+1

The PSA 4 in Goldin auction is over 5k already. Guess Cobb is catching the Mantle fever :D

pete g has a nice 55 on ebay right now for a seemingly good price...swarm swarm!!!!!!

Leon, first you'd have to promise not to ban me no matter what I say, under any circumstance. I don't want to end up like Rob Dewolf or Wonka (who is still banned while a host of miscreants on Net 54 are members in good standing).

Care to answer you defending card doctors while you go after them on the board? And what about the diversions to take the heat off of your client who submitted cards that were fake for grading? And how about your client with the fake Magies..... I am sure you are doing it all for the good of the hobby, right?

I know it's not easy to actually debate someone out here when you don't have the ability to ban them. But this is Net 54 and not the real world, so you get to decide who stays and who goes, thus determining how the debates go as well. I'll discuss anything you want to discuss within attorney ethics rules -- as long as you promise not to ban me, no matter what comes out.

Just answer the questions....

Jeff I would not take this as a promise to not ban. :D

http://i1.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/...22/491/BTM.jpg

Tom C

Here I am, the "real possible buyer".... If you actually have some "high grade, nicely centered cards", feel free to contact me with scans and prices and I will evaluate the opportunity. If not, please refrain from attempting to act like blowhard on some online forum.

I won these auctions because I wanted them more than anyone else. I don't shill, I buy cards at prices that I feel are appropriate, whether you do or not. I have collected for years and purchased cards from multiple sources including ebay, Memory Lane, Heritage, Greg Bussineau. I have bid at Mile High and SCP as well.

If any of you have a problem with the way I bid or who I choose to bid with, too bad. I deal with people I trust and Brent/PWCC Auctions is one of them.

My email is jcornett@liquidity-partners.com.

** BTW, the reason my account has bid retractions was over a heavy disagreement with a seller I was bidding with. My confidence in their service was affected so I canceled my bids with them to protect myself. The seller later apologized, and I later won all the cards that I bid on in which the bids were retracted.

Nice response and thanks for the quick phone call just now. As I said, and you are very cool with, your name needs to be out here in this kind of post....per the rules. So it is Jus.tin C0rn.ett....thanks man!!

Justin, are you the one who bid up that T206 Home Run Baker card to $6k?

Because if so,you may be getting some of those opportunities that you mentioned. :D

And also, welcome to the board. :)

I like this statement and all, but PWCC doesn't own any of the cards they sell. They are merely a broker. Subject to whatever whims the consignor has on his items. But hey, as long as you are happy.....

yep, that was unfortunate. you live and learn i guess

but i will also say that i wasnt the only one that wanted the card... i was just willing to pay a little more than the under bidder

yeah psa 4's and above are hot for the green cobb.

Its Christys, not Cy Young...I have no idea what Cy Young you are talking about..


.i do remember you netting less than you were asking for them on net54 (and to me )when all said and done actually..so you were highballing the cards .....if you want to talk facts..


It looks like I was wrong as far as not making an offer on one of the cards , I did offer 400 + paypal fees on the Christy Mathewson portrait but I said to send it to PWCC and I would offer more because of ebay bucks and incentives I didn't get with a direct deal..i don't think that's a 'lowball offer when I am within 10% of the net price to the seller after fees on a card going for 500 or less....if it is then I guess you call it highballing if the seller wants 10% more direct than what the seller nets at auction...or on the other card he had for sale in which he wanted 20% more than what he got on the card in net after the auction.



Part of the disagreement in price was that bobby said that SGC grades command a premium over PSA in prewar !

"I usually like PSA prices. For T206's though, SGC is king. They usually command higher prices"

First we are talking about Christy's not Cy Young...not sure what you are talking about for the young.

haha and the fact you tried to sell them for weeks and weeks on net54 and kept saying would send them to auction ..and I kept asking you to make good on sending them to auction......so maybe I was the reason finally sent them to auction because was turning into a red lennox cobb..week after week....thank you for finally sending them....though you did get less net than you asked on net54, . and you do agree they were not shilled....



this is how all the cards you said did with PWCC including the mathewsons...funny no comments about saying got a ton on those cards or saying I made a low offer or anything....just this..

"Some of my stuff did OK...got killed on a couple....I think I can do just as good as he on minor stuff....still will use him for sets and Canadian cards (since I don't wish to ship international)"



I found the thread-- he said he was sending to consignment and 2 weeks later he still there with ttts.....he says had them priced at VCP so I guess everyone was lowballing him..... yeah IM the reason he consigned them.. lol..

http://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=197853

after price reductions..he asked 800 for the black hat and got less at auction 740 minus 13.5% in fees ($640)

http://www.pwccauctions.com/item.php?item_no=1064344

and for the portrait after price reductions he asked for 500 and got 510 minus 13.5% in fees ($442)

Looks like PWCC wasn't shilled there even though I assume many bidders there have 70% with PWCC but I didn't check..

Justin, welcome to the board and way to go to keep the card market red hot! Blue chip cards will always demand a premium, and there are many of them still way undervalued! I took heat and then had to read about (SCD weekly newspaper) how I over paid on a Joe Dimaggio zeenut with coupon when I won it for 12k and at thetime it booked for 2k. Well, price guides changed and should I say the guides caught up with actual market prices. When I sold the card it went through a live auction where it fetched way more than what I had paid.

Seems like we read the samething everytime a T206 Wagner sells. Has anyone ever lost money selling one of those??????

I agree with you Justin that PWCC is a good place to dealwith. Its refreshing to still see a trueauction through Ebay as now its mainly BIN with make an offer listings. PWCC follows all the Ebay rules and it seems that arguements made against them should be more withthe Ebay system.

If I was Brent I would ban anyone who retracts a bid more than once unless they have a good excuse and they conmunicate with them. They should look at every bidder on a per case basis. Plus, PWCC should ban any wiseguy, or should I say problem person as that should shut them up. I think many people don't always "practice" what they preach! They talk bad about you, and yet they bid in your auction...call their bluff and ban them if their facts don't add up!

Wish I still had my PSA 6...:(

Just like any other auction house where a consignor might call a friend and have his friend bid on an item for him? It is risky to do that, but perfectly legal. As long as the person who wins the item pays for the item in full including auction house fees, it is legal. Risky, but legal.

Why do you believe that it matters or not to buyers if PWCC sells their own private items or if they represent the owners of the cards and charge a fee for their service? Just because PWCC has chosen broker sports cards on ebay and you has a loyal group of buyers does not make them less legitimate. I can assure you Memory Lane, Heritage, SCP and other auction houses have loyal followings as well.

Personally, I use PWCC almost exclusively to purchase items on ebay because I buy all sorts of cards from all sorts of sports and am a busy person. I do not want to spend hours upon hours searching ebay listings looking for items that might or might not be a fit for my collection. I find it very easy to type in PWCC into ebay search and sort what I might be interested in that day. Its very simple and easy for a collector like me to find items this way as compared to searching online forums or contacting friends, past acquaintances or other auction houses who might or might not have what I am looking for at the time.

Any speculation as to what my motives are or why I use certain sellers more than others is pure conjecture and quite frankly a waste of everyone's time. If I am willing to pay more than you, I will win, period. If am am not the highest bidder, I won't win. It is real simple. Some of the folks here that are alleging shilling and bid retractions have not a clue what the 'real story' is are likely just pissed because they don't have a green cobb now and want one at a below market price. But of course, that speculation is conjecture on my part and really doesn't hold any weight.

So yes "as long as I am happy" I will use whoever I want to buy or sell items for me. It saddens me to think that Brent or my reputation is at question here when in reality, it could not be farther from the truth. Collecting cardboard is supposed to be fun...

I do not see any further need to justify my actions here on this board, but some of the folks just need to grow up and worry about their own issues. Stop trying to create conspiracy theories to explain random market fluctuations and record prices. The real reason prices are going up is there are buyers that are willing to pay more for cards than have been paid in the past. When the buyers are outnumbered by the sellers, prices will go down. Its called a 'market' and it is quite simple.

Questioning you was never my intent, and I am sorry that you took it that way. Was merely speculating along with others on the various pricing jumps of cards. You explained it beautifully, however, whenever someone sees a card that "normally" sells for $2,000 all of the sudden sell for $6,000+, it naturally raises eyebrows. That is all - don't take it to heart. In fact, in would be unnatural to NOT question a card that has a set price range all of the sudden go for triple above that figure.

I read all of that above me, checked the bid history on the Baker, saw where you got taken behind the woodshed, and put my head in hand.

Jeeze Rob everyone's on a witch hunt today. You seem to be the prime suspect. Not sure why................(Serious).

Comes with the territory. I guess people don't like to be questioned/confronted?? I have no clue...

It seems as though we've all been there. I know I have although I'm sure you've been on the block longer. Best thing to do now is to just let them have their fun and not respond.

that would be a nice card to see..



to the OPs...when faced with facts its hard to respond...

Always love Jeff's input, saying exactly what he thinks. I don't know about shill bidding in the PWCC auctions, but that's where I recently got my '39 V351 Ted Williams rookie for less than half of my max bid, so PWCC certainly doesn't see the max bids.

May collecting bring you joy and keep you safe from the triple sss's out there (scammers, schemers and skunks),

Larry

+1 there. Centering is increasing in importance due to its effect on eye appeal at an astonishing rate, plus its awfully hard from the scan to see why the card didn't grade at least ExMt. Time will prove its value, and not to much of the former at that.

Best to all,

Larry

As was said in a remake of the song, "What the World Needs Now" in the '70's,

"I think it's when somebody's sick."

Larry

And I thought I was articulate. Leon just said it better than I ever could!

Highest regards,

Larry

Um, you were actually the OP.

And yeah, it's good that one of the odd PWCC bidding situations was cleared up. Problem is there are plenty more and a suspicious track record. Certainly because one bidder claims his purchases were legitimate (and I have no reason to suspect otherwise) does not mean that all the bizarre doings at PWCC are entirely legit. I would like to think that we've learned something in the past ten years of card collecting history.

+1 there also. My two experiences with PWCC have been excellent, and the maturation of the hobby--basically attracting what I call the "big boys" to whom spending $16,000+ is like my spending $500--has been greatly accelerated, I believe, by the internet. We're simply catching up to where rare and significant coins and cars are in far less time.

Go ahead and post, Brent--we're certainly not all opposed to PWCC. Personally I enjoyed meeting and talking with you at the National.

Sincerely,

Larry

Why is Wonka banned? I could understand his posts.

Hello Justin. Well, nobody's called you out yet so I'll be the first. 18 bid retractions in 6 months? So your saying all with one seller? and none with PWCC?

An issue that has been raised in this thread is bidding at the top end of an auction to find the underbidders max bid; then retracting to expose the underbidder as the winner. -***o ebay username has been exposed as someone doing this multiple times, but NOT on PWCC auctions (just to be clear). I'm assuming this is not the type of retraction you have?

I also do a majority of my bidding with PWCC, and Brent is aware of my disgust with retractors. I'm confident he has a sound policy to address these issues with e-bay's support.

I had one retraction with the PSA 8 53 mantle at Pwcc a few months ago where I made a mistake and retracted the bid. I then came in and rebid correctly like an appropriate person should do.

The other retractions were with two sellers specifically, one had 15 and one had 2. The one where I retracted 15 bids I ended up winning all the auctions on some 86 fleer psa10s. The user for the other two retractions were because I bid on the items and didn't pay attention to who the seller was. The seller had screwed me over on a deal and I refuse to do business with him.

I can definitely see the benefit in retractions to discover max bids, but it does not at all preclude you from losing to someone using a snipping service.

There are actually some honest people out there that retract for reasons other than intentional manipulation. Whether it be inexperience or ignorance, it needs to be policed and watched, but if you guys don't want someone to see your max bid, don't put one in. Wait till the end and use your snipping services. Don't try to blame retractors, look in the mirror and blame yourself.

Have a great evening.

Lastly, if the prices I paid were so crazy high for everything, why haven't multiple high quality home run baker t206 cards showed up on eBay ? Why haven't any more high quality PSA green Cobb's surfaced yet as available? Why haven't all those folks with the top notch PSA 8 mantles put them up for auction if these prices really are crazy??

I can tell you why... Because people don't want to sell. Until they do, prices will keep going up... It amazes me that people don't understand that, but that's fine by me because I get to enjoy these cards and make money at the same time while some folks that like to complain and conspire on message boards will be left with nothing but their incorrect assumptions about guys like me.

Welcome to America !

Or blame ebay for creating (and continuing to refine) a playground for the ill-intentioned.
Please note: this is a general observation.

"sniping" services with one p. Snipping is not a service I'm interested in.

I am a snipped Jewish person who uses a sniping service.

As for the bid retractions, I find them to be a huge problem, generally speaking. I doubt very many of the large bid retractors will come on and explain themselves the way Justin (hi Justin) has. And I almost guarantee their stories won't hold water the way his did.

I have two very thoughtful comments for you. First, eBay (actually, a segment of its horde of MBA know-it-alls) could not and still cannot understand the difference between commodities and collectables, so they push(ed) sellers to use the fixed price format and destroyed auctions. It was one of those "business decisions" that was really smart, unless you actually could care about the difference. Idiots.

However, eBay isn't to blame for the scumbagginess of buyers and sellers who use it to try to exploit others. It's *only* a platform; who the hell wants to police the nonsense that goes on there?

Bill

Very thoughtful Bill. ;)

As was ebay's obfuscation of bidder id's and the like.

It's a virtual harmonic convergence.

Don't forget...the ability for sellers to leave negative feedback. In my opinion, if you don't pay for a card, and a seller has to perform a NPB claim against you, that should warrant an AUTOMATIC negative.

But they've rebranded auction wins as "Orders"; heck, you can cancel an order, right? Argh. And now they let sellers unilaterally cancel bids as well. eBay is making many bad decisions. That's why I stopped listing cards there and took all of mine to a competitor.

I worked at eBay at the time that this new policy went in place. It had taken much too long, but people had finally realized that Amazon was just destroying them. And Amazon never allowed sellers to leave feedback for buyers, nor did any other marketplace. eBay did a ton of things wrong, but this wasn't one of them. I say that even though I loved seller feedback, but too many bad sellers used it as extortion.

For old-timers, remember Roy Huff (libertyforall)?

Bill

Great point Bill! Where did the Ebay auctions go? Ebay changed their business model to be more like Amazon. Thats why I like PWCC who is a rare bread of seller, who runs a true auction without reserves.

Justin makes a great point in asking why a potential buyer would place a high bid early on????? I do not get that at all unless your strategy is hoping that ebay has a crash an hour before the auction ends. People that place High bids early on are just asking to be chipped away by other bidders.

You normally do not win an item being the high bidder a day Before it ends. Many successful bidders come in at the end of an auction via snipe (Ebay)or late night bid, depending on the auction.

I always thought you were on the ball, JC. This just reinforces that :)

The hobby was never better than from roughly 1999-2005 when eBay hadn't completely botched their platform. A decade later, it's a total mess. We're now subjected to multiple auction houses all with ridiculously high consignor rates - I'm looking at you, everyone over 10% or so. There are almost no new buyers coming into the hobby, almost all of the big buyers gone, and this forum is now about Mantle cards and who can complain more.

Give me the old days, thanks.

Bill

+1 and you Preach it Brother Bill!!!!