My issue with Maestro stems from an unsuccessful attempt at renting a house in Tuscany

Blondie did a clever little number called "Love at the Pier", but I doubt that's the one you're looking for? :confused:

4th of July (Sandy)

Nice. My problem involved being forced to hold a note until it caused the roof of the opera hall to cave in, maiming me. There is video of the incident.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R4AOKEjbPgA

Dammit, I should have gotten that one right away. Huge Springsteen fan.

And another? Clue -- 60s.

Sadly, yes. The card doctors have been found to be "quality" by many.

Man You Make a Couple Spelling mistakes and you get destroyed oh well I’m a easy target I suppose.

Hope y’all enjoyed the laughs at my disposal.

Beach Boys of course . . . Surfin' Safari

Damn I missed that one myself. Still have another in mind.

Pretty sure it's in Surfin' Safari

Already named above.

I need to refresh threads before I answer lol.

How about Up the Pool by Tull?

I hear you and don't disagree when it comes to supporting tpg's and auction houses found party to fraud. My collection suffers because I don't pay premiums for graded cards, or bid in most auctions(including many on ebay). Graded cards rarely make it 30 minutes in my possession before being busted. But, passion isn't normally accompanied by complacency. If my Marines and Sailors weren't bitching then something was wrong.

Don't know that one. Still looking for a late 60s song by a major British group.

There's been reported fraud in the hobby since 1971, but the key to thwarting it is to be educated to know when it's happening and report on it.

Randy Newman, Linda, was 1968, but he is not a British group, so it can't be that one. Bob Geldof, Walking Back to Happiness is another I saw. I ran the word "pier" through a song list website and came up with hundreds of returns. I think My Morning Jacket has a song about a pier, but that's a newer band from the South.

Moody Blues Legend of a Mind 1968. If that ain't it I quit lol. (and I had to look this one up even though I'm a huge Moody Blues fan)

Yes.
Signing of Timothy Leary: the little man who sells you thrills along the pier.

Great and different song, brilliant flute solo.

Corrected for those who find joy in pointing out other people's mistakes. :)

"Fraud" in the hobby has been around as long as there has been a hobby, I hate to tell you. It's just got a lot more light on it now because we have graders and dealers and auction houses who can stand to benefit tremendously more from the fraud, and the technology / scans / wherewithal to detect 1/16 of an inch or less of perfect trimming, recoloring, bleaching, soaking, what have you. We also perhaps more importantly have the technology to share and disseminate the details of this fraud en masse quickly. Is this bad? Sure. But did certain unscrupulous people also do similar, if much cruder card doctoring in 1968? 1975? 1982? 1990? Of course they did. It simply did not get a ton of light on it due to the way the hobby worked and communicated at the time. Even so, one could argue this was the impetus for the birth of professional grading. But I digress.

Bottom line, are you happy with your cards? Do you know enough about them to detect the red flags of what may be a basic doctoring job? Then don't buy those cards. I've been doing this for 35 years and most of the vintage (my main focus as a kid...) that I had then was beat up to begin with. I will admit to liking nice, properly slabbed midgrade cards, but if too many of those become ripe with suspicion over alteration, then it's no problem for me to go back to buying lower grade raw cards (for cheaper...) that I don't suspect of having been altered. Just speaking personally, it would take things getting a lot worse than they have been over the previous 3-5 years with the scandals for me to get that much more disgusted with the hobby to where I would consider leaving entirely. But each unto their own.

Peter, not quite a*pier, but I struck upon that 50's classic by the Drifters, "Under the Boardwalk."

Well said. I don't stress over baseball card collecting. But then again it's a hobby for me and not tied to financial gains or retirement. It all started with my love of baseball and continues to be tied to that. I also don't let politics ruin my love for the game.

Thanks. Ugh, I see I cannot type or spell today.

Its actually from 1964 although most think it's from the doo wop 50s.

LOL. Don't worry the grammar police will let you know.

Terrific post.

Well said Mark.

I get that.

Maybe my post wasn't particularly well worded. What I find odd is how many of the people who rail about fraud in the hobby aren't actually railing against the fraudsters, but railing against other collectors who in their minds are too happy and aren't sufficiently outraged. Saying basically "because of collectors like you guys buying the stuff you're buying fraud is flourishing. . . .you should be more pissed off like I am."

The most obvious example is anytime someone posts about buying from PWCC 3 people immediately post about how PWCC is all about fraud bidding and how basically if you purchase cards from that company you are somehow complacent in all sorts of horrors.

Maybe too fine a point, but that's what I was trying to understand.

Well Steve, aren't they? If you support a company that does business the wrong way then you are giving the most important stamp of approval you can, your dollars, that keep them in business.

I'm just not that concerned with what other collectors do. Yes, I avoid companies that I don't think are ethical. But if someone else makes a different call I don't think it's my place to chastise them.

I vent at AHs all the time. I don't want to be in the business of venting at other collectors. The problem is the criminals, not their customers.

Yeah I think we're on the same page. I don't understand doing business with creeps and crooks so I don't do it. While I don't understand anyone who continues to do business with them I don't think I actively harangue them about it, just in my head lol, Although if someone who is still doing business with a crook then complains about the crooks in the hobby I might be disinclined to bite my tongue.

We all need to help root out fraud in the hobby. A few days ago a longtime member got shown the door as he completely reneged on a large item at a major auction house. He was still doing business on our BST daily. When I caught wind of it, in my estimation, he was no longer a good risk here. I had pm'd him and he was back on the board, 2x, but never answered the pm concerning the situation. Of course he followed up his banishment with the obligatory derogatory email.

To reply to the original question, I also don't understand folks who bitch and complain, yet stay in the hobby. The answer has to be money, doesn't it?


Every thread needs a random card.

https://luckeycards.com/pe222awa.jpg
.

Leon

A thankless task, for which I thank you!

Bob

+1