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#1
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Anyone think that these depict the same ballplayer?
Posted By: Frank Wakefield
Just got the cabinet. In the embossed part it has "W. S. Coffman, Paris, Mo." I think that is the photographer. |
#2
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Anyone think that these depict the same ballplayer?
Posted By: Adam
I think they are the same person. |
#3
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Anyone think that these depict the same ballplayer?
Posted By: Mark L
I say no. The proportions of the face differ. The length of the 2nd guy's nose is equal to he distance between the nose and the chin while the 1st guy's nose is much smaller than the distance from his nose to his chin. Maybe it's hard to tell because of the different angles but I think the ears are different, too. |
#4
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Anyone think that these depict the same ballplayer?
Posted By: Shawn Chambers
Don't know for sure if it's the same player, but that is a really cool cabinet, Frank. I love "tidal wave" hairdo's. |
#5
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Anyone think that these depict the same ballplayer?
Posted By: Fred C
Wow, is that Cap Anson? Hahahaha, - Just kidding. |
#6
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Anyone think that these depict the same ballplayer?
Posted By: barrysloate
Even if it's not, it sure is close. |
#7
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Anyone think that these depict the same ballplayer?
Posted By: Rob D.
I think the ears say no. |
#8
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Anyone think that these depict the same ballplayer?
Posted By: MVSNYC
no...eyes, ears and facial structure different |
#9
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Anyone think that these depict the same ballplayer?
Posted By: Ed Ivey
I don't know. Did plastic surgery exist in those days? |
#10
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Anyone think that these depict the same ballplayer?
Posted By: Chris Mc
I hate to buck the trend but I believe they are thr same. The top photo is a younger version of the bottom photo. If the angles were the same I think the ears would match up. |
#11
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Anyone think that these depict the same ballplayer?
Posted By: Zinn
"I think the ears say no." |
#12
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Anyone think that these depict the same ballplayer?
Posted By: MVSNYC
since i am up way too early for some odd reason, and nursing a vodka hang-over...i decided to put both of these images side by side and analyzed eyes, noses, ears, foreheads, lips, etc... |
#13
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Anyone think that these depict the same ballplayer?
Posted By: Bill Stone
Great pick up. William Kuhlman played for the Paris Bourbonites of the Blue Grass League in 1910,1911 and 1912. Interesting enough, according to the SABR Minor League database, in 1908 he played for the Havana Perfectos in the Illinois-Missouri League. Since it appears he was at least in the vicinty of Paris, Missouri in 1908 I would keep researching him because it might possibly be the same person. This is the kind of question that makes this hobby so much fun. Thanks for sharing it. |
#14
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Anyone think that these depict the same ballplayer?
Posted By: Ed Hans
I vote no. The ears are quite different. |
#15
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Anyone think that these depict the same ballplayer?
Posted By: Ed Ivey
Could it be an optical illusion that the "title wave" hair offsets the left ear deviation? |
#16
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Anyone think that these depict the same ballplayer?
Posted By: Frank Wakefield
Thank you guys... thanks for all of the opinions and thoughts. |
#17
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Anyone think that these depict the same ballplayer?
Posted By: Jodi Birkholm
Either way, I think I can safely say that Frank has discovered the the man who provided the inspiration for those grotesque Bob's Big Boy statues! |
#18
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Anyone think that these depict the same ballplayer?
Posted By: MVSNYC
frank- |
#19
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Anyone think that these depict the same ballplayer?
Posted By: Anonymous
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#20
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Anyone think that these depict the same ballplayer?
Posted By: MVSNYC
to take this analysis to the next level... |
#21
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Anyone think that these depict the same ballplayer?
Posted By: Dan Bretta
I used to own that cabinet photo and I'm certain it is from the 1890s. Maybe it's Kuhlman's pop? |
#22
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Anyone think that these depict the same ballplayer?
Posted By: leon
I think, from the scan cincicards just put up, they do look very similar. Not sure if they are the same but look at their eyelids. They are formed the same way.....I think Michael mentioned the "from their nose to their lip distance"....to me they are close...and the part in the hair is similar too.....And further more I think there is a distinct possibility that is where Kips Big Boy got his hair style from. Are there still any Kips even around? I don't think so.... |
#23
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Anyone think that these depict the same ballplayer?
Posted By: Ed McCollum
Paris is about 14 miles from my home town. Small now, always has been. Around 900 people. Strictly a farming community. Could try and send this listing to my folks, and see if my mom could do some research at the Ralls |
#24
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Anyone think that these depict the same ballplayer?
Posted By: MVSNYC
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#25
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Anyone think that these depict the same ballplayer?
Posted By: Jim VB
Kip's was the local (Texas and Oklahoma) franchise of Bob's Big Boy Restaurants. Today, Leon or I would have to drive pretty far to find any Big Boy franchise. Ronald has killed most of them. |
#26
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Anyone think that these depict the same ballplayer?
Posted By: Bill Stone
I think Paris, Missouri is about 150 miles from Havana, Illinois so it is possible that this could have been a starting point for him or that his father might have played there. Fred Beck ( T205) was born in Havana, Illinois in 1886 so it does have a rich baseball tradition. |
#27
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Anyone think that these depict the same ballplayer?
Posted By: Jodi Birkholm
"look at their Tragus" |
#28
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Anyone think that these depict the same ballplayer?
Posted By: MVSNYC
haha...Jodi- i don't know the first thing about anatomy (well, a few parts ) |
#29
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Anyone think that these depict the same ballplayer?
Posted By: Frank Wakefield
I appreciate the helpful and informative observations, guys... thank you. |
#30
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Anyone think that these depict the same ballplayer?
Posted By: Steve Dawson
All I know is that the guy's hair in picture #1 reminds me of Cameron Diaz' hair in There's Something About Mary! |
#31
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Anyone think that these depict the same ballplayer?
Posted By: Addie_Joss
I don't think its the same player. What is the approximate dates of that cabinet and the tobacco card you posted? The uniforms look wholely different. Cabinet's uniform features no buttons and is a totally different style. If they are say 10-15 years apart from each other he would have aged a lot more. That guy in the card still looks pretty young. |
#32
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Anyone think that these depict the same ballplayer?
Posted By: Frank Wakefield
The red border Old Mill card is from 1910, a series 6 T210. |
#33
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Anyone think that these depict the same ballplayer?
Posted By: Rob D.
I subscribe to A-Word-A-Day, an email that give the definition, etymology, and usage of a new word each day, 5 days a week. |
#34
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Anyone think that these depict the same ballplayer?
Posted By: Frank Wakefield
A Word A Day... |
#35
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Anyone think that these depict the same ballplayer?
Posted By: Richard Cline - RC
Frank - I don't really think the two players are the same person. Previous posts regarding the ear, some very specific, show differences and I believe the nose is much narrower in the second photo than the first. |
#36
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Anyone think that these depict the same ballplayer?
Posted By: ROBERT ADAMS JR
Is it possible they are related ? Brothers possibly ? |
#37
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Anyone think that these depict the same ballplayer?
Posted By: ken McMillan
would that be Havana, Illinois as in the Havanah ducks? Scarry little hick town if you ask me. I grew up maybe 30 miles from there. |
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