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T206 Reference....Red Ink "Twins" > HINDU and SWEET CAPORAL 350-460 Factory #42 cards
* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * T206 REFERENCE...Reflections, Theory's, Surveys, etc. * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
http://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...C150x30xxz.jpghttp://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...ohnson208x.jpghttp://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...t150x12xxx.jpghttp://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...raphicbldg.jpghttp://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...eign150x11.jpghttp://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...yab350x19x.jpghttp://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...ITxSGC30xx.jpg ....Sweet Caporal ...... Sovereign ......... Piedmont_____The "House" that created these Tobacco cards_____ Sovereign…. American Beauty .…. UZIT [/B]This thread will provide references to major contributions posted on Net54 these past 14 years that have formed a better understanding of "The Monster" [as Bill Heitman so aptly coined his T206 book (circa 1980)]. Let's start with the 2005-2006 publication of Scot Reader's Inside T206 An excellent, very informative, and well written book that inspired many of us Net54ers to post our experiences and theory's regarding the complexities of the T206 series. One of the early and very significant T206 threads was posted in June 2006 by Barry Arnold, titled T206 EPDG- - - how rare in your collection ? This thread sparked lots of brainstorming among Net54ers regarding T206's. It included surveys; and, various aspects of the T206 series were explored.....resulting in 363 meaningful posts. Furthermore, between many of us Net54ers, this thread was...."the beginning of a beautiful friendship" (to quote Humphrey Bogart in Casablanca). In the Summer of 2006, Bill Brown posted his T206 Super-Set (excel) spreadsheet. Bill received 1000's of inputs from Net54ers for this spreadsheet. It was a great start in the pursuit of what a T206 "master" set would be comprised of....T206 Super-Set Sept 2007, I started a thread titled Joe Doyle NAT'L and it's 11 "cousins"....SURVEY to explore certain PIEDMONT 350 cards that I considered as rare as the Joe Doyle "error" card. I eventually referred to these particular T206's as the Elite 11 Subsequent posts in this thread will expand on theory's regarding the structure of the T206 series and the front/back permutations that have resulted. A fair number of the theory's presented on Net54 (since 2006) have withstood the test of time. Providing accurate lists of which front/back combos were printed. And, which ones are No-Prints. So, stay tuned......many more T206 "oldies but goodies" References and Reflections will be posted here. And, feel free to contribute any meaningful T206 stories, or experiences collecting T206's that you have. __________________________________________________ __________________________________________________ ___________________________________ INDEX Post #1......Introduction....plus Scot Reader's " Inside T206 " book, and 3 significant T206 threads (circa..2006) for starters. Set your user settings to display 50 posts per Page. Then click on the topic of interest, then scan page for Post # noted. Post #2......The beginning of the six "Super-Prints" Post #4......SOVEREIGN phantom "350/460" series (apple green cards) Post #5......350/460 series backs identified Post #8......350/460 series mutually-exclusive cards Post #22.....T206 Plank mystery Post #25.....T206 DRUM's...."A-B-C-D" connection Post #26.....A-B-C-D connection expanded Post #28.....1910 COUPON (T213-1) sub-set Post #30.....Ty Cobb / Ty Cobb back Post #31.....T206 Checklists....plus 1910 COUPON, T215-1 and Ty Cobb/Ty Cobb Posts #33 & 34.....Richard Russell's unique T206 collection Posts #35 - 36 & 38.....Exclusive 12 group (460-only series) Post #39.....AMERICAN BEAUTY 350 No Frame subjects = DRUM subjects Posts #44 & 48.....Collecting T206 sets....tell us your story's Post #54.....T206 all-PIEDMONT set Post #65......SOVEREIGN set story Post #69......SWEET CAPORAL, Factory #30 set story Posts #72 & 74......AMERICAN BEAUTY 460 adventure Posts #76 - 77......T206 cards RE-FRONTED (or re-backed)....FAKE's ! Post #93.....T206 "Proofs" Post #96.....UZIT checklist Post #97.....Spring of 1911....T206 era ends....the start of the "Golden era" begins Post #98.....ATC Factory's associated with the White-Bordered cards (1909 - 1911) Posts #101 & 106.....BROAD LEAF 460 checklist Post #107.....Hobby greats....Frank Nagy and Bill Heitman Post #108.....CAROLINA BRIGHTS checklist Post #124.....PIEDMONT 460, Factory #42 checklist Posts #128 - 131.....Why are Connie Mack, Jack Coombs, Shoeless Joe Jackson, Smoky Joe Wood missing in the T206 set ? Posts #134 & 138.....Timeline of the T206 POLAR BEAR cards Post #144.....T206 OLD MILL (Major League series) cards Post #146..... T206 OLD MILL Southern League cards Post #161.....Southern League cards (continued) Post #162.....T206 Southern Leaguers Brown OLD MILL cards Post #171.....The mysterious T206 brown LENOX cards Post #181.....SWEET CAPORAL 460, Factory #30 backs (w/o Factory #42 overprint) Post #190.....El Principe de Gales T206 cards Post #196.....SWEET CAPORAL 350-460, Factory #42 overprint cards Post #198.....Regional source of the Elite 11 cards Posts #201 >> 227.....Show-n-tell us of your favorite T206's Posts #231 >> 248.....Show-n-tell us of your T206 Run(s) Posts #263 >> 276.....T206 color printing errors......let's see some of these interesting T206's Posts #282 >> 294.....The mysterious nature of the Red HINDU cards Posts #302 >> 316.....Show-n-tell us of your MAGIE cards Posts #328 >> 333.....T206 150-only subjects...... Posts #334 >> 346.....T206 TRIVIA QUIZ....1st correct answer wins T206 Posts #353 >> 358.....PIEDMONT set structure & checklist Posts #360 >> 366.....T206 TRIVIA QUIZ....1st correct answer wins T206 Post #368.....Reminiscing about T206's in 2005 Post #378.....Remembering Jantz Morey Posts #379 >> 385.....T206 TRIVIA QUIZ....1st correct answer wins T206 Posts #386 >> 402.....T206 printed sheet structure Posts #405 >> 440.....Show us your BROAD LEAF 350 cards Posts #441 >> 450.....Comparable printing patterns of the T206's and T205's Posts #453 >> 467.....Guess the price of a near complete T206 set Posts #469 >> 470.....Guess the selling price of a COMPLETE SOVEREIGN set Posts #471 >> 474.....Guess selling price of a near complete PIEDMONT set Posts #476 >> 479.....Guess selling price of a complete SWEET CAP, F#30 set Posts #481 >> 515.....Show-n-Tell us of your T206 "finds" Posts #516 >> 536....."Bang the DRUM Slowly" while showing us your DRUM cards Posts #537 >> 551.....Guess how many Demmitt & O'Hara St Louis cards exist ? Posts #553 >> 554.....FYI: T206 rosters of the 16 Major League teams Posts #561 >> 570.....FYI: T206 rosters of the 16 Major League teams Posts #571 >> 572.....FYI: 350 Series Minor Leaguer's checklist and trivia Posts #573 >> 573.....T206 Southern League cards illustrated Posts #574 >> 579.....T206 "Monster" obsession ? ....Check-out this one ! Posts #580 >> 597.....Do the T215-1 cards belong in the T206 set ? Posts #598 >> 600.....Any guesses why no CHESTERFIELD or LUCKY STRIKE T-cards ? Posts #601 >> 603.....Any guesses why no CHESTERFIELD or LUCKY STRIKE T-cards ? Posts #605 >> 621.....the TOLSTOI story Posts #622 >> 623.....Meet me at Philly, we can Talk T206's Posts #624 >> 635.....CYCLE 460 checklist Posts #636 >> 650.....The "MONSTER" Master Set achievement Posts #651 >> 664.....The "MONSTER" Master Set achievement Posts #665 >> 669.....UPGRADING T206 cards Posts #671 >> 674.....And then, there are times to down-grade your T206's Posts #675 >> 692.....Black LENOX checklist Posts #693 >> 697.....Check-out Jamie B's multi-brand T206 card Posts #698 >> 700.....Revisting the mysterious Ty Cobb card with TY COBB back Posts #701 >> 713.....Reprising the Ty Cobb / TY COBB card debate Posts #714 >> 726.....CYCLE 350 checklist..... where have all the CYCLE 350 cards gone ? Posts #727 >> 741.....the enigmatic Lajoie (with bat)..... Post your inputs and/or cards Posts #742 >> 750.....The elusive ELITE 11....show them, if you have them Posts #751 >> 760.....The elusive ELITE 11....show them, if you have them Posts #761 >> 800.....How do you collect T206's: Graded or Ungraded ?...show us your cards Posts #801 >> 821.....How do you collect T206's: Graded or Ungraded ?...show us your cards Posts #824 >> 832.....Possible sources of the T206 Wagner cards Posts #833 >> 850.....T206 BLANK-BACKS...if you have them, post them here Posts #851 >> 853.....T206 BLANK-BACKS...if you have them, post them here Posts #854 >> 883.....What backs are your favorite(s), and do you collect runs of them ? Posts #884 >> 900.....Group of 36 subjects (350 Series) that are CB, EPDG, OM, PB NO-PRINTS Posts #901 >> 916.....Group of 36 subjects (350 Series) that are CB, EPDG, OM, PB NO-PRINTS Posts #917 >> 944.....MISSION (99%) ACCOMPLISHED American Beauty 460 run. Show your favorite run Posts #945 >> 950.....Red Ink "Twins" > HINDU and SWEET CAPORAL 350-460 Factory #42 cards Posts #951 >> 961.....Red Ink "Twins" > HINDU and SWEET CAPORAL 350-460 Factory #42 cards Posts #962 >> 984.....Possible sources of the T206 Wagner cards (Re-visited) Posts #985 >> 1000....... the "poor man's" T206 Joe Doyle "Nat'L" card Posts #1001 >> 1002..... the "poor man's" T206 Joe Doyle "Nat'L" card Posts #1004 >> 1034.....Reminiscing about your 1st BB card Show where you acquired T206's Posts #1035 >> 1040.....Show T206's with same name on top or different player's name on top In this thread, I've tried to present some very complex aspects of the Series structure of the T206 set in a style which is understandable to most of the T206 collectors. However, if not clear, don't be shy about asking questions. Post your questions on this thread. Or, email me directly with your questions.... tedzan11@comcast.net In either event, I will gladly do my best to provide you clear and meaningful answer(s). TED Z . |
T206 Reference....Red Ink "Twins" > HINDU and SWEET CAPORAL 350-460 Factory #42 cards
* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * T206 REFERENCE....Reflections, Theory's, Surveys, etc. * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
.http://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...vereign12x.jpghttp://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...eign460x14.jpghttp://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...edHINDUx12.jpghttp://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...raphicbldg.jpghttp://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...CobbSGCx12.jpghttp://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...eign460x13.jpghttp://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...ITxSGC30xx.jpg Here we have two NY Highlanders. A rookie, Russ Ford, who compiled an unprecedented pitching record of 48 wins in his first two seasons (1910 and 1911). And, the enigmatic Hal Chase......who (imo) should be in the HOF. Russ Ford is a member of the 12 guys in the Exclusive 12 club. My Red Ink Twins with this group of T206's is complete. 460-only Series http://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...kTwinFordB.jpg . http://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...nkTwinFord.jpg http://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...FordRHx50b.jpg http://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...2FordRHx50.jpg The guys in the 350/460 Series group (35 subjects) are considerably tougher to find with the Red Ink Twins cards. This project is a long-term work in progress. I have a few from this Series. This Hal Chase "twin" pair is my favorite. http://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...edHINDUx50.jpg . http://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...dHINDUx50b.jpg http://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...TwinsChase.jpg . http://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...winsChaseB.jpg TED Z . |
T206 Reference....Red Ink "Twins" > HINDU and SWEET CAPORAL 350-460 Factory #42 cards
* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * T206 REFERENCE....Reflections, Theory's, Surveys, etc. * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
http://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...vereign12x.jpghttp://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...eign460x14.jpghttp://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...edHINDUx12.jpghttp://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...raphicbldg.jpghttp://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...CobbSGCx12.jpghttp://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...eign460x13.jpghttp://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...ITxSGC30xx.jpg Chick Gandil is quite tough to find Red Ink Twins member of the Exclusive 12 group. The reason for this is his connection to the "Black Sox" scandal of 1919...... http://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...andilRHx50.jpg . . http://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...winsGandil.jpg . . http://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...ndilRHx50b.jpghttp://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...insGandilB.jpg . . TED Z . |
T206 Reference....Red Ink "Twins" > HINDU and SWEET CAPORAL 350-460 Factory #42 cards
* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * T206 REFERENCE....Reflections, Theory's, Surveys, etc. * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
.http://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...vereign12x.jpghttp://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...eign460x14.jpghttp://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...edHINDUx12.jpghttp://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...raphicbldg.jpghttp://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...CobbSGCx12.jpghttp://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...eign460x13.jpghttp://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...ITxSGC30xx.jpg Well, I guess I'm the only one that collects these Red Ink Twins. Anyway, I will continue to Show-n-Tell of some more of my cards. James Otis "Doc" Crandall was McGraw's ace relief Pitcher (1908 - 1913). He was also a pretty good hitter. McGraw would often send him to bat as a pinch-hitter. And yes, these two guys are also members of the Exclusive 12 club. http://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...uCrandallA.jpghttp://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...uCrandallB.jpg . http://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...nsCrandall.jpghttp://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...sCrandallB.jpg http://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...nduMcGrawX.jpghttp://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...nduMcGrawB.jpg . http://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...winsMcGraw.jpghttp://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...insMcGrawB.jpg TED Z . |
T206 Reference....Red Ink "Twins" > HINDU and SWEET CAPORAL 350-460 Factory #42 cards
* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * T206 REFERENCE....Reflections, Theory's, Surveys, etc. * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
.http://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...vereign12x.jpghttp://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...eign460x14.jpghttp://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...edHINDUx12.jpghttp://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...raphicbldg.jpghttp://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...CobbSGCx12.jpghttp://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...eign460x13.jpghttp://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...ITxSGC30xx.jpg OK, here we have two Pennsylvanians. I am quite sure that Pennsylvania is the birthplace of most of the BaseBall players pictured in the T206 set. Do check-this-out. Quite a number of years ago, this "Twins" premise was a consequence of my theory regarding the Exclusive 12 group in the 460-only series. Furthermore, I found that "Twins" extended into the 350/460 series cards which were printed with the red HINDU backs. It's stuff like this that fascinates me regarding the T206 set. For it gives us valuable insight into how these cards were printed, and when they were issued. Thus, it enables us to gain a better understanding of "The Monster". http://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...ckardRHx50.jpg----http://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...edHINDUx50.jpg . . http://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...kardRHx50b.jpg----------http://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...dHINDUx50b.jpg https://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...erSheckard.jpg----https://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...rSheckardB.jpg TED Z . |
Pennsylvanians on T206s
Hi Ted,
I was intrigued by your last post about Pennsylvania being the most common birthplace of T206 players. I had an hour or two to kill and took a look at the birthplaces of all of them (save the couple which are unkown). Turns out you are correct!! Here are the numbers for the most common birthplaces (I'll spare you the whole list): 1) Pennsylvania - 70 individuals 2) Ohio - 46 3) New York - 44 4) Illinois - 27 5) Massachusetts - 18 6) Missouri - 15 7) Michigan - 13 8) California - 11 8 tie) Wisconsin - 11 10) Indiana - 10 11) Texas - 9 12) Canada! - 8 (along with Maryland and Iowa) |
T206 REFERENCE...How do you collect T206's: Graded or Ungraded ?...show us your cards
Quote:
Hi Dave I really appreciate your research. I was making an educated guess in the above post, based on my knowledge of most of the 388 different ballplayers in the T206 set. Included in those 70 Pensylvanians are Matty, Plank, and Wagner. I would attribute this large representation to the coal mining regions in Pennsylvania which had well developed semi-pro baseball. It was great seeing you and your four daughters at the Philly Show, recently. We had a lot of fun.....and, I was surprised that two of your daughters are Yankees fans. Take care, TED Z . |
T206 Reference....Red Ink "Twins" > HINDU and SWEET CAPORAL 350-460 Factory #42 cards
* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * T206 REFERENCE....Reflections, Theory's, Surveys, etc. * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
.http://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...vereign12x.jpghttp://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...eign460x14.jpghttp://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...edHINDUx12.jpghttp://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...raphicbldg.jpghttp://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...CobbSGCx12.jpghttp://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...eign460x13.jpghttp://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...ITxSGC30xx.jpg Continuing from Post #955 with NY Giants players....here are two more Red Ink Twins guys. The Donlin (with bat) pose is one of my favorite T206's. This red HINDU card of his is my 1st red HINDU, which I acquired many, many moons ago. "Turkey Mike's" story as a BB player and a Show Biz Actor is fascinating. Had he taken his BB career more seriously, though, he would be in the HOF (career BA = .333). 350/460 Series subject https://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...inRedHINDU.jpghttps://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...RedHINDUbx.jpg------https://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...Factrory42.jpghttps://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...ctrory42Bb.jpg Exclusive 12 subject https://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...INDUxSGC30.jpg------https://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...winsDevore.jpghttps://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...insDevoreB.jpg . . https://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...NDUxSGC30b.jpg TED Z . |
T206 Reference....Red Ink "Twins" > HINDU and SWEET CAPORAL 350-460 Factory #42 cards
* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * T206 REFERENCE....Reflections, Theory's, Surveys, etc. * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
.http://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...vereign12x.jpghttp://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...eign460x14.jpghttp://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...edHINDUx12.jpghttp://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...raphicbldg.jpghttp://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...CobbSGCx12.jpghttp://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...eign460x13.jpghttp://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...ITxSGC30xx.jpg .........Six members of the Red Ink Twins club.…..… John Hummel, I'm proud to say he is a Pennsylvanian (like other players shown here). He had a long career with Brooklyn (1905 - 1915). John was a "Jack of all fields". He played every position on the field (except for Catcher). His ML career ended in 1918 with the Yankees. https://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...duHummel50.jpghttps://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...uHummel25b.jpg----https://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...winsHummel.jpghttps://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...insHummelB.jpg There were two "Jeff" Pfeffer (brothers) in the ML in the deadball era. This T206 card features Francis X. "Big Jeff" Pfeffer (1905 - 1911, Outfielder & Pitcher W-L 31-39). His younger brother is Edward "Jeff" Pfeffer (1911 - 1924, Pitcher W-L 158 - 112). http://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...efferRHx50.jpg------https://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...insPfeffer.jpghttps://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan...nsPfefferB.jpg http://photos.imageevent.com/tedzan7...fferRHx50b.jpg TED Z . |
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