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-   -   How Big Would Your Bull Pen Be If............ (http://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=301966)

frankbmd 05-14-2021 05:13 PM

How Big Would Your Bull Pen Be If............
 
(It just ain't fair to the unemployed utility player with teams carrying 14 pitchers on their roster most of whom are one inning wonders in the bull pen)

..........All MLB games were 6 inning in length?

I suspect the complete game would make a comeback.

3 and 4 hour games would be eliminated.

You could still have that runner on second base but let the extra seventh, eighth and ninth innings be real baseball in the case of a tie.

The runner on second base in the tenth inning looks like a kid's game in the sandlot that is threatened by the mother's calling their kids home for dinner, and the kids want to know who won.

I suspect 3 or 4 relievers could do the trick with 5 starters. Certainly no more than 10 on the roster.

A 12 inning double header would be preferable to the current 14 inning affair.

The managers would have more flexibility to manage beyond calling the bullpen for a new pitcher every inning.

And to accommodate all the starters who cannot seem to pitch 5 innings any more, let 4 innings be the requirement to record a W.

Mark17 05-14-2021 05:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by frankbmd (Post 2103184)
(It just ain't fair to the unemployed utility player with teams carrying 14 pitchers on their roster most of whom are one inning wonders in the bull pen)

..........All MLB games were 6 inning in length?

I suspect the complete game would make a comeback.

3 and 4 hour games would be eliminated.

You could still have that runner on second base but let the extra seventh, eighth and ninth innings be real baseball in the case of a tie.

The runner on second base in the tenth inning looks like a kid's game in the sandlot that is threatened by the mother's calling their kids home for dinner, and the kids want to know who won.

I suspect 3 or 4 relievers could do the trick with 5 starters. Certainly no more than 10 on the roster.

A 12 inning double header would be preferable to the current 14 inning affair.

The managers would have more flexibility to manage beyond calling the bullpen for a new pitcher every inning.

And to accommodate all the starters who cannot seem to pitch 5 innings any more, let 4 innings be the requirement to record a W.

And about 10 guys in either league would get the 3.1 plate appearances to qualify for a batting title. No hitter would ever again get 3,000 hits or 500 HR. They'd have to just start keeping hitting stats all over from scratch.

frankbmd 05-14-2021 06:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mark17 (Post 2103193)
And about 10 guys in either league would get the 3.1 plate appearances to qualify for a batting title. No hitter would ever again get 3,000 hits or 500 HR. They'd have to just start keeping hitting stats all over from scratch.

Thresholds could be adjusted. Watching a 3 1/2 hour game with 35 strikeouts and 2 or 3 dingers does not float my boat.

If you thought I was deadly serious in my post, you are incorrect.

I like history and records too, but at the current rate the league batting averages could be headed for .200 or less in a few years. The complete game is already gone. 20 game winners, what's that? Ball in play action reduced. The Shift - ugh. Can anyone name all the pitchers on their favorite team's roster?

Eric72 05-14-2021 06:26 PM

5 in the bullpen, to go along with:

5 starting pitchers
8 starting position players
1 reserve catcher
2 reserve outfielders
3 reserve infielders
1 pinch hitting specialist
1 utility player who can play multiple positions, including catcher in an emergency

Mark17 05-14-2021 07:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by frankbmd (Post 2103195)
Thresholds could be adjusted. Watching a 3 1/2 hour game with 35 strikeouts and 2 or 3 dingers does not float my boat.

If you thought I was deadly serious in my post, you are incorrect.

I like history and records too, but at the current rate the league batting averages could be headed for .200 or less in a few years. The complete game is already gone. 20 game winners, what's that? Ball in play action reduced. The Shift - ugh. Can anyone name all the pitchers on their favorite team's roster?

The solution to most of this is a pitch timer, and some radical manager being mega successful utilizing old school strategies, which everyone will then inevitably emulate.

I've always believed it would be easier to build a staff with 4 quality starters rather than 5, and that a starter is sharper working every 4th day rather than having that extra off day.

I've seen so many changes in the rules over the past few years, I don't assume any idea is too ridiculous to be considered by MLB.

Peter_Spaeth 05-14-2021 07:41 PM

If you were to watch a current baseball, football, and basketball game, then watch a film of a game from the 50s, which sport would look like it's changed the least? I think baseball.

frankbmd 05-14-2021 08:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth (Post 2103229)
If you were to watch a current baseball, football, and basketball game, then watch a film of a game from the 50s, which sport would look like it's changed the least? I think baseball.

I would say ice hockey.

The rink is the same

The periods are still 20 minutes.

Scoring is comparable.

The ice is still frozen

And you still can’t see the puck on TV.

egri 05-14-2021 08:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by frankbmd (Post 2103184)
(It just ain't fair to the unemployed utility player with teams carrying 14 pitchers on their roster most of whom are one inning wonders in the bull pen)

..........All MLB games were 6 inning in length?

I suspect the complete game would make a comeback.

3 and 4 hour games would be eliminated.

You could still have that runner on second base but let the extra seventh, eighth and ninth innings be real baseball in the case of a tie.

The runner on second base in the tenth inning looks like a kid's game in the sandlot that is threatened by the mother's calling their kids home for dinner, and the kids want to know who won.

I suspect 3 or 4 relievers could do the trick with 5 starters. Certainly no more than 10 on the roster.

A 12 inning double header would be preferable to the current 14 inning affair.

The managers would have more flexibility to manage beyond calling the bullpen for a new pitcher every inning.

And to accommodate all the starters who cannot seem to pitch 5 innings any more, let 4 innings be the requirement to record a W.

Such a proposal would drastically reduce the number of relief pitchers each team needs. To expedite the cutdown process, I suggest an annual event each Spring Training called "The Running of the Bullpens". Pitchers can compete in events like 'Arguing balls and strikes,' with the winner being the most demonstrative, and 'The (how not to hit a) Homerun Derby'.

They will be evaluated on how long it takes them to wake up in the middle of a game when they get the call to start warming up, with bonus points awarded if they can do it despite being hungover from the night before. The Dick Radatz Award will be given to the pitcher who can crack open a cold one at the top of the inning, then strike out the side before it gets warm.

They will also be scored on how many sunflower seeds, peanuts, and boxes of Cracker Jack they can consume per inning. The capstone event will be a series of wind sprints (after all, it is the Running of the Bullpens) that will continue until all excess pitchers have dropped out.

To placate the PETA (People for the Ethical Treatment of Animals) activists, no bulls will be harmed in the Running of the Bullpens. To placate the PETA (People for the Eating of Tasty Animals) activists, ample hot dogs will be provided to spectators, so that the overweight ex-jocks who get winded walking from the sofa to the refrigerator can have something to chew on when they volubly inform everyone within earshot that they could have thrown a football over them mountains, and would have won the state championship and gone pro if only coach had put them in in the fourth quarter.

BobbyStrawberry 05-14-2021 09:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by frankbmd (Post 2103195)
The complete game is already gone.

Less common than it used to be, but not gone. There have been 19 CGs in this season so far, 11 of which have been 9 innings.

steve B 05-14-2021 11:05 PM

I have two opposite proposals

A) Go all in on long games, taking a tip from Cricket. Allow flat bats, but a narrower and taller strike zone. Only an inning or two, but everyone bats, and if they aren't out, the player at bat continues batting.
No foul ground, and home plate is made more central in the stadium, allowing easier transition to football, Soccer, or even .... Lacrosse...
That would also make the homerun distance shorter.
But there is a time limit, and if they don't completely finish before that, the game is a tie.

Option B
Go for quicker more economically efficient games. Smaller parks, fewer players.
No catcher, just a rusty old pitchback from the 70's. Major market teams can repaint it and maybe put on a new net.
Very dead balls that can't be hit more than about 125ft or so. Loads of cash could be saved by not having to secure so much valuable real estate.
And since the ball would be kinda squishy, no batting helmets. Or gloves.
And maybe use a small diameter bat....
No set innings, just play until the sun sets, or the managers mom turns off the floodlights.
And maybe...

Darnit! I just invented pro whiffleball....

Nevermind.

clydepepper 05-14-2021 11:50 PM

Taking Frank's 6-inning idea and making a few more not-entirely un-obvious changes.

It's late at night and I'm bored.


Each game will consist of (3) 9-Out Innings in which they can ONLY use extreme shifts.


Any HR ball that lands back on the field is in play and can be used to 'soak' the trotter.

All other home runs are worth half a run for the first 8 outs of each inning, but 2 runs after the 8th out.


Home run trots are to be timed and should be completed within 45 seconds. Taking any longer to complete the trot costs his team half a run.

Bat-Flips are to be graded via video replay from the league office in New York. The grading will be on a zero-to-ten scale with the winning flipper's game salary to be disbursed to all spectators in the cheap seats.


For every walk, 50 league balls must be handed out to the crowd.

Any pitcher who cannot get even one out of his first three batters faced, must replace a position player of the opposite team's choice and bat in that player's spot.

Obvious fielding errors are to cost at least one run regardless and cost the fielding team an out in their next inning.


Any overthrows which hit a spectator will result in the player who threw the ball having to exchange his yearly paycheck with that of the spectator.

Batters can change from left-to-right handed once per at bat.


Pitchers must wear protective helmets while in the game.

First base will be flattened to avoid any Jason Kendall-type injuries.

At the end of each inning, the best outfield arm will attempt to throw out the opponent's fastest runner at home plate. The thrower will release his throw from the warning track in center field and the runner will start at second base. If the runner is thrown out, the game salary of his team's highest paid player will be disbursed to the crowd...along with 20% off coupons at the local Rent-a-Tire.

How 'bout that you purists?

frankbmd 05-15-2021 09:10 AM

The responders to this thread are hereby appointed to the MLB Rules Committee. Clearly there is more talent here than I expected. Collectively we can make a difference. Going forward let’s present a single rule change per post with an explanation of its benefits. To demonstrate the format I propose:


The Intentional Strike Out and The Designated Whiffer

1. MLB has already eliminated four balls from the intentional walk.

2. Pitchers are subjected to removal based on pitch counts. Let’s give them a break, so they can pitch deeper into games.

3. Each team would be required to put a Designated Whiffer in their line up. After all we have had Designated Hitters for 50 years. The DW would not have to be a roster player, but perhaps a fan, who would only have to step out of the dugout and tip his cap. The fan would receive a bat for his effort.

4. In the proposed 6 lnniing game this would eliminate watching up to 8 or 9 strikeouts per game.

5. The length of games would be shortened, perhaps allowing a roll back of the 6 inning game to the traditional 9 innings in the future.

6. There is a precedent for such a rule as noted in #1 and #3 above.

This one should be unanimously adopted.

egri 05-15-2021 02:56 PM

Baseball has been losing ground to football for years. We can blame things like pace of play, or all these newfangled rule changes, but those are all fig leaves for the real culprit: dull press conferences. Everything that is said nowadays gets sliced and diced by PR representatives and spokesmen, and is focus-group tested to be as bland as possible. There aren't any colorful characters in the game anymore.

Meanwhile in the NFL, the coaches say exactly what they're thinking. It's how we know what Mike Zimmer thinks about Bobby Petrino, and that the Bears are who Dennis Green thought they were. Even grumpy lobster boat captain Bill Belichick has a few good quips from time to time.

To rectify this, I propose the "What Would John McKay Do?" rule. Before taking questions, the manager must remove all weasel words from his vocabulary. No more making excuses, or hiding behind clichéd sayings. If a team lost so badly that the manager felt like leaving the stadium and hitchhiking home, he should say so. If his opinion of the team's execution is that he's in favor of it, best to be up front about it. This rule change will make for more entertaining postgame shows and, like Frank's rule change, also be unanimously adopted.


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