Card Saver 2 question?

[jchcollins]

Hi all,

I have used a combination of toploaders and Card Saver 1 and 2's for years now, largely without issue. As I get older, I have found my preference to be for Card Savers over toploaders due to not having to deal with the constant frustration of penny sleeving - and I also prefer the cards not to wiggle around in the holders after I have them seated.

Question though - seems I saw a post recently of concern (not sure if it was on N54...) that specifically for CS 2's - the smaller sized ones - that these over time can put undue corner pressure on vintage cards?

Do we believe there is any shred of truth to this? I've never had a problem with any CS - whether the larger, submission sized 1's - or the more compact and snugger fitting 2's.

As with any card supply if you are careless or don't know what you are doing - yes there is the potential to damage your cards - but I was wondering if it's really anything to worry about with the CS2 and corners.

Thanks for any input.

[Eric72]

I have always avoided card savers (semi-rigids) for this reason. It seems, at least to me, they’ll exert an uneven amount of pressure on the card. They’re keeping the card in place. I believe pressure, and maybe some non-zero amount of friction, are the only forces acting upon the card to do this. That pressure would be greatest at the edges and corners, no?

The impact on the card is probably minimal. Still, I greatly prefer penny sleeves and top loaders.

[brianp-beme]

Card Saver 2 man here. I have never noticed any issues, but then again, my cards are quite often beat all to hell.

Collect small size issues like T and E cards, then all you have to worry about is centering the darn things to your liking within the Card Saver sleeves.


Brian

[jchcollins]

Ugh. Now I don’t know…

I was certainly more of a toploader person as a child collector…


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[teza11]

Do Card Savers perform better than Ultra Pro? I asked because the last few boxes of Ultra Pro's (card submission size) that I have purchased have some waviness to them. That can't be great for the cards.

Jeff

[Steve D]

Regarding penny-sleeves:

Does anyone know of a brand where the top, say 1/4" of one edge is cut, to allow easier insertion of the card? I've always hated using penny-sleeves, since it's far too easy to dog-ear a corner trying to put the card in.

I've tried cutting the troublesome ones I've had, individually, but that is just too much work.

Steve

[Eric72]

Originally Posted by Steve D

Regarding penny-sleeves:

Does anyone know of a brand where the top, say 1/4" of one edge is cut, to allow easier insertion of the card? I've always hated using penny-sleeves, since it's far too easy to dog-ear a corner trying to put the card in.

I've tried cutting the troublesome ones I've had, individually, but that is just too much work.

Steve

I’ve never used them; however, The Penny Sleever apparently has sleeves like this. They’re called Corner Cut Sleeves.

[jchcollins]

I'm going to stop my original OCD-tendency post here in it's tracks:

I will go out on a limb and say (if used properly of course...) that I don't believe any form of Card Saver really damages cards. Am I off base here? These things have been around for 40+ years at this point. If they did, wouldn't we have been warned off a la the PVC pages paranoia of the 1980's / 90's, or the "screw-down-cases-are-bad" phenomenon of the past few decades?

Would PSA continue to say that they prefer subs in Card Savers if they actually damaged cards - knowing that many of their subs sit for like half a year on-end before being graded?

I think I'm making much ado out of nothing. Feel free to disagree...

[Topnotchsy]

Originally Posted by jchcollins

I'm going to stop my original OCD-tendency post here in it's tracks:

I will go out on a limb and say (if used properly of course...) that I don't believe any form of Card Saver really damages cards. Am I off base here? These things have been around for 40+ years at this point. If they did, wouldn't we have been warned off a la the PVC pages paranoia of the 1980's / 90's, or the "screw-down-cases-are-bad" phenomenon of the past few decades?

Would PSA continue to say that they prefer subs in Card Savers if they actually damaged cards - knowing that many of their subs sit for like half a year on-end before being graded?

I think I'm making much ado out of nothing. Feel free to disagree...

I don't know enough about Card Savers to know if you are right, but I don't agree with this argument. One Touch Card Holders can absolutely damage cards over time and people seem to ignore this. (One Touch Card Holders have a little area around the corner recessed. I have seen cards where over time, you can clearly see that the card itself has a mark at that location. I cannot say for sure that they were not shaken, but based the caliber of card, I assume it was just natural moving around from being brought to shows etc. (I vaguely remember someone doing a video on this which was on Youtube though it has been some time.)

[Steve D]

Originally Posted by Eric72

I’ve never used them; however, The Penny Sleever apparently has sleeves like this. They’re called Corner Cut Sleeves.

Thank you Eric; that's exactly what I want!

Steve

[jchcollins]

Originally Posted by Topnotchsy

I don't know enough about Card Savers to know if you are right, but I don't agree with this argument. One Touch Card Holders can absolutely damage cards over time and people seem to ignore this. (One Touch Card Holders have a little area around the corner recessed. I have seen cards where over time, you can clearly see that the card itself has a mark at that location. I cannot say for sure that they were not shaken, but based the caliber of card, I assume it was just natural moving around from being brought to shows etc. (I vaguely remember someone doing a video on this which was on Youtube though it has been some time.)

I would guess that in some tiny fraction of cases this may be true - I've seen people with shiny cards claiming that there are scratches and dents in their borders under magnification because of this problem. The possibility I would guess is more prevalent for certain types of cards over others. But on the whole for the large majority, and certainly for vintage - it is not. If true of One Touches / mag cases and their recessed cutouts - then it would also be true of all PSA slabs (their design for corner cutouts is nearly exactly the same). And I'm sorry, but on the whole we have never been inundated with stories about either OT's or PSA slabs damaging corners or edges on vintage cards en masse over time. We simply haven't.

I used to be very much on this bandwagon as well - indeed a lot of my recent preference for Card Savers over the past decade or so comes from the fact that I shudder most of the time when I see cards moving obviously within their cases. Whether that is with a slab, a mag, or a toploader. But the physics of the situation is simply that even if the card can move a tiny bit in the holder - unless you are just using your cases as air hockey pucks for extended periods of time - the risk of damage is very minimal. I think this continues to be borne out over time with the fact that nobody is really up in arms over any type of TPG slab...