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-   -   T206 Reference / Reflections.....Tuesday Nite Trivia (http://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=237816)

53toppscollector 10-03-2021 05:35 PM

I know PSA won't do it, but Nat Turner, if you are reading this thread, you should offer anyone who holds a PSA T206 that isn't labeled properly, either with a mislabel like that, or the generic "Sovereign" instead of Sovereign 150/350/460 etc to re-submit the slab and have it re-holdered and re-labeled correctly, with the pop count updated accordingly, for free.

tedzan 10-04-2021 08:26 AM

Interesting similarities between T206 Doyle Nat'L and T207 Hoff
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Pat R (Post 2150492)
[/B]


I found it and it turns out it's another PSA label error.

Attachment 481423


Excellent research.

No further comment, necessary.


TED Z

T206 REFERENCE....convenient access to T206 checklists
.

tedzan 10-04-2021 06:02 PM

Interesting similarities between T206 Doyle Nat'L and T207 Hoff
 
* * * * * * * * * * * * * T206 Reference, Theory's, Surveys, etc. * * * * * * * * * * * *

https://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...onSGC40xxx.jpghttps://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...eetCap11xx.jpghttps://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...eign460x12.jpghttp://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...raphicbldg.jpghttps://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...vereign12x.jpghttp://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...edHINDUx12.jpghttps://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...bbBat12xzz.jpg
...... Piedmont ...... Sweet Caporal ..... Polar Bear_____The "House" that created these Tobacco cards_____Sovereign ........... Hindu ........ American Beauty



The Joe Doyle card was printed with 7 different T-brands (listed below). Displayed here are the Joe Doyle cards from my three T206 sets.

https://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...nt350SGC40.jpghttps://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...esovereign.jpghttps://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...joedoylesc.jpg
https://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...t350SGC40b.jpg-----https://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...ereign50xb.jpg-------https://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...joedoylesc.jpg


The Joe Doyle card is most available with the PIEDMONT and SWEET CAPORAL brands. Followed, by these brands....listed in order of availability......

POLAR BEAR
SOVEREIGN
OLD MILL
TOLSTOI
EL PRINCIPE de GALES


TED Z

T206 REFERENCE....convenient access to T206 checklists
.

sreader3 10-04-2021 07:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pat R (Post 2149862)
Ted I'm not sure why you're asking me about someone else's list but some research indicates the following cards in question were at some point confirmed by the following people....

Bergen (catching) Piedmont factory 42
Anonymous
Ted Z
Brian W


Murry (portrait) Piedmont factory 42
Dave Wipple
Ted Z
Scot R


Overall (hands at waist) Piedmont factory 42
Ted Z
Scot R

Chance (batting) Piedmont factory 42
Had your initials on Bill Browns super set spreadsheet

Well since my name was mentioned I might as well respond. While I did conduct large surveys back in the day, it is possible that whatever Murray and/or Overall P42 “confirmation” data I may have published came from reports by advanced collectors with whom I was in touch. It is also possible that these data points resulted from ebay listings with incorrect PSA flips or back scans, which happened from time to time.

tedzan 10-05-2021 12:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sreader3 (Post 2150879)
Well since my name was mentioned I might as well respond. While I did conduct large surveys back in the day, it is possible that whatever Murray and/or Overall P42 “confirmation” data I may have published came from reports by advanced collectors with whom I was in touch. It is also possible that these data points resulted from ebay listings with incorrect PSA flips or back scans, which happened from time to time.


Hi Scot

The Murray and the Overall mistakes are not your fault. One of the first threads regarding PIEDMONT #42 cards dates back to December 2006.
https://www.net54baseball.com/showth...3456&highlight

Brian Weisner posted this list of his P#42 cards.....

Hi Ted,
Here is the list of my 42's:

BAKERTHROW
COBBBAT OFF
COBBBAT OFF
CRAWFORDBAT
KLEINOWBOSTON
KONETCHYGL LOW
LATHAMPOR
LATHAMNY NAT
MANNINGPITCH
MATHEWSONDARK
MATHEWSONDCAP
MCINTYREBR&CH
OVERALLTHROW
PELTYVERT
SWEENEYTHROW
SEYMOURTHROW
SMITHCHI&BOS
SNODGRASSCATCH
WAGNERRIGHT
WHITECHI

However, this Overall card was inputted into the Super-Set spreadsheet as the 460-only series version of Overall (Hands at Waist).
It should have been entered in as the "Hand at Face" (350/460 series) version.

Your 2005 - 2006 publication of "Inside T206" inspired many of us Net54ers to seriously explore the complexities of the T206 set.
Resulting in discoveries, such, as the...Elite 11.....Exclusive 12.....Mutually-Exclusive 350/460 Series.....Red-Ink Twins....etc., etc.
Which provided us clearer understanding of how these cards were printed. Thereby informing us of valid T206 front/back combos.


Take care my good friend,

TED Z
.

sreader3 10-05-2021 08:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tedzan (Post 2151034)
Hi Scot

The Murray and the Overall mistakes are not your fault. One of the first threads regarding PIEDMONT #42 cards dates back to December 2006.
https://www.net54baseball.com/showth...3456&highlight

Brian Weisner posted this list of his P#42 cards.....

Hi Ted,
Here is the list of my 42's:

BAKERTHROW
COBBBAT OFF
COBBBAT OFF
CRAWFORDBAT
KLEINOWBOSTON
KONETCHYGL LOW
LATHAMPOR
LATHAMNY NAT
MANNINGPITCH
MATHEWSONDARK
MATHEWSONDCAP
MCINTYREBR&CH
OVERALLTHROW
PELTYVERT
SWEENEYTHROW
SEYMOURTHROW
SMITHCHI&BOS
SNODGRASSCATCH
WAGNERRIGHT
WHITECHI

However, this Overall card was inputted into the Super-Set spreadsheet as the 460-only series version of Overall (Hands at Waist).
It should have been entered in as the "Hand at Face" (350/460 series) version.

Your 2005 - 2006 publication of "Inside T206" inspired many of us Net54ers to seriously explore the complexities of the T206 set.
Resulting in discoveries, such, as the...Elite 11.....Exclusive 12.....Mutually-Exclusive 350/460 Series.....Red-Ink Twins....etc., etc.
Which provided us clearer understanding of how these cards were printed. Thereby informing us of valid T206 front/back combos.


Take care my good friend,

TED Z
.

Hi Ted. Thanks for your kind words. You and I know better than anyone that 2006 was the Dark Ages of T206. The best one can hope for is to advance a project striving for perfection but knowing he (or she) will fall short. Take care my friend.

sreader3 10-05-2021 08:54 PM

If anyone cares to understand the T206 landscape as of 2009, which is not all that dissimilar from today's landscape, see:

https://oldcardboard.com/t/t206/Insi...al-edition.pdf

Some fun history, anecdotes and theories.

Pat R 10-06-2021 02:19 PM

My post wasn't a criticism towards Scot or anyone else, I was just pointing out that Bergen, Murray, and Overall hands at waist were previously confirmed on other lists too and they were still on Ted's list until Adam questioned them in 2016.

Quote:

Originally Posted by tedzan (Post 831131)
The Bergen (catching) PIEDMONT factory 42 card has been confirmed.

The grand total is now 75 (out of 109) cards with PIEDMONT factory 42 backs that have been confirmed.
<img src="http://i529.photobucket.com/albums/dd339/tz1234zaz/bp46042.jpg" alt="[linked image]">
PIEDMONT 460 Factory #42 confirmed list............

350/460 Series......63 cards

Ames (hands over head)
Baker
Bender (no trees)
Berger
Bradley (bat)
M. Brown (Chicago)
Burch (fielding)
Chance (yellow portrait)
Chase (blue portrait)
Chase (dark cap)
Cobb (red portrait)
Cobb (bat off shoulder)
Conroy (bat)
Davis (A's)
Crawford (bat)
Donlin (bat)
Doolan (bat)
Dougherty (arm in air)
Downey (bat)
Larry Doyle (bat)

Elberfeld (Washington-fielding)
Evers (bat-yellow sky)
Griffith (bat)
Jennings (one hand)
Jennings (both hands)
Johnson (pitching)
Jordan (bat)
Joss (pitching)
Kleinow (Boston)
Konetchy (glove low)
Lajoie (bat)
Lake (no ball)
Leach (cap)
Leifield (bat)
Magee (bat)
Manning (pitching)
Mathewson (dark cap)
McIntyre (Brooklyn & Chicago)
McQuillan (bat)
Mullin (bat)

Murphy (bat)
O'Leary (hands on knees)
Overall (yellow sky)
Pelty (vertical)
Pfeister (throwing)
Reulbach (no glove)
Rucker (throwing)
Seymour (throwing)
F. Smith (Chicago & Boston)
Snodgrass (catching)
Stahl (glove)
Steinfeldt (bat)
Street (catching)
Sweeney (fielding)
Tinker (bat off shoulder)
Wagner (bat on right)
White (pitching)
Wilhelm (bat)
Willetts
Willis (bat)

Willis (throwing)
Wiltse (throwing)
CYoung (glove)



460-only Series......12 cards

Bergen (catching)
Chase (Trophy)
Latham
Marquard (follow thru)
Merkle (throwing)
Murray (portrait)
Overall (blue sky)
Schlei (portrait)
Schlei (batting)
Schaefer (Washington)
Seymour (portrait)
Wiltse (portrait-cap)


This 460-only Series card has been reported but not 100% confirmed......

Chance (bat)


Any new PIEDMONT 460 Factory #42 inputs are greatly appreciated.


Thanks to all who have contributed to this T206 survey.

TED Z

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gradedcardman (Post 1521887)
Ted,

I would like to see scans of the following confirmed Piedmont 42's:

Bergen Catching
Murray Portrait
Overall Yellow Sky

I have been researching and looking for proof of these cards existing and have had no luck. With them confirmed via both yourself and T206 resource I would have to believe their are scans somewhere.

If so then I need to add these to my needed for completion list.

Thanks in advance !!!


tedzan 10-06-2021 04:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pat R (Post 2151429)
My post wasn't a criticism towards Scot or anyone else, I was just pointing out that Bergen, Murray, and Overall hands at waist were previously confirmed on other lists too and they were still on Ted's list until Adam questioned them in 2016.


Hey Pat

You are constantly "obsessed" with trying to prove me wrong. And, once again you have failed.

I shared P#42 cards (trading and/or selling them to Adam), and knowledge of them with Adam Goldenberg circa 2014 - 2017....in order to help him put his P#42 run together.

So, what the hell are you talking about ! ?


Here is one of my posts which contradicts your "bull-crap". Note the DATE.

Posted 7-9-2015
Quote:

Originally Posted by tedzan (Post 1429337)
With the recent discovery of Tinker (bat off shoulder) the confirmed total now is 72 subjects with the PIEDMONT 460, factory #42 back.


http://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...tomline50x.jpg

PIEDMONT 460 Factory #42 confirmed list............

350/460 Series......63 subjects (complete)

Ames (hands over head)
Baker
Bender (no trees)
Berger
Bradley (bat)
M. Brown (Chicago)
Burch (fielding)
Chance (yellow portrait)
Chase (blue portrait)
Chase (dark cap)
Cobb (red portrait)
Cobb (bat off shoulder)
Conroy (bat)
Davis (A's)
Crawford (bat)
Donlin (bat)
Doolan (bat)
Dougherty (arm in air)
Downey (bat)
Larry Doyle (bat)

Elberfeld (Washington-fielding)
Evers (bat-yellow sky)
Griffith (bat)
Jennings (one hand)
Jennings (both hands)
Johnson (pitching)
Jordan (bat)
Joss (pitching)
Kleinow (Boston)
Konetchy (glove low)
Lajoie (bat)
Lake (no ball)
Leach (cap)
Leifield (bat)
Magee (bat)
Manning (pitching)
Mathewson (dark cap)
McIntyre (Brooklyn & Chicago)
McQuillan (bat)
Mullin (bat)

Murphy (bat)
O'Leary (hands on knees)
Overall (yellow sky)
Pelty (vertical)
Pfeister (throwing)
Reulbach (no glove)
Rucker (throwing)
Seymour (throwing)
F. Smith (Chicago & Boston)
Snodgrass (catching)
Stahl (glove)
Steinfeldt (bat)
Street (catching)
Sweeney (fielding)
Tinker (bat off shoulder)
Wagner (bat on right)
White (pitching)
Wilhelm (bat)
Willetts
Willis (bat)

Willis (throwing)
Wiltse (throwing)
CYoung (glove)



460-only Series......9 subjects

Chase (Trophy)
Latham
Marquard (follow thru)
Merkle (throwing)
Schlei (portrait)
Schlei (batting)
Schaefer (Washington)
Seymour (portrait)
Wiltse (portrait-cap)


Other Net54 sources claim that the following 4 subjects are confirmed.

Chance (batting)
Bergen (catching)
Murray (portrait)
Overall (blue sky)

My research indicates that these 4 subjects are PIEDMONT 460, factory #42 No-Prints.



TED Z
.


Pat R 10-06-2021 04:36 PM

Ted 7-9-2015 is when you posted the original list but you edited it several times until 9-21-2017. If you click on the blue arrow in Adams post that I quoted in my post you will see that his post was on 4-9-2016
asking about those three that were on your list.


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