Don’t think much has changed in the last 7 months.

Other than one of my key graded cards being outed as doctored. So I guess there’s that for me, which doesn’t make me eager to buy more high graded stuff.

It seems like there is more of aa transition in viewing collectibles as an investment and along with that comes a positive correlation with buying graded cards only. I have come across buyers that actively buy PSA 10 cards only as an investment.

^^^^ this! ^^^^

Yes, graded cards are the future of vintage, at least the worthy HOF cards. It will become harder and harder to find raw vintage HOF cards in the future, especially pre-war vintage.

Guess I better hold on to mine then :)

graded cards - pro or con
 

I personally liked raw cards and that's all I ever collected. However the sad fact is buyers pay a decent premium for a graded card. Since a majority of cards are bought on the internet, graded cards become important because you cant hold and see them in person PLUS sellers can color enhance cards. Now I would NEVER buy pre-war cards or strips ungraded - they are counterfeited often and there are WAY more variations compared to 60s Topps cards and inserts. Also with pre-war cards, especially strips, they are often flimsy and tobacco cards can be brittle so having them encased protects them. They are so expensive - encasing them works for me.

Now my biggest gripe of them all is the inconsistency of all grading companies - furthermore compare, PSA and SGC. Take the same card that would grade ex/mt but has a modest mark on the back. PSA would grade it Ex/Mt 6 (MK) while SGC would grade the card Vg/Ex+ 4.5.... My last gripe especially with pre-war strips - a card graded A could be a pitiful looking card OR a card that was cut a millimeter short but has amazing eye appeal. Same goes for Poor 1 - I have seen cards graded 1 that look pretty good but a modest crease or 2 and some paper loss with rounded corners and others that are hard to look at without cringing. Expand the lower grades - Do we need 5 grades with the word mint in it. Ex/Mt 6 to Gem Mt 10 -

MY VENTING IS OVER -

I was one of the only dealers there with raw vintage cards. i will have a ton of raw vintage sports and non-sports at the Pasadena show January 27-28 and at the Ontario show (the Burbank show) over Presidents' weekend in February. And of course at the Labor Day Burbank show in Anaheim.

I just saw someone posted on Facebook that there are a Ton of fake graded cards circulating in the hobby. What are your thoughts on the number of fake graded cards circulating in the hobby?

Do they mean fake?

Or do they mean authentic but altered?

I suspect the number of outright fakes is low. Not that there aren't some, but certainly not a meaningful fraction.

But there are some around here who will tell you that there are a high number of altered cards running around in slabs , at least when it comes to high grade vintage.

Having said that, from time to time you do hear about some goons running around with their own slabbing machine and putting fake slabs together. Or a similar situation is goons who do a crack and replace with a reseal of the slab. Still a real card usually, but much lower grade after they replace the real card with a low grade version and reseal. Those situations have the potential to be a bigger deal, particularly for an unwary buyer who just assumes that if it’s in a slab, it must be good.

The post I read was referring to actual fake slabs (not altered cards)

So fake slabs, not fake cards residing in real slabs.

Not sure how widespread that is. You hear about rings from time to time that are running slab counterfeiting operations. But it’s not clear to me how many get out into the wild, and how many include vintage cards rather than modern shiny stuff.

Either way it looks like graded cards are here to stay.

Of course. Graded cards have been around for more than 30 years now.

I have been finding it pretty easy to buy raw vintage at shows lately. I target two types of sellers, those with all the new shiny stuff graded with their vintage in a box that they have no interest in and those vintage sellers with high graded slabs that turn their noses up at their own ungraded (likely 1's to 4's) vintage that aren't going to make them a mint. Bundle and save!

Oh wise guy eh!!

No, really I was not trying to be.

What I said was obvious perhaps, but if I'm a wise guy, then you are a guy who keeps bumping a fairly dead thread on a subject where new situational news or additional context is probably going to be scant.

Yes, graded cards are here to stay. But there are plenty of people who collect raw vintage, as they have for years without really seeing the need for grading. I believe that both approaches are here to stay.

For me, a bottom feeder who has divested 99 percent of his stuff and without anything that expensive, no need to grade.

For many of us, grading is not relevant as with those nice but not great 52s posted.

However, if I had anything expensive and/or super popular, it would be graded for two reasons

1) Insurance in case something happens

2) Easier for heirs to sell when the ultimate happens

Regards
Rich

Two good reasons Rich !

Excellent points! Seems like graded is everywhere at cards shows nowadays! ( based on what photos I see in social media)

Don't look now but about four months later....

Staggers the imagination…


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Very good points Rich. The 2nd point is the main reason I'm moving all of my modern into vintage graded. I'm getting older (will be 50 in July), so it's time to start thinking about what's going to happen when I'm gone.

I've only got a handful of graded cards, maybe 25 or so. But they're fun. And I know if I'm ever in a pinch or need money (lose job, have car emergency whatever, then I can sell those and raise money quickly because it's so much easier to move graded over non-graded).