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  #1  
Old 05-30-2019, 08:06 AM
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Raymond 'Robbie' Culpepper
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Default Safety at the Ballpark

Until I got to read this article, I didn't realize that a fan actually died after being hit by a foul ball at Dodger Stadium just last year...I sure don't recall seeing a reaction that should have come from such a tragic event.

Maybe now?


http://www.espn.com/mlb/story/_/id/2...tting-too-late
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Last edited by clydepepper; 05-30-2019 at 08:08 AM.
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  #2  
Old 05-30-2019, 08:13 AM
silvor silvor is offline
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I didn't hear about the death last year.

Tragic. That said - foul pole to foul pole? I guess. Eh. How about the outfiled? CJ Cron has been hitting line shots clearing the outfield fence by just a few feet for home runs.
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  #3  
Old 05-30-2019, 10:09 AM
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Default safty at ball parks

While I feel terrible that anyone gets hurt at the parks, it's always, always been "at your own risk" to attend sporting events. The disclaimer used to be on the back of the tickets.

It is the attendees responsibility to be vigilant. And bringing a minor to these events is an adult decision.

So even if they put netting all the way around, will that stop falls from the steps, escalator or parking lot ?

Reasonable safety measures and no more. If you don't want the action of live sporting events, stay at home.
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  #4  
Old 05-30-2019, 10:33 PM
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That's pretty cold, Chuck.

What happened to wanting to just relax and take in a ballgame...

without having to worry about anything...

much less your own personal safety.


REMEMBER, it took this particular event for MOST to us to even be aware of someone who was actually KILLED by a foul ball last year!

THAT is the bigger issue here...our overall callousness!

We should ALL be ashamed of that!

=
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Old 05-30-2019, 11:01 PM
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Sorry Raymond, I agree with Chuck.
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  #6  
Old 05-30-2019, 11:01 PM
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I agree with Chuck.

After they put nets from foul pole to foul pole, are they then going to net above the entire lower deck? I remember Dave Kingman hitting a popup so high it got lost inside an air vent in the Minnesota Metrodome. Had that ball been lofted over the lower deck, considering how high it was, it could have fallen on a fan and hurt them badly.

What would make more sense would be for the stadiums to rent helmets equipped with faceguards to fans who might want one. Charge nothing, but request a refundable $5 to discourage theft, and offer them in all sizes. That way parents could put them on their kids if they choose, and let the rest of us watch the game unobstructed, taking our chances.
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  #7  
Old 05-31-2019, 09:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nolemmings View Post
Sorry Raymond, I agree with Chuck.
+1 I actually laugh when I see people get hit with the ball.
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  #8  
Old 06-01-2019, 02:14 AM
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Most every time I've seen someone hit with a foul ball it is because they weren't paying the least bit of attention. They were looking at their phone (usually) or turned around in their seat talking to someone, or otherwise doing anything but actually watching the game they paid to attend. I hate to see anyone get hurt but the people themselves have to have some accountability in their safety.
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  #9  
Old 06-01-2019, 02:47 AM
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I think little kids should be exempt from this, though. Baseball is way too boring to hold a youngster's attention for 3 hours solid.

I have always brought my glove to every game I go to, unless my tickets are in the outfield. As a kid it was in hopes of catching a ball, as an adult it is more for protection. And if I had a kid (or girlfriend) with me I would put myself between them and home plate, and be paying attention during the pitch. Common sense, isn't it?
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  #10  
Old 06-01-2019, 07:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark17 View Post
I think little kids should be exempt from this, though. Baseball is way too boring to hold a youngster's attention for 3 hours solid.

I have always brought my glove to every game I go to, unless my tickets are in the outfield. As a kid it was in hopes of catching a ball, as an adult it is more for protection. And if I had a kid (or girlfriend) with me I would put myself between them and home plate, and be paying attention during the pitch. Common sense, isn't it?

Mark- unfortunately, common sense is not so common anymore.


-
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"A life is not important except in the impact it has on others lives" - Jackie Robinson


MY BIG CONCERNS ABOUT AMERICA:

Internally- We spend too much time assuring our rights without learning the responsibilities that should accompany them.
Externally - No matter how much we claim to take the higher moral ground, we have neither respected nor attempted to understand other cultures.
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  #11  
Old 06-01-2019, 12:50 PM
Mark17 Mark17 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by clydepepper View Post
Mark- unfortunately, common sense is not so common anymore.


-
True. But covering the world with protective nets can't be the remedy to protect people from themselves.
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  #12  
Old 06-01-2019, 09:02 PM
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A couple of years ago I was at Dodger Stadium seated on the field level, but under the mezzanine overhang, which is quite low at Dodger Stadium and outside the margin of the third base line netting. A line drive foul ball passed two seats to my right and hit a lady square in the face seated three rows behind me, not far from the concourse and the Dodger Dog stand. Under the mezzanine during a night game isn't very bright. I never saw the ball coming, but heard it and I doubt anyone in the immediate area did. She ended up with a handful of teeth and very bloody face. Drinking was not a factor and I was watching the game with my son. Suffice it to say, I would have predicted that the injured lady was in one of the safest seats in the house. You never know, and it could have easily been me or my son.

Am I in favor of the entire playing surface being enclosed in a plexiglass dome? No, but there is a risk involved to attending a live event wherever you are seated and whether or not you are paying attention to the game. Your odds are pretty good of surviving a MLB game, but it is not 100%

The other circumstance that would scare the crap out of mean, would be a hockey puck shot rapidly and deflected by goalie over the glass at 90mph. Those suckers (or should I say puckers) can go quite far into the crowd of darkened spectators and the puck is black. Dodging that bullet is next to impossible. I believe this situation has largely been alleviated with netting above the glass behind the net in most if not all NHL arenas.
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  #13  
Old 06-01-2019, 09:25 PM
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Years ago, my oldest son, who was about 11 years old at the time, brought his glove to a game and caught a high pop foul just inches above his grandfather’s head. I think he saved his life.
On a side note, I think drinking too much beer (and then driving home) as well as eating that lousy ballpark food has probably killed more people than foul balls ever will. Maybe they should put netting between the people and the concession stands.
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  #14  
Old 06-02-2019, 09:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by frankbmd View Post
I never saw the ball coming, but heard it and I doubt anyone in the immediate area did. She ended up with a handful of teeth and very bloody face. Drinking was not a factor and I was watching the game with my son. Suffice it to say, I would have predicted that the injured lady was in one of the safest seats in the house. You never know, and it could have easily been me or my son.

Am I in favor of the entire playing surface being enclosed in a plexiglass dome? No, but there is a risk involved to attending a live event wherever you are seated and whether or not you are paying attention to the game. Your odds are pretty good of surviving a MLB game, but it is not 100%

The other circumstance that would scare the crap out of mean, would be a hockey puck shot rapidly and deflected by goalie over the glass at 90mph. Those suckers (or should I say puckers) can go quite far into the crowd of darkened spectators and the puck is black. Dodging that bullet is next to impossible. I believe this situation has largely been alleviated with netting above the glass behind the net in most if not all NHL arenas.
Well, I think we mostly agree. Of course, reasonable netting needs to be there. But the goal cannot be to protect every single person from any type of injury.

I do not think it logically follows that: Someone suffered an unfortunate accident, therefore it should have somehow been prevented.

I think it's tragic someone died at a ballgame last year. But I will bet that if you looked at all the people who attend MLB games each year, many more die in traffic going to, or from, the game. In other words, people are safer at the game, generally.

Before we start putting nets everywhere, or redesigning every bathtub in America, or lowering all speed limits to 20 miles an hour, I think we should accept the fact that despite reasonable safety measures, accidents will continue to happen, and we all need to deal with that risk wherever we are.
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  #15  
Old 06-02-2019, 11:56 AM
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I guess I can sew up this conversation with a quote:


"If you're not Neo, rely on Lazy-Boy"
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MY BIG CONCERNS ABOUT AMERICA:

Internally- We spend too much time assuring our rights without learning the responsibilities that should accompany them.
Externally - No matter how much we claim to take the higher moral ground, we have neither respected nor attempted to understand other cultures.
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  #16  
Old 06-02-2019, 12:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by frankbmd View Post
A couple of years ago I was at Dodger Stadium seated on the field level, but under the mezzanine overhang, which is quite low at Dodger Stadium and outside the margin of the third base line netting. A line drive foul ball passed two seats to my right and hit a lady square in the face seated three rows behind me, not far from the concourse and the Dodger Dog stand. Under the mezzanine during a night game isn't very bright. I never saw the ball coming, but heard it and I doubt anyone in the immediate area did. She ended up with a handful of teeth and very bloody face. Drinking was not a factor and I was watching the game with my son. Suffice it to say, I would have predicted that the injured lady was in one of the safest seats in the house. You never know, and it could have easily been me or my son.

Am I in favor of the entire playing surface being enclosed in a plexiglass dome? No, but there is a risk involved to attending a live event wherever you are seated and whether or not you are paying attention to the game. Your odds are pretty good of surviving a MLB game, but it is not 100%

The other circumstance that would scare the crap out of mean, would be a hockey puck shot rapidly and deflected by goalie over the glass at 90mph. Those suckers (or should I say puckers) can go quite far into the crowd of darkened spectators and the puck is black. Dodging that bullet is next to impossible. I believe this situation has largely been alleviated with netting above the glass behind the net in most if not all NHL arenas.
Even hockey arenas at the minor league level, at least up here, have netting around the ends boards/corners as well as having the glass higher in those same spots as well. Some of the newer arenas have netting the whole way around, even where people don't sit. Times have changed.
I have attended many hockey games over the years and still, to this day, even with the netting, the safest places at an arena are in the middle sections.
However, years ago while watching the Oshawa Generals and Eric Lindros, this young woman showed up with a very young baby in her arms.
She was seated to the right of center but above the glass about half way up in the stands.
Enough angry people were grumbling/saying things out loud that the young woman had to have heard them. Many, including myself were upset at her for bringing such a young baby to a hockey game, let alone sitting where she was.
Needless to say, sometime during the hockey game, an errant puck went into the stands, but thankfully it hit her and not the baby!! Many, I think mainly out of relieve it was her and not the baby, gave it to her pretty good!
She was cut on the forehead pretty good and likely required stitches? If this puck had of hit the baby, whose head was likely only about 10" away from its mother's head, I would be telling a different story right now.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark17 View Post
Well, I think we mostly agree. Of course, reasonable netting needs to be there. But the goal cannot be to protect every single person from any type of injury.

I do not think it logically follows that: Someone suffered an unfortunate accident, therefore it should have somehow been prevented.

I think it's tragic someone died at a ballgame last year. But I will bet that if you looked at all the people who attend MLB games each year, many more die in traffic going to, or from, the game. In other words, people are safer at the game, generally.

Before we start putting nets everywhere, or redesigning every bathtub in America, or lowering all speed limits to 20 miles an hour, I think we should accept the fact that despite reasonable safety measures, accidents will continue to happen, and we all need to deal with that risk wherever we are.
Comparing those things to a ballgame is not an apple to apple comparison, imo. Those situations, we are in control of for the most part, at a ball diamond, it is a different thing.
I see nothing wrong, at all, with putting netting along both sides of 1st and 3rd.
Times have changed, for the most part, better, imo, so MLB also needs to change as well.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ktwgm1U2ero
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Old 06-02-2019, 02:23 PM
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I'm with Chuck and Mark on this one; MLB attendance was 67.4 million last year. One person out of 67 million dying in a freak accident doesn't mean the parks are unsafe and in need of a drastic change.
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  #18  
Old 06-02-2019, 06:36 PM
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It is sad when tragic things happen.

But... the need for netting to me seems to be a symptom of a broader problem. Somehow it's gone from "The ball might get hit here I should pay attention" or "I got hit by a foul ball because I was staring at my phone"
To
"I got hit by a foul ball, it's anyones fault but mine"

I just see way too much of that everywhere.

I will also temper that with the comment that some extension was a good idea. The 70's net/screen at Fenway was small enough that a foul hit just right could curve around the side and actually hit someone who was behind the screen. I actually saw that in person, and it was another person Rice carried to the trainer, just not one that got TV attention.


That's one weird hockey rink. No stands at all?
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Old 06-03-2019, 08:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by steve B View Post
It is sad when tragic things happen.

But... the need for netting to me seems to be a symptom of a broader problem. Somehow it's gone from "The ball might get hit here I should pay attention" or "I got hit by a foul ball because I was staring at my phone"
To
"I got hit by a foul ball, it's anyones fault but mine"

I just see way too much of that everywhere.

I will also temper that with the comment that some extension was a good idea. The 70's net/screen at Fenway was small enough that a foul hit just right could curve around the side and actually hit someone who was behind the screen. I actually saw that in person, and it was another person Rice carried to the trainer, just not one that got TV attention.


That's one weird hockey rink. No stands at all?
In the second pic where my son is standing with Andrew Shaw, behind them or behind the glass/netting in the pic there are benches. Not very many of them but enough to easily accommodate 40+ people.

This particular arena has 4 pads with the main one or pad 1 having stands. The other 3 are similar to the one in the pic.

No NHL nor OHL games are played here. It is strictly used for House/Church league and Rep hockey games.
Of all the arenas I have been to over the course of 10+ yrs, most arenas are like this unless it is a 1 pad arena, but even then, some don't have stands, just benches like I mentioned.

The Tribute Community Center where the Oshawa Generals play is of course a lot different. It is set up like most NHL type arenas as it is a pay to watch type arena.
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  #20  
Old 06-04-2019, 08:43 AM
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Having the chance to catch a foul ball is a dream of most people who attend games. It's already impossible to sit closer to the field because every usher wants to see a ticket first no matter how few people are sitting in the stadium at all; it's already impossible to get autographs from players the security staff wants to keep as far away from you as possible; so what is left to enjoy at the stadium as a fan who wants to be closer to the game if you make it so catching foul balls are a thing of the past too?

If you fear for your child's safety at baseball games, don't bring your children to them. That's how simple things can be. But people will never accept that. It's the same circular logic that people employ when discussing having infants on an airplane. The person putting everyone out wants to use their child to get to moral high ground but the root issue is that the person thinks their needs (we want to travel, we have a kid, what can we do? want being the operative word) are more important than everyone else's.

Last edited by packs; 06-04-2019 at 08:50 AM.
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Old 06-04-2019, 09:10 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by packs View Post
Having the chance to catch a foul ball is a dream of most people who attend games. It's already impossible to sit closer to the field because every usher wants to see a ticket first no matter how few people are sitting in the stadium at all; it's already impossible to get autographs from players the security staff wants to keep as far away from you as possible; so what is left to enjoy at the stadium as a fan who wants to be closer to the game if you make it so catching foul balls are a thing of the past too?

If you fear for your child's safety at baseball games, don't bring your children to them. That's how simple things can be. But people will never accept that. It's the same circular logic that people employ when discussing having infants on an airplane. The person putting everyone out wants to use their child to get to moral high ground but the root issue is that the person thinks their needs (we want to travel, we have a kid, what can we do? want being the operative word) are more important than everyone else's.


The critical...and I DO mean critical difference is that lot of folks catch foul balls, while very, VERY few catch line drives...not with a glove or their hands anyway.
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MY BIG CONCERNS ABOUT AMERICA:

Internally- We spend too much time assuring our rights without learning the responsibilities that should accompany them.
Externally - No matter how much we claim to take the higher moral ground, we have neither respected nor attempted to understand other cultures.
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Old 06-04-2019, 09:12 AM
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Very few people are injured by foul balls too. I understand it only takes one injury to change a person's life, but that's always been the case. I can't imagine ballparks of the past took safety into consideration during construction like modern parks do but I don't remember being hurt by foul balls being such an issue either.

Last edited by packs; 06-04-2019 at 09:16 AM.
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Old 06-04-2019, 09:37 AM
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Very few people are injured by foul balls too. I understand it only takes one injury to change a person's life, but that's always been the case. I can't imagine ballparks of the past took safety into consideration during construction like modern parks do but I don't remember being hurt by foul balls being such an issue either.


I should have specified 'line-drives' from the beginning.



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"A life is not important except in the impact it has on others lives" - Jackie Robinson


MY BIG CONCERNS ABOUT AMERICA:

Internally- We spend too much time assuring our rights without learning the responsibilities that should accompany them.
Externally - No matter how much we claim to take the higher moral ground, we have neither respected nor attempted to understand other cultures.
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  #24  
Old 06-04-2019, 10:10 AM
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I know that a lot has been speculated on by players and fans about the baseballs being "juiced" to create more home runs, which I personally think is probably true. If that is true, then perhaps going back to the old ball that doesn't travel so fast off the bat would curb this issue the same way a net would.

Last edited by packs; 06-04-2019 at 10:10 AM.
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Old 06-04-2019, 10:20 AM
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I "caught" a foul ball, first one ever, but at the local minor league park.
Then a week or two later, nearly caught one at Fenway. Both make for more positive and amusing stories.

The foul at the minor league park was a pure accident. The whole family wanted stuff from the concessions, and the park has one stand at the far end of the grandstand that has a really short line. I go, get in line, get our food, and as I'm walking towards the condiment wagon, the batter hits a long foul, and it's coming right towards us. The guy ahead of me by about 10 ft sticks out a hand, and deflects the ball right at me. As I stand there with my tray of drinks hot dogs pretzels... I froze, the ball hits my stomach and falls into the tray.
I barely felt it.

A couple weeks later I'm at Fenway, sort of between home and first, but way back where the back row of roof posts are. Sitting just left and behind one post almost obstructed view but not quite. We had a bunch of Yankee fans behind us, not a bad bunch actually. (Most are pretty good, know their baseball, and acknowledge however grudgingly when the other team does something great)
Again after getting some drinks, I'm sitting there, and a foul gets hit towards us. Fouls hardly ever go that far back. Everyone stands of course, so I stand up holding the drink tray that was on my lap. And the thoughts come very quickly as it appears the ball is headed right for me.
Wow, it's coming all the way back here
Uh oh, My hands are full and the darn drinks cost like $10...
If the ball hits me I might get a second foul in a couple weeks!
But if it's head high that's going to hurt..
It could hit the pole, but if I get hit in the head on a bounce it's still going to hurt.
And I'll probably spill the drinks anyway.
darn, it looks that it IS head high and I still haven't figured out how to free a hand..
DUCK!!!

So I did. I think the ball went back into the Yankee fans, but I'm not sure, and none of them were showing the ball around after.
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Old 06-06-2019, 02:53 PM
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Originally Posted by dgo71 View Post
Most every time I've seen someone hit with a foul ball it is because they weren't paying the least bit of attention. They were looking at their phone (usually) or turned around in their seat talking to someone, or otherwise doing anything but actually watching the game they paid to attend. I hate to see anyone get hurt but the people themselves have to have some accountability in their safety.
I stop going to games with some friends or relatives that do this. I get tired of yelling to them to pay attention to the game. Especially because I am the one who chooses where to sit... and meaning I decide which baseline to sit along to determine which will see the most foul balls.

Also there is this thing where people think you can be too old to bring a glove to a game, like they would be embarassed to be seen with one. So most adults do not bring a glove anyways.
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