posted By: jay behrens

Gas prices won't directly affect cards, but in the overall economic picture, gas is a big driver. When gas starts getting very expensive, people start tightening their belts and stop spending extra money, no matter your tax bracket.

I don't see prices for common t210, t209, etc being sustained. $100 for a common minor league is just silly, no matter how the rare the set is. And I gaurentee you, vrey few people could even tell you who the major leaguers are in those sets outside of Jackson and Stengle. The PCL is an understable market. There is a HUGE collector base out there of people interested in that league. This same base does not exist for the Carolina and Southern leagues.

I'll just continue to bide my time, snag the occasion deal, wait for the things to cool off and start buying up things when everyone decides to start unloading their stuff.

Jay

I've just reached Upper Lower Class. I am now officially a babe magnet for poor chicks.

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Posted By: Bottom of the Ninth

If the "bubble" does burst, it will not be from a lack of funds but a lack of passion or interest in collecting. Many of the newcomer collectors of vintage material, like myself, feel that prices are not that high. Some of us were not smart enough, old enough and therefore fortunate enough to be buying in 1974 when Cobbs and Wagners sold for $12 and if you bought 3 the 4th was free.

ebay has brought many new people to the hobby and exposed collectors to issues they did not know existed. Most who I speak with buy out of a desire to acquire cards and little to no thought is put into what the value of the piece of cardboard will be worth 10 years from now.

From a collector's point of view, the set registry is a joke but I love it as a dealer. When I see common cards from the 50's selling for 3K each, or even $500, I know the unlucky new owner just shot himself in the foot. Prices are obviously dictated by a Population Report that is only going to grow. There will likely never be fewer copies of a card as time goes on. Not sure that losing many of these guys would have any impact on the vintage market.

Greg

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Posted By: barrysloate

Greg- Sounds like you know more of these set registry collectors than I do. Isn't a lot of it just competing with others to prove that your set is better than the theirs? It's 'I drive a cadillac, you drive a chevy, so I'm a better man than you are.' And it's so easy to assess. An 8 is always better than a 7, a 9 is always better than an 8, etc. There isn't even any thought that needs to go into it. Just own more numbers closer to 10 than the other guy. You almost wonder to what degree they care about the card versus what they care about the number. I find it all very amusing, but it is a sport for the superrich only. No mortal collector can compete with a guy spending $500-$1000 for each 1971 Topps common (you can buy the whole set Vg for the price of a few PSA-9 commons). But you're right, if you have the cards and you have the customers, it's a dealer's dream.

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Posted By: warshawlaw

At $500 each? I'd he happy to part with mine...

This whole set registry thing is another version of the never-ending whose yoohoo is bigger controversy. Who cares! I'll take a nice vg-ex T card over a crispy 9 1970s card every time.

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Posted By: Bottom of the Ninth

Barry,

It seems to be nothing but an ego driven exercise with no thought about what the cards are really worth. Highest GPA wins. End of story. Personally I think it is a poor use of money and a guaranteed investment of diminishing returns but most are not in this with the focus of cards being a vehicle for an investment. I am sure on some level they were attracted to collecting for the same reason that most of us collect but they have the luxury of having lots of disposable income.

There is a joke amongst many of the dealers who service these collectors' sets that graded card auction catalogs could really be reduced to 1/5th of their size since the only thing that needs to be pictured is the 1" x 3" top of the holder.

These guys do not collect, they buy. I am sure that for their budgets it is a lot of fun too. Many of these guys make more in a month than most people make in 3 years. So if they buy a 53 Bowman Lockman PSA 8 for $7,800 and then 3 more are released to the wild and it becomes a $3,200 card on the open market, does it really matter?

Greg

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Posted By: barrysloate

Greg,
You are exactly right. It is sport for the rich, like big game hunting or buying exotic sports cars. They are usually the first to burn out, almost always sell for a loss because they have been taken advantage of, and after getting over the initial sting, really don't care because the money will keep flowing in. That is pretty funny that the label is all they care about; I've always said they are buying the number, not the card. Hey, if you're rich I suppose you can buy whatever you please. Jerry Seinfeld recently bought a $30 million home in East Hampton and just tore it down and built a new one. When he was asked why he did it, he replied "I did it because I can." And that's it in a nutshell.

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Posted By: JimB

Spending $7,800 for a common card certainly seems crazy to me, but because somebody can afford and wants to have a super high-grade set does not make them any less of a "collector" than anybody else on this board. Just because they have more money doesn't mean they love the cards less. Though I am not one of the folks that spends thousands on commons, it sounds like there is some petty jealousy here. One can certainly raise ethical questions about people doing more worthwhile things with their money, but that is case regardless of whether the card is worth three figures or five figures.

Where would those of you who are critical of such set registry people come down on someone someone paying 50K for an N172 California league player in ****ty condition?

JimB

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Posted By: Bottom of the Ninth

Jim

I think that you may have misread what I wrote. I am sure that most of the people who are able to spend 7800 on a common do plenty of worthwhile things with their money.

I was not being critical of these collectors but pointing out that the registry has become a pissing contest and that in many instances, maybe not all, it is not the passion of wanting the card that drives these collectors. There is nothing wrong with that either. If someone has the means, more power to them.

In a positive way it has brought many new collectors into the game who just want to try and complete a set or two without respect to having the highest graded examples.

As I stated, I love the guys who are willing to drop thousands on a common card that I paid $8 for plus $10 to grade. How could I possibly be jealous of someone who is willing to allow me the chance to make 100 times my money in a flash?

Greg