2020 topps project
 

im more of a pre war guy but i do pick up cards sometimes that look unique.

what do u guys think of these 2020 topps project cards?

some look horrible but some look pretty cool. love to hear your thoughts

A waste of time.

I've been tempted by a few of these - most I think are actually pretty ugly but I like a few of the '89 Griffey Topps Traded renditions. What bothers me is actually the total number of cards and variations - wish they had just picked only the top 1 or 2 of each card rather than 20 different options leading to 400 total cards. It is way too much. Also think I read they print on demand based on sales not a predetermined number of cards released to be sold - which is lame from a scarcity driving investment standpoint.

I am not usually in to this type of card but so far I am hooked. The images don’t really do justice to the cards as some of the artists do things with textures and raised effects that don’t come through until the card is in hand. I do agree that you really have to either go after one artist or one player or things would get out of hand. I am posting in the pre1980 section my quest for all of the 1952 Jackie’s to complement my real 52 Jackie

The Topps Now and Living Set use the same business model, I like it. The cards that are worth a lot are not always the obvious suspects. I'm not real familiar with the Project, it seems like they are going after a different market.

I’ve been picking up Ben Baller’s cards as I find him funny and like the designs. I had to sell his Ichiro when I saw what they were going for (probably let go of it a little too soon but couldn’t pass up a $400 profit) but I’ll hold on to some of the others for the time being. I love them but don’t get the secondary market demand for these things since they were unlimited and easily accessible from the source.

Was there a certain timeframe to buy these, like a week?

Ugly search cloggers

I admit they do run the gambit between ugly and awesome. Unfortunately the ones I would like to add are the same it seems most would at amazing profits. I don’t think I will be buying many at secondary market prices but I have started watching the releases on the topps site.

I think the ball was dropped in two places though to make them much better. The backs are terrible and should have more thought. Also, the artist proofs are a giant fail for retaining value long run. Without having the artist sign the 20 copies, I see little to justify the value after the excitement leaves years from now. They left an opportunity to have a cool collectible like the signed Peter Max cards on the table.

48 hours each card

Interesting, but I haven't seen one yet that I've wanted in my PC. Since I am a collector, not an investor, I can't see any reason to get one. Now if they release a card based on T206, then there is a 99% chance I would get one. Ty Cobb, Honus Wagner, Cy Young. I bet these artists would love to take their hack at The Card.

Contrary to my previous post I actually think today’s Clemente is pretty awesome and might pick up one. I think that’s just the nature of the set - thinking maybe 5-10 max out of 400 I’m gonna be tempted to pull the trigger on.

We are *NOT* the audience for these cards. I don't do anything with them but they are. as you can see from the print runs, very successful and also bring in more people into the collecting market.

On that level they are perfectly fine.

And for an intelligent perspective on these cards here is Mike Sommer's blog post on these cards.

https://waxpackhero.com/blog/topps-project-2020

I picked up the Oldmanalan Koufax and Clemente. I really like his work. I will probably pick up a few more, but at 20.00 each it eats into a vintage budget fast.

Thanks Rich, great link! As I’m learning more about these cards and to be able to see all the previous runs in one place many are growing on me. Prob not enough to buy past releases on the secondary market for those extraordinary prices but at least to keep an eye on the Topps site every few days so see what’s next.

For me the Beck releases are the coolest overall with the sort of mixed media look to them but did pick up an Oldmanalan Clemente today as I think it’s a beautiful card. My only hang up with his others so far is besides Mariano he seems to deviate a little too far from the original “iconic” card which seems to be the whole point.

I’m going for a complete run of Griffeys and if the make more gold cards like the Frank Thomas I’ll grab those as well.

Has Topps made any guarantees that they will not go back and print more runs of cards once they sell? Seems as the market for these is picking up and the current runs consistently get closer to the 10-20k range the originals in the 1-3k range are becoming more and more valuable (even the ones that are pretty ugly).

I almost got in on these from the jump but thought it would be a pretty big investment at $20 a pop. I had the first two in my cart and never completed the transaction.

I think most of them have been really hideous and I would not have enjoyed having them in my collection from an aesthetic point of view.

I do regret not getting in on them from a value perspective....my goodness. I really blew it here.

I don’t understand why you think they would do that?

I followed them from begining and decided that at $20 each I would just order the Trouts I think that would be 20 cards. The fist card had a print run of 2911 seemed a little low based on watching living set. Then secondary market took off Trout was selling for $75 and first 2 cards for a couple hundred. Then second Trout card came out print run over 13 Thousand. The Trout took off quickly selling for $400 ( I sold mine) and many of the early cards also quickly went up. I continue to buy Trouts ,just one. And will hopefully rebuy the first later when prices tumble. I also sold my first 18 Topps living cards when they hit $900..
Some artists sell autographed versions on their own websites Ermsy who drew the first Trout is one of them. So if you like a particular artist then check them out and see.
I did buy a gold Frank Thomas but on ebay whereyou can save a few bucks presale.. usually $17.50 free shipping from one of the dealers who buy 10 or more and get discounts.

Have you been overall happy with the condition of the cards you've gotten in hand? I've seen a few pics on EBay that look like some cards have marks on them or like debris trapped between the card and the holder. Can only imagine what this would lead to if the next wave is cracking them open and sending in for grading! I'm sure it's coming.

I have only gotten 3 cards but no condition errors.

I got three—only had one in hand so far but was really pleased with it. Ben Baller Ichiro. Felt foolish keeping it so flipped it when it hit $420. Regretting it now that it’s at $700. I like some of these cards and don’t like others. Fortunately, the profits from the one allowed me to pick up two more and a few game used items, which is great.

Posted this on the pre 1980 board but may make more sense here

My Project to put all of the Jackie’s with my original

This whole phenomenon is just so fascinating To me in so many ways. I can’t figure out the incentive of these guys preselling 100 cards at $17 like the latest McGuire? I get it that when they buy in bulk they get for $15 a card from Topps and it is a guaranteed $2 per card profit but is $200 really worth all the hassle not to mention having to wait weeks just to get the cards in hand then ship them all out? Are they that worried the cards won’t at least hold their $20 buying price when the excitement dies down (doubtful).

Matt The ebay sellers who buy 100 cards get perks from Topps. Because as you point out margin is slim and when you add postage and ebay and paypal fees any profit is small BUT THE PERKS ARE BIG.
First perk among the base cards sold is a 1/1 gold framed edition. So if they sell 8k of a card and seller buys a hundred then he has 1/80 chance of getting the gold card. Take that times all the cards he buys and the chance he gets one are pretty good. The first Trout Gold sold for $7,000.00
And most are in the 3k to 8k range. On top of that Topps has a premier club for sellers who are among the top 25 spenders. They get a package with 25 Autographed cards. Plus other cards and sets all year. Plus the topps now card of the month and discount coupons that can add up to Hundreds. Topps is decent to sellers not so decent to collectors...😥🤔😥

I picked up the last henderson & mays that just came out, thought they were good lookin cards

Ah thanks Jonathan now it makes sense. I like many have pulled a complete 180 on this. I’m now kinda obsessed with the project, reading about the artists, waiting for the next day’s cards to drop, tracking prices on EBay. I admittedly did splurge for a few early run cards that I thought were the coolest and worth the investment but now am just content to buy direct the new releases I like and nothing else on the secondary market. Cool to see the article on ESPN today and the discussion over on Blowout is pretty entertaining.

I ended up joining the fray and bought a Blake Jamieson's Big Mac card.

Rich

I feel like I am late to the party, but I keep trying to convince myself to start picking up the rest of the George Brett cards for my PC

Or would I be better off waiting till later and picking these up for $5 a pop in a couple years?

I just checked PSA Population reports and there are already 2 Project 2020 cards graded. PSA 8 Cal Ripken Jr./Fucci and a PSA 10 Ermsy/Ichiro. Slightly interesting that the Ripken card has the player listed first, but on Ichiro's card, the artist is listed first. I wonder if that is how it will show on the flip?

Yea the problem I’m gonna have is the discipline to really limit myself to the new releases I love from the get-go (like the Jamieson McGwire) with about 300 still to go but unfortunately finding the more I look at ones I may not instantly want (like Ermsy Gibson) and learn about the artist, the more I want those too!! Damn you Topps and damn myself for being so impressionable!

I do agree though the ship has sailed on the >$100 cards with runs over 10,000 so I think there’s pretty low risk to passing now and buying later if I’m still haunted by having to have one. That being said, I don’t think they’re ever gonna be $5 a pop, should at least retain their $20-30 original price unless truly 400 was too many and big time fatigue sets in when we get into the 200-300 range. We’ll see- wild ride!

Really good point. I like that idea of waiting until the fatigue sets in and the print runs start dropping. That would be the next time to get in possibly. Of course at that point, you would have to wait years before the hobby comes back to revisit the set. Could be 5 years, could be 20 years.

Just another observation - I have never seen the dynamic between auction and Buy It Now prices function this way. When it comes to vintage, I would literally never touch a BIN as they are always about 20-50% above what the card goes for on auction and there's absolutely no incentive to do so (except immediate availability). With P2020, literally on an hourly basis sometimes, the current auction for a card exceeds BIN prices out there so in a way the BIN becomes a guaranteed bargain based on immediate market value. And even when you see these outrageous BIN prices start to pop up for sellers to try to stay one step ahead it keeps happening.

I would be very cautious about paying decent money for any project 2020 cards on ebay. Like the previous post noticed the auction pices seem a little hinkey. I voiced the same opinion about Topps Living and the prices for those cards has come down significantly.
I know there are alot of marginal collectors home killing time on ebay driving up some prices. But with these cards there are a few players that own a big piece of the available inventory. And that almost always leeds to prices being manipulated. Look maybe there will be a crossover market with cards and art. I have a couple old Nike posters that were photographed by Jeff Koons ( large metal balloon animals a couple permanent at the Met). So if one or more if these artists moves near the top of the foodchain then all of his cards would do well. But for now I think print runs in the 2 to 3k and 3-4k range produce more cards than there are collectors to buy them. Jmho

I’m gonna do a run of the Griffey Jr. and possibly the gold cards by Don C if there are more like the Frank Thomas. So far I have all four Griffey’s (Saladeen and Beck in hand, Taylor just shipped and waiting for Rochester Griffey and the Don C Thomas) I really screwed the pooch at the beginning figuring I could get Saladeen Griffey anytime but then the whole thing took off and I paid a pretty penny for it.

I like a lot of the other cards but financially I have to hold the line.

The more I see the hype/greed centered around this whole project (and I'm by no means claiming to be innocent) makes me wish Topps and/or the artisits had partnered up with a charity. Something to promote art education to intercity youth or even some type of Covid relief effort (especially considering the positive impact on sales by so many people being home right now and the well documented re-exploring their childhood passion for cards).

There is a very entertaining thread over on Blowout that I'll admit I read too much of but many just boasting about how much money they are making on the secondary market each day and even some of the artists seem to be capitalizing on the explosion in popularity outside of the project (see "money bear" if you are not familiar). Even in the recent interview on Sports Card Nation podcast, Blake Jamieson (who seemed like a nice enough guy) admitted to how the project is part of his marketing strategy to increase his popularity and drive future art sales. I not saying any of this is necessarily wrong, I have no problem with people making money, especially the artists for their work and if people are willing to pay exorbitant amounts of money for a card they know the seller paid $20 for 3 weeks ago that is their choice. But I think the whole thing would have a slightly less of a "greed cloud" to me if Topps from the get-go had pledged like 20% of profits to some greater good. Obviously the insane secondary market profits would not be subject but they are the biggest driver of the growing popularity of the project on a daily basis and Topps selling more $20 cards each day.

It's not too late, as was said above I agree around card 150-200 I think there is going to be a significant drop in interest due to fatigue especially as the secondary market finally stabilizes for older runs. Topps is going to need some incentive to keep buyers interested and attract new ones. Why not something philanthropic?

One note about Blake: He has also continued and has put a decent amount of this project 2020 income back into collecting. He has been picking up Oakland A's related items and posting those on Twitter. Hint: The items are what average collectors pick up when building a collection and he is really enjoying his hobby time.

Do folks realize that all 20 artists are doing all 20 cards? There will be 400 unique cards. So far maybe 50 released? And some of these like Trout have a run of 34000 cards. Cool idea but as an investment I don’t see this really going anywhere. Lots of crazy asks on eBay don’t establish anything.

Great point Rich. And Mike's blog is great, and he has a really good twitter feed.
I enjoy this, I made some money on the earlier issues and enjoy the flipping aspect of it. I don't think there's enough money to sustain the crazy prices that we are seeing. I bought the Mcgwire last week and its already at $200. Insane.
I do like Ben Baller's stuff he's funny and original. But yes, most of the people on this board are not the intended target for these cards.
I hope the come out with a rendition of the 52 Mantle or more White Sox cards (Fisk Rookie, a Nellie Fox or Aparicio, etc.).

I would say the investors killed this one for a while. In a year these will be .99 cards. Supply and demand will never hold even the cost after the clueless stop buying. I will buy no more until the production drops at least to 7-10k. The smart money if you think they are neat, is wait for the auctions after these are actually delivered and get them for a fiver.

I bought the Ryan and Ripken in the last week and have serious remorse. :cool:

Any of them you are willing to sell at .99 cents I'm a buyer. No questions asked.

As these start exceeding 100k runs they have no long term value of exceeding demand once the excitement dies down. Now the cards that had runs of 1000ish with 100k amateur collectors thinking of building the set right now? Different story.

It will die down when these prospectors are stuck with 100's of these they cant sell for cost because the news hyped these to the ceiling. I suggest buying the overproduced ones being made now in 2021 and wading back into to the 20 bucks on Topps.com later. This is Etopps squared at this moment.

And at an original cost of $20 -- $1 (or 99 cents) is 5 percent of the original asking price. Even for Junk Wax boxes -- you would pay 5 percent of original cost even for the worst boxes. 1988 Topps lets say you paid the $18 retail (50 cents per pack) in 1988, today 5 percent if about 90 cents and I guarantee you everyone would happily pay $1 each because the purest wholesale is $3-5 per box. I'd happily take a triple on every card item I buy any day of the week.

I feel like we are on different wavelengths here. :D

I am advocating buying at 1-5 bucks if you like them. I am not advocating taking a 95% loss and making the 99 cents guy happy purposefully.

I can guarantee that every buyer of 88' wax boxes during that boom was not planning on taking a 95% loss. They were just as blinded as the prospectors seeing those early cards sell at four figures and thinking they could do the same with a card 100x higher produced.

I'll be a buyer at a buck too, but honestly bummed to be taking a loss before they even ship. I knew it was coming logically, but this was fast.

Justin D,

I am so on the same wavelength as you on these. One of my top 3 favorite players of all time is in this set and I would love to be buying his cards right now, but not with the crazy print runs we are seeing.

Speculators are buying 10, 20, 100 of these at a time. Crazy! A collector only needs 1.

These products are not Stocks, they are collectibles.

I agree with you, as long as print runs are 20-30K, I am waiting. When they drop below that I may pick up my favorite player next year. And I bet I can buy them for $10 a pop (of course if you let me make the first offer, I will offer 5). If the secondary market remains firm on Cards #100-#300, I might buy direct from Topps just to hedge my bet while watching the print run quantities ebb and flow.

If Topps Project 2021 comes out, the P-2020s will only lose more of thier "new hotness".

I will caveat everything I said when it comes to the truly shorter printed runs, i.e. sub-5000, those have a chance of staying solid and sought after.

I bought the Ted Williams because I liked the card, knowing it was going to have a high print run. 20.00 is the cost of lunch at a fast food restaurant. I don’t care about the value, but I would be shocked if you could buy them for less than
10 in the next year. I will continue to buy what I like at 20. If they become worth more than they are worth to me, I will sell. Otherwise they are part of my collection.

Baseball art crossovets
 

If you go to the artists web sites many of them are buying 10,20,50 500!! And then they sign them and sell them for $200 to $1,000.00.
The First Trout card sold for over $2500.00 multiple times this week. And The first card an Ichiro by Ben Baller OVER $4,000.00 for a $20 card bough a few weeks ago. Lots of stories of people buying presales getting money returned. Bottom line LOTS OF STORIES ABOUT PROJECT 2020.
I might get a Trout signed by an artist I will let you know how it goes.
Jonathan

Crazy speculative bubble. I like the cards. And it’s a brilliant idea. But $2500 to have a card signed by the ARTIST? That’s nuts. These are some talented folks but who cares about their autograph. And they can keep signing cards until their arms fall off. Good for them. Making some bucks during a slow time. But the idea that some card is going to be valuable because it was signed by a handbag designer? Cmon.

People are very very bored. No sports. No gambling. Few social activities.

Maybe in 3 years someone will stick this post in my ear. I strongly doubt it.

I applaud the fusion of art and baseball cards that Topps has achieved here. Obviously with art being so subjective, what some will love others will not find aesthetically pleasing, etc. That said I've happily bought the ones which have grabbed my eye. If one is a fan of a particular card, for example as I am with the 84T Mattingly and 85T Gooden, it is nice to pair these renditions or artistic interpretations of the card alongside the original.

As with anything in the hobby, there will also be those who are only interested in the cards in so far as they can flip them for a profit. That's not how I engage with them so can't really speak to that. I've bought paintings I love decades ago that I still look at and love every day, and have no idea or care as to what they are worth.

Bought the Mattingly.