What has happened to all the paintings for those wonderful cards?

[Archive]

Posted By: Max Weder

Has any of the original art survived for any of the tobacco cards? I don't recall seeing any in any of the recent major auctions (say in the last ten years), so I thought I'd see if anyone on this list has seen any such works. If this topic has been covered in any reference work, please let me know the cite. I do recall seeing a number of post-WWII paintings of cards being offerred.

I've seen a few paintings that were used as covers or illustrations in older baseball books, but even those are incredibly difficult to locate.

Thanks,

Max

[Archive]

Posted By: hankron

As far as Pre-War paintings for baseball cards go, I beleive there are only the 1930s Diamond Stars. There is the original artwork for the M101 Sporting News Ned Hanlon, which somewhat resembles a painting .... There are a few of the original photos for some cards.

Most baseball (and football) card paintings come from Post WWII, including many for the vintage Bowman and Topps cards. Some very recent cards were based on commisioned paintings, and you can get these. Topps hired a variety of painters, each to paint one or more players, and Topps has sold many of the paintings directly to the public. If you are a modern collector, or even if not, some of these recent paintings can be sharp.

[Archive]

Posted By: Max Weder

Thanks for the reply. How were the T205s, T206s, T212s et al then created? What it some sort of drawing, photo lithography or hand tinting photos? I guess I just had always assumed they were paintings rendered to look like photographs, particularly with a set like the T205s.

Max

[Archive]

Posted By: bcornell

Max-

Back in the days when David used to post frequently (er... more frequently), there was a thread that covered this subject:

http://www.network54.com/Forum/message?forumid=153652&messageid=1042603334&lp=1042751210

Bill

[Archive]

Posted By: hankron

It really ranges. Old 20th century art for cards, magazines and ads ranges can be oil, acrylic, watercolor or other paintings, sketches (ink, charoal, etc), photos, etc. There is a lot of mixed media-- meaning mixing and matching of painting, print, photo, sketches. You will often find sketches or paintings with 'paste-ups', paste-ups being cut out photos or pictures pasted to the background. Even if the original art is a photo, it is often hand embelished (adding details, background, etc). Many 1950s-60s cards and colorful advertisements were made from flexichromes-- which are small handcolored photos-- known for their super bright colors. The 1957 Topps football cards were made from flexichromes, and you can flexichromes on the market with some ease.

In general, you can look at a card or ad and make a reasonable guess as to what was the original. Some old magazine add will be an obvious reproduction of a charcoal sketch or a painting. An Exhibit Card is obviously a reproduction of a photograh. As noted, there is a lot of mixed-media, so you often can tell for sure until you see the art in person.

There are a wide range of factors relating to financial value. This includes significance (original art for Johnny Unitas's rookie card), artst (preferable signed0, size and what medium. A large detailed painting will be worth that a small quick sketch, for example. In general, collectors of the original art are looking for displayability-- collecting them as pieces of art.

For some original art, especially for magazines, the magazine or publisher's name and often the date is stamped on the back.

[Archive]

Posted By: hankron

I add that for a collector, he should purchase what appeals to his artistic taste. If a painting or sketch or mixed-media is something that you want to hang on your wall and look at, that's the one. You don't need to listen to anyone else to know what you like.

[Archive]

Posted By: warshawlaw

I once saw the original art for the Gone With The Wind movie lobby cards and posters. Many years ago I dealt in Hollywood memorabilia. I was approached at a show by a somewhat eccentric man who said he had inherited a collection of memorabilia from a MGM executive and wanted to know if I wanted to buy some Academy Awards (my specialty) materials. I did, so I made arrangements to visit him.

I visited him in the house in West Hollywood (just next to Beverly Hills) he inherited. It was the home of the former production head of MGM, Isadore "Dory" Schary, who, it turns out, was an inveterate pack rat (I know it was his house because I ended up buying several of his old Academy membership cards among the other stuff I purchased). He had thousands and thousands of incredible MGM-related artifacts throughout the house that this lucky bastard was only beginning to catalogue. Literally millions of dollars worth of stuff, from which he was privately selling the mass-produced stuff, like publications. The house was a museum. Each corner you rounded ran you smack into something else incredible: A life-sized signed portrait of Joan Crawford, a gigantic signed B&W photo of Fred Astaire dancing, costumes, etc. The attic was filled with dozens of boxes of candid personal photos from the studio, including glass negatives going all the way back in MGM history. About the only thing not there were the Ruby Slippers from The Wizard Of Oz.

The highlight of the visit was when the guy led me into yet another room crammed with memorabilia and pulled from the closet an artists' portfolio case, about 2 x 3 across. He unzipped it and pulled out sheet after sheet of stunning handpainted images that were the actual images used to create the GWTW lobby cards. They looked like 11x 14 color portraits that had been enhanced with paints. They were stunning.

If you've ever been fortunate enough to have a non-collector turn up at your show table and lay down a stellar collection, imagine that feeling raised about 1000x. GWTW memorabilia is very popular and very expensive. The posters created with these items sold for thousands. These images literally were museum-quality pieces that I would guess would have sold for tens of thousands each. The house, which was a really nice one just outside Beverly Hills, was worth far less than the stuff inside.

Obviously, I could not even offer on the collection, which is just as well since the guy was working with a film historian to document it all before trying to sell it. I have looked since then for news of the collection being sold, but have seen nothing.

The funny thing of it was that I bought a bunch of publications for a relative song and went home to go through them. Out of one fell two unused tickets for the Oscars in 1972.

[Archive]

Posted By: Hal Lewis

Did you offer him $500 for the whole collection "sight unseen"?

[Archive]

Posted By: warshawlaw

since I'd seen it...