Is it possible that those two brands were successful and large enough thAt they didn't need additional promotion?
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T206 Reference/Reflections...Any guesses why no CHESTERFIELD or LUCKY STRIKE T-cards?
Hi Rich
LUCKY STRIKE cigarettes were not that popular a brand until the 1920's. One of the most popular cigarette brands circa 1909 - 1911 was PIEDMONT. And, especially in the South and Southeast. And, the CHESTERFIELD brand was introduced in 1912. TED Z . |
Interesting. Usually everything hinges on marketing and the need to drive sales. I'm really surprised, then, that these two brands never hosted cards.
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T206 Reference.....Reflections, Theory's, Surveys, etc....and, let's get your inputs
* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * T206 REFERENCE....Reflections, Theory's, Surveys, etc. * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
http://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...C150x30xxz.jpghttp://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...ohnson208x.jpghttp://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...t150x12xxx.jpghttp://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...raphicbldg.jpghttp://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...yab350x19x.jpghttp://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...CobbSGCx12.jpghttp://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...ITxSGC30xx.jpg .... Sweet Caporal .... Sovereign .......... Piedmont____The "House" that created these Tobacco cards__American Beauty ... Sovereign .......... UZIT This thread will provide references to major contributions posted on Net54 these past 14 years that have formed a better understanding of "The Monster" [as Bill Heitman so aptly coined his T206 book (circa 1980)]. Let's start with the 2005-2006 publication of Scot Reader's Inside T206 An excellent, very informative, and well written book that inspired many of us Net54ers to post our experiences and theory's regarding the complexities of the T206 series. One of the early and very significant T206 threads was posted in June 2006 by Barry Arnold, titled T206 EPDG- - - how rare in your collection ? This thread sparked lots of brainstorming among Net54ers regarding T206's. It included surveys; and, various aspects of the T206 series were explored.....resulting in 363 meaningful posts. Furthermore, between many of us Net54ers, it was "the start of of a beautiful friendship" (to quote Claude Raines to Humphrey Bogart in Casablanca). In the Summer of 2006, Bill Brown posted his T206 Super-Set (excel) spreadsheet. Bill received 1000's of inputs from Net54ers for this spreadsheet. It was a great start in the pursuit of what a T206 "master" set would be comprised of....T206 Super-Set Sept 2007, I started a thread titled Joe Doyle NAT'L and it's 11 "cousins"....SURVEY to explore certain PIEDMONT 350 cards that I considered as rare as the Joe Doyle "error" card. I eventually referred to these particular T206's as the Elite 11 Subsequent posts in this thread will expand on theory's regarding the structure of the T206 series and the front/back permutations that have resulted. A fair number of the theory's presented on Net54 (since 2006) have withstood the test of time. Providing accurate lists of which front/back combos were printed. And, which ones are No-Prints. So, stay tuned......many more T206 "oldies but goodies" References and Reflections will be posted here. And, feel free to contribute any meaningful T206 stories, or experiences collecting T206's that you have. __________________________________________________ __________________________________________________ ___________________________________ INDEX Post #1......Introduction....plus Scot Reader's " Inside T206 " book, and 3 significant T206 threads (circa..2006) for starters. Click on the topic of interest, then scan page for Post # noted Post #2......The beginning of the six "Super-Prints" Post #4......SOVEREIGN phantom "350/460" series (apple green cards) Post #5......350/460 series backs identified Post #8......350/460 series mutually-exclusive cards Post #22.....T206 Plank mystery Post #25.....T206 DRUM's...."A-B-C-D" connection Post #26.....A-B-C-D connection expanded Post #28.....1910 COUPON (T213-1) sub-set Post #30.....Ty Cobb / Ty Cobb back Post #31.....T206 Checklists....plus 1910 COUPON, T215-1 and Ty Cobb/Ty Cobb Posts #33 & 34.....Richard Russell's unique T206 collection Posts #35 - 36 & 38.....Exclusive 12 group (460-only series) Post #39.....AMERICAN BEAUTY 350 No Frame subjects = DRUM subjects Posts #44 & 48.....Collecting T206 sets....tell us your story's Post #54.....T206 all-PIEDMONT set Post #65......SOVEREIGN set story Post #69......SWEET CAPORAL, Factory #30 set story Posts #72 & 74......AMERICAN BEAUTY 460 adventure Posts #76 - 77......T206 cards RE-FRONTED (or re-backed)....FAKE's ! Post #93.....T206 "Proofs" Post #96.....UZIT checklist Post #97.....Spring of 1911....T206 era ends....the start of the "Golden era" begins Post #98.....ATC Factory's associated with the White-Bordered cards (1909 - 1911) Posts #101 & 106.....BROAD LEAF 460 checklist Post #107.....Hobby greats....Frank Nagy and Bill Heitman Post #108.....CAROLINA BRIGHTS checklist Post #124.....PIEDMONT 460, Factory #42 checklist Posts #128 - 131.....Why are Connie Mack, Jack Coombs, Shoeless Joe Jackson, Smoky Joe Wood missing in the T206 set ? Posts #134 & 138.....Timeline of the T206 POLAR BEAR cards Post #144.....T206 OLD MILL (Major League series) cards Post #146..... T206 OLD MILL Southern League cards Post #161.....Southern League cards (continued) Post #162.....T206 Southern Leaguers Brown OLD MILL cards Post #171.....The mysterious T206 brown LENOX cards Post #181.....SWEET CAPORAL 460, Factory #30 backs (w/o Factory #42 overprint) Post #190.....El Principe de Gales T206 cards Post #196.....SWEET CAPORAL 350-460, Factory #42 overprint cards Post #198.....Regional source of the Elite 11 cards Posts #201 >> 227.....Show-n-tell us of your favorite T206's Posts #231 >> 234.....Show-n-tell us of your T206 Run(s) Posts #242 >> 248.....Show-n-tell us of your T206 Run(s) Posts #263 >> 270.....T206 color printing errors......let's see some of these interesting T206's Posts #271 >> 276.....T206 color printing errors......let's see some of these interesting T206's Posts #282 >> 294.....The mysterious nature of the Red HINDU cards Posts #302 >> 316.....Show-n-tell us of your MAGIE cards Posts #328 >> 333.....T206 150-only subjects...... Posts #334 >> 346.....T206 TRIVIA QUIZ....1st correct answer wins T206 Posts #353 >> 358.....PIEDMONT set structure & checklist Posts #360 >> 366.....T206 TRIVIA QUIZ....1st correct answer wins T206 Post #368.....Reminiscing about T206's in 2005 Post #378.....Remembering Jantz Morey Posts #379 >> 385.....T206 TRIVIA QUIZ....1st correct answer wins T206 Posts #386 >> 402.....T206 printed sheet structure Posts #405 >> 440.....Show us your BROAD LEAF 350 cards Posts #441 >> 450.....Comparable printing patterns in T205's Posts #453 >> 467.....Guess the price of a near complete T206 set Posts #469 >> 470.....Guess the selling price of a COMPLETE SOVEREIGN set Posts #471 >> 474.....Guess selling price of a near complete PIEDMONT set Posts #476 >> 479.....Guess selling price of a complete SWEET CAP, F#30 set Posts #481 >> 515.....Show-n-Tell us of your T206 "finds" Posts #516 >> 536....."Bang the DRUM Slowly" while showing us your DRUM cards Posts #537 >> 551.....Guess how many Demmitt & O'Hara St Louis cards exist ? Posts #553 >> 554.....FYI: T206 rosters of the 16 Major League teams Posts #561 >> 570.....FYI: T206 rosters of the 16 Major League teams Posts #571 >> 572.....FYI: 350 Series Minor Leaguer's checklist and trivia Posts #573 >> 573.....T206 Southern League cards illustrated Posts #574 >> 579.....T206 "Monster" obsession ? ....Check-out this one ! Post #580.....Do the T215-1 cards belong in the T206 set ? Posts #581 >> 590.....Do the T215-1 cards belong in the T206 set ? Posts #591 >> 597.....Do the T215-1 cards belong in the T206 set ? Posts #598 >> 600.....Any guesses why no CHESTERFIELD or LUCKY STRIKE T-cards ? Posts #601 >> 603.....Any guesses why no CHESTERFIELD or LUCKY STRIKE T-cards ? Posts #605 >> 610.....the TOLSTOI story Posts #611 >> 620.....the TOLSTOI story Posts #621 >> 621.....the TOLSTOI story In this thread, I've tried to present some very complex aspects of the Series structure of the T206 set in a style which is understandable to most of the T206 collectors. However, if not clear, don't be shy about asking questions. Post your questions on this thread. Or, email me directly with your question(s).... tedzan11@comcast.net In either event, I will gladly do my best to provide you clear and meaningful answer(s). TED Z . |
T206 REFERENCE....Reflections......the TOLSTOI story....and show us your cards
* * * * * * * * * * * * T206 Reference, Theory's, Surveys, etc. * * * * * * * * * * * * *
http://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...fdBaker12x.jpghttp://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...raphicbldg.jpghttp://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...edHINDUx12.jpghttp://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...gsSGC60x12.jpghttp://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...eign350x13.jpg When American Lithographic started printing the 350 Series T206's, they introduced these T-brands....AMERICAN BEAUTY, BROAD LEAF, CAROLINA BRIGHTS, CYCLE, DRUM, EPDG, OLD MILL, POLAR BEAR, and TOLSTOI . TOLSTOI print runs started circa 1910. Continued to the end of the T206 press runs (Spring 1911). To date, 255 subjects have been confirmed. TOLSTOI cards are not tough. However, certain 350-only subjects printed early in 1910 must have been short-printed, as they are very tough to find. http://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...ackTOLSTOI.jpg TOLSTOI checklist (255 subjects) confirmed. They are listed here according to their respective T206 series. 350-only Series...................146 subjects Abstein Anderson Arellanes Atz Barbeau Barger Barry (A's) Bender (trees) Bescher (portrait) Blackburne Bliss Brain Brashear Bresnahan (bat) Burchell Burns Bush Byrne Campbell Carrigan Casey Chappelle Charles Clark Clymer Collins (Milwaukee) Collins (A's) Cree Cross Davidson Delehanty (Louisville) Demmitt (New York American) Dineen Doolan (fielding) Dorner Downey (fielding) Downs Joe Doyle (NY) Dubuc Jack Dunn Joe Dunn Dygert Easterly Engle Evans Ferguson Fiene (throwing) Fletcher Ganzel Gasper Graham (St Louis) Gray Grimshaw Groom Hartsell Hayden Hinchman (Toledo) Hoblitzell Hoffman (Providence) Hoffman (St Louis AL) Hofman Howard (Chicago NL) Howell (portrait) Huggins (portrait) Huggins (hands at mouth) Hunter Jones (Detroit) Kelley Killian (portrait) Kisinger Kleinow (New York-catching) Knight (portrait) Knight (bat) Krause (portrait) Krause (pitching) Kroh LaPorte Lattimore Lavender Lennox Livingstone Lord Maddox Maloney Marquard (portrait) Mattern McAleese McBride McCormick McElveen McGinnity McIntyre (Detroit) McLean Merritt Milan Miller (Pittsburg) Mitchell (Cincinnati) Mitchell (Toronto) Moeller Moran (Chicago NL) Mowrey Murray (bat) Myers (batting) Myers (fielding) Nattress Nichols (bat) Oakes O'Brien O'Neill Paskert Perring Pfeister (seated) Phillippe Purtell Puttman Quillen Quinn Randall Rhoades (arm extended) Rhoades (hands at chest) Rhodes Ritter Rossman Rudolph Schmidt (portrait) Schreck Scott Shannon Sharpe Slagle Smith (Chicago, white cap) Smith (Buffalo) Snodgrass (bat) Speaker Starr Stanage Stephens Strang Summers Taylor Thomas Unglaub Warhop Willett Wilson Zimmerman 350/460 series...................57 subjects Ames (hands over head) Baker Bender (no trees) Berger Bradley (bat) M. Brown (Chicago) Burch (fielding) Cobb (bat off shoulder) Conroy (bat) Crawford (bat) Harry Davis (A's) Donlin (bat) Doolan (bat) Dougherty (arm in air) Downey (bat) Larry Doyle (bat) Elberfeld (Washington-fielding) Griffith (bat) Jennings (one hand) Jennings (two hands) Johnson (pitching) Jordan (bat) Joss (pitching) Kleinow (Boston) Konetchy (glove low) Lajoie (bat) Lake, St. Louis (no ball) Leach (cap) Leifeld (bat) Magee (bat) Manning (pitching) McIntyre (Brooklyn & Chicago) McQuillan (bat) Mullin (bat) Murphy (bat) O'Leary (hands on knees) Overall (yellow sky) Pelty (vertical) Pfeister (throwing) Reulbach (no glove) Rucker (throwing) Seymour (throwing) F. Smith (Chicago & Boston) Snodgrass (catching) Stahl (glove) Steinfeldt (bat) Street (catching) Sweeney (fielding) Tinker (bat off shoulder) Wagner (bat on right) Doc White (Chicago-pitching) Wilhelm (bat) Willetts Willis (throwing) Willis (bat) Wiltse (pitching) CYoung (glove) 460-only Series......…..........46 subjects Abbaticchio (blue sleeves) Ball (Cleveland) Bell (follow thru) Bergen (catching) Bescher (hands over head) Bridwell (portrait-cap) Camnitz (hands over head) Camnitz (arm at side) Chance (bat) Chase (trophy) Crandall (portrait-cap) Devore Duffy Larry Doyle (portrait) Ford Frill Gandil Geyer Herzog (Boston) Howell (hand at waist} Hummel Lake, St. Louis (ball) Latham Marquard (pitching) McGraw (portrait-cap) McGraw (glove at hip) Merkle (throwing) Meyers (portrait) Murray (portrait) Needham Oldring (batting) Overall (blue sky) Payne Pfeffer Schaefer (Washington) Schlei (portrait) Schlei (bat) Schulte (back view) Seymour (portrait) Sheckard (glove) H. Smith (Brooklyn) Stovall (bat) Tannehill (Chicago) Tinker (bat on shoulder) Wheat Wiltse (portrait-cap) Six Super-Prints Chance (yellow portrait) Chase (blue portrait) Chase (dark cap) Cobb (red portrait) Evers (Chicago-yellow sky) Mathewson (dark cap) This is a work in progress, more stuff will be forthcoming. TED Z . |
T206 REFERENCE....Reflections......the TOLSTOI story....and show us your cards
ATC Factory #30 (in NYC) was a major producer of various cigarette brands. Besides SWEET CAPORAL, some of these tobacco brands were
CAIRO MONOPOL, LENOX, and TOLSTOI. Also early 1911, a new T-brand named UZIT. By the Spring of 1911, American Lithographic (ALC) had printed the last of their T206's (350/460 and 460-only series cards). ALC embarked on producing their Gold-Bordered cards.....T205 BB, and various and sundry Non-Sports sets (T42, T43, T56, T57, T69, T80, T99, etc.). Furthermore, Imagine opening a LENOX or UZIT (or perhaps a TOLSTOI) cigarette pack in the Spring of 1911 and finding a T206 card and a T80 card in it. ** http://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...CMblankBx2.jpg http://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...oCMblankBk.jpg In my wild imagination, I expect that some day we will find a Cobb (or two) with a T80 back on it. Hey, this may seem improbable; however, consider that the printer installed the T80 LENOX printing plates in the press instead of the T206 LENOX plates. After all, these cards were printed concurrently. Anyway Cobb has been quoted as saying...…. " Baseball is like War ! " So guys, check-out these unique Cobb cards :) .........……..http://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...Cobb460x50.jpghttp://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...0xLENOXx50.jpg ……………………………………...….…...http://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...Cobb460x50.jpg . http://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...TOLSTOIx50.jpg http://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...OLDMILLx75.jpg.http://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...xUZITx50bk.jpg ………….and, here he is wielding his weapon of "war" :) ** Note….ALC ledger sheet (dated Feb 1911) exists which instructs ATC employees at Factory #30 to insert both a T206 card and a T80 card in a LENOX (or UZIT) cigarette pack. TED Z . |
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So far I only own 2 Tolstoi cards:
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Quote:
Bliss Casey Knight (portrait Knight (bat) Merritt O'neil Pfeister (seated) the following missing from your list are confirmed Beckley Donovan (throwing) Knabe Street (portrait) Sweeney, Bill I also think Bender (with trees) might be an error on the confirmed lists but I'm not sure. There is only one in the PSA pop reports and none in the SGC reports. I've never seen one and I think it might be a label or data entry error on a no trees PSA example. |
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Love me some Tolstois!
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Nice Luke! those are some tough Tolstoi's.
Here's a few more that don't show up often. Attachment 342333Attachment 342334 Attachment 342335Attachment 342336 Attachment 342337Attachment 342338 Attachment 342339Attachment 342340 |
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