Great News! (GAI pack grading)

[Archive]

Posted By: Richard Dwyer

To anyone who has tobacco packs encapsulated by GAI, they are offering to reencapsulate them at $5 each. If you're not happy with the prior one/s, send it back to Steve Rocci @ GAI and he will reencapsulate them for you. I suggest that you send with it all the info you want to appear at the top. They will verify and then reencapsulate.

GAI now does a better job at authenticating these packs thanks to Jon Canfield & myself.

[edited title]

[Archive]

Posted By: jay behrens

They should be doing this for free. Why should the collector have to pay for their mistakes and incompentence?

Jay

I like to sit outside, drink beer and yell at people. If I did this at home I would be arrested, so I go to baseball games and fit right in.

[Archive]

Posted By: Richard Dwyer

That's at their cost. I doubt PSA and anyone else would do it for free either. I'm having mine redone, because I want all the facts on the label this time.

[Archive]

Posted By: leon

They made mistakes and now want to charge to fix them? Hmmmm......don't know about that......(well, actually I do)...regards all

[Archive]

Posted By: Judge Dred

Perhaps we're not understanding the logic here - they're doing it for free when they charge you $5!!! Remember, the trick here is that it costs them $5 to do this so when you give them the $5 they actually do it for free!!!

What a deal, what a concept, where do I sign up?

[Archive]

Posted By: qualitycards

PSA does not charge to have a card reholdered if the information is incorrect, like card #, player name or if the card issue is wrong. If you wanted other additional info placed on the flip that might be another story...jay

[Archive]

Posted By: Richard Dwyer

I'm not defending GAI and their mistakes. Yes, they messed up. But they have improved since then. Perhaps you should call or write yourselves to voice your opinions.

GAI is the only ones who encapsulate tobacco packs/boxes! Rag on them enough, and they might drop out of the market. Name anyone else that encapsulates packs/boxes.

I can post pictures of my encapsulated boxes which show better wording, etc. (Only because I demanded those things to be in the label). Everyone here had the same chance to tell GAI what to put. Yes, you shouldn't have to do this. But if you wanted it right back then, you should have helped them out. Especially when you knew that they didn't know what they were doing.

The encapsulated boxes cost GAI $5 each. GAI has to research and talk to other experts to verify your information, so when you give them nothing to go on what do you expect? I think it's great that GAI is willing to re-invest the time to research your information for free.

There are people on eBay that sell boxes that GAI put 1909-1918. GAI is no longer doing this. They are correctly dating the boxes now. So beware, if you have one of those boxes and you want it reencapsulated.

[Archive]

Posted By: Jay Miller

No offense, but who cares if GAI authenticates boxes? It sounds like, from what is stated here, that GAI got into the field with plenty to learn, and now they want people to pay for their education. I thought graders are supposed to be the experts. Why does everything have to have plastic around it? Hey, I got my goldfish slabbed today---got an 8.5. Used to really like that little fella.

[Archive]

Posted By: Judge Dred

Ditto the above sentiment.

Wouldn't it be interesting to see Ford go into the business of building Space Shuttles? Ok, that was a bit extreme. I would have hoped that GAI would have had their ducks in a row before branching off into a new venture. It gives the appearance that money is more important than providing expert services. By the way, I'd like nothing more than to have SGC, GAI and PSA place the "real" years on N172 cards but they wont, EVEN IF YOU PROVIDE THEM WITH THE RIGHT INFORMATION!!! All N172 cards get stuck with the 1887 year on the encapsulation label.

[Archive]

Posted By: leon

You didn't get the updated version of the goldfish slab. It has water in it so the little guy can swim around. AND nothing personal here but the statement about giving GAI help in their business AFTER they rolled out the program is idiotic. They should have known about them BEFORE they started slabbing them. BTW, when I was at the National I did speak to some GAI guy in an elevator and asked him about the pack/slab snafu. He said everyone makes mistakes (non-chalantly) . I think it's great they do the service but they should have known it better before starting it. And there is no way in HELL that someone else should pay a dime to have them fix their mistake. Paying $5 to cover the cost of fixing their mistake is stupid, imo. ...there's my 1/2 cent.......later

[Archive]

Posted By: Jay Miller

Hey Leon--I just looked at my goldfish slab. Son of a Gun if it didn't say GUPPY 8.5.

[Archive]

Posted By: hankron

My opinion is that, when in doubt, GAI should say the pack is unopened and not give a date or anything (Which is what they should have done in the first place and probably will do now), then offer for sale a copy of Jon's guide from their site.

In life and collecting, you can see today how ignorant you were yesterday, but you have to wait until tomorrow to see how ignorant you are today,

[Archive]

Posted By: Richard Dwyer

Your only other option was to pay full price again to have them redone. If I was GAI and read your posts, I would take the offer back.

[Archive]

Posted By: Jay Miller

Wrong! Your other option is to rely a little more on yourself and less on others and break the packs out and not have them slabbed.

[Archive]

Posted By: hankron

How about this. Instead of having their packs entombed at all, collectors buy Jon's guide. Never quite understood the aesthetic appeal of having a tobacco pack encapculated in a plastic bologna pack, but perhaps that's just me.

And if any want to take GAI up on their $5 offer, great. And if GAI starts labelling tobacco packs accurately, that's swell.

Then everyone's happy!

[Archive]

Posted By: Hal Lewis

Are they putting a warning label on the outside of the slabs when they are packaging up these tobacco packs??

If not ... I am coming after them!!!

[Archive]

Posted By: bcornell

http://www.network54.com/Forum/message?forumid=153652&messageid=1085166638

http://www.network54.com/Forum/message?forumid=153652&messageid=1081872564

http://www.network54.com/Forum/message?forumid=153652&messageid=1080541727

All 3 threads discuss packs that were graded as 'possibly' holding cards that they could not hold, given their timestamps.

[Archive]

Posted By: jay behrens

Richard, you are coming across as a shill for GAI. As pointed out, they had no business slabbing packs since they obviously had no clue what they were doing. And collectors taht believed GAI know what they were doing SHOULD NOT have pay anything to get their packs correctly graded. It's bad enough they have to pay to ship them back to them. Obviously, GAI is a greedy company that cares little about comustomers and more about the all mighty $$$. Why else would they want to charge someone to correct their mistake?

Jay

I like to sit outside, drink beer and yell at people. If I did this at home I would be arrested, so I go to baseball games and fit right in.

[Archive]

Posted By: Richard Dwyer

I spoke to GAI and told them your complaints prior to my initial post here. It was because of my speaking up, did they make the offer. I'm just as upset about wasting my money as the ones who spent money to get theirs encapsulated. All I get for my effort is a bunch of people telling me off. Last time I will speak up for this forum.

I felt GAI was at least trying to make up for their past. I'm tired of packs that say 1909-1918 going for stupid amounts on eBay. I'm out over $100 for packs that I had encapsulated. YELL AT GAI, NOT ME! Thanks.

[Archive]

Posted By: hankron

Let's compromise and yell at Hal.

[Archive]

Posted By: MW

I don't know David. At this point I'm kind of feeling as if it's your fault.

[Archive]

Posted By: Kenny Cole

Richard,

I don't think that anyone is yelling at you, per se. You are, however, the messenger. And the message is that GAI is willing to fix what it should never have screwed up for a fee.

It is not your fault that GAI responded in that fashion, and I, for one, think that you went out of your way to try and get them to do something approaching the right thing. I applaud your efforts, and believe that, had you not done what you did, GAI wouldn't even have made what I view as a token effort to make things right. At least from my perspective, your efforts to make things right aren't even an issue. The issue is GAI's piss-poor response to a problem which it created in the first place. Being the messenger is sometimes hard, but I don't think you should probably take the comments personally, because they by and large aren't directed at you.

Gary B,

I'm not sure when you started collecting, but many of us on this board began before collecting was cool, a good investment, or otherwise neat. Yes, many people who post here have nice collections. However, some of the people with "Bentleys" have them because they were relatively cheap at the time they bought them.

In any event, I agree with you to some degree about the grading bitch. I personally hate grading and have never sent in even one card because I think it's a bunch of hype and crap. My thought about that is the cards in my collection are in no worse condition for not having been graded than they were before grading became a fad. Since I bought them for my pleasure, not to re-sell or show off to others, I don't care what some guy I don't know thinks about them.

Others disagree, and that's fine too. However, notwithstanding my huge distaste for the whole grading scam, my other basic thought about the matter is that if a business offers a service, be it grading Bentleys, Pintos, cards or packs, they ought to be up to doing it right before they begin. If they're not, that's their fault, and they shouldn't charge the car, card or pack owner an additional fee to fix their screw-up. Just my two cents.

Kenny Cole

[Archive]

Posted By: Judge Dred

Richard,

I guess there's always two sides to a story - what you did as a fellow hobbyist is to be commended. I guess if you look at the $5 it's fairly minimal when you consider the cost. Please don't be disappointed in a few comments directed at GAI because of their blunder. I guess when you look at it it would only cost them $500 to do 100 packs and there's a lot of good will in that.

I don't know about the rest of the board but I'm not a CEO, attorney or someone that gives out bowling shoes, I'm just an average hobbyist that sees things in black and white (a few shades of gray as well).

Again, what you did was pretty "stand-up" and deserves a round of applause. Now can you call GAI and ask them to reclassify the 8.5 Guppy to an 8.5 Goldfish.

Happy Collecting,

Judge Fred

[Archive]

Posted By: Richard Dwyer

At least my boxes are protected by the elements. Even though GAI did a crappy job describing my boxes, they are safe from fingerprints, etc. I'm still gonna have them reencapsulate them at $5 each, only to show my friends that they are what they say they are.

All the boxes that GAI encapsulated with 1909-1918 have devalued my collection. eBay is also to blame for allowing those to be sold when I & others had notified them that they were fraudulent.

[Archive]

Posted By: Josh K.

Am I missing something, I see is a response to Gary B from Kenny, but no original post by Gary B.

[Archive]

Posted By: hankron

Suffice to say that baseball card tobacco packs is one of the most esoteric areas in the baseball hobby. Like the prettiest girl in the neighborhood, the genre has broken the hearts of most suitors.

[Archive]

Posted By: MW

Josh,

The missing post in question (from Gary) said something to the effect that many of the collectors on this forum were either rich or spoiled or both. It was pretty random. Bill must have deleted it.


David,

What on earth?

[Archive]

Posted By: hankron

For the record, I'm not rich but I'm definitely spoiled.

[Archive]

Posted By: Gary B.

Any idea why my post was removed? I thought it was completely on topic. I don't post that often, and I put a lot of time and thought into it. What gives???

[Archive]

Posted By: hankron

Frankly, Gary, I don't know why it was removed either. It wasn't any more off topic than half my posts.

[Archive]

Posted By: MW

But David, you've been with us forever and you hold a special place in all our hearts. For that reason alone, you've been extended creative carte blanche.

[Archive]

Posted By: jay behrens

Richard, I commend you on what you did, but there was no need to be an apoligist for GAI's screw up. That was all their fault and they did not take full responsibilty like they should have.

As someone mentioned, it's not easy being the messenger in a situation like this, but what you did to at least get GAI to do something is to be commended and I am sure you have that thanks of many collectors.

Jay

I like to sit outside, drink beer and yell at people. If I did this at home I would be arrested, so I go to baseball games and fit right in.

[Archive]

Posted By: Lee Behrens

Giving out bowling shoes is a lucrative business, I am thinking about franchising. Any of you really rich guys want to invest some vintage cards?

[Archive]

Posted By: Gary B.

"The missing post in question (from Gary) said something to the effect that many of the collectors on this forum were either rich or spoiled or both. It was pretty random."


This wasn't even close to the intention of my post, and it certainly wasn't random as it was heartfelt and thought out, but since it no longer exists, people can't see for themselves to comment on it. And please don't delete this post too and give me an opportunity at least to defend myself.

I thought I had something valuable to say, but I guess the moderator didn't agree with my point of view - I guess I hit a nerve, and so it was deleted/censored. I guess only the posts that everyone can readily agree on are allowed to remain (obviously this is an exaggeration, but what am I supposed to think)? I certainly talked about the topic. This is really sad, and is going to make me seriously think about expressing my opinion or putting a lot of time and thought into a post again on this forum which I thought I really admired and respected.

I've been to many online forums, and while they are moderated, it's never been close to being this extreme.

[Archive]

Posted By: jay behrens

Gary, just because you had one post deleted does not mean that there is, to paraphrase you, extreme moderating/censorship going on. I didn't see the post, but Bill talks to me often enough about potentially deleting posts to know that he does not take deleting a post lightly, and rarely deletes one.

Your post may have been well thought out, but name calling and making broad generalizations that could potentially lead to a flame war will most likely get deleted.

Jay

I like to sit outside, drink beer and yell at people. If I did this at home I would be arrested, so I go to baseball games and fit right in.

[Archive]

Posted By: Gary B.

I didn't think I was namecalling, I was just trying to give people another point of view to look at this issue as opposed to quibbling over the $5 thing, but most people won't get to read that now for themselves. This wasn't my first post being deleted, btw. I had a thread that had a good 40+ responses where the entire thread got deleted too. Maybe it's not taken lightly when a post gets deleted, but then we must have very different definitions of what lightly means or what constitutes flaming, as that was not my intention at all. Instead of the healthy conversation and possible debate that could have ensued over my post, instead there is healthy conversation and debate over why my post was deleted. Sad.

[Archive]

Posted By: leon

edited to not hurt anyone's feelings

[Archive]

Posted By: Chris

edited cuz leon rules.

[Archive]

Posted By: hankron

99 percent of collectors have limited collecting budgets and do just fine. An eye for quality is 100x more important that a huge bank account. I've long felt it's a bogus assumption that good stuff has to cost money and cheap stuff is bad. I don't have near the budget of some on this board, but I've owned a few expensive items in my day. With these types of items you sometimes think you'd died and gone to heaven and you sometimes think "You know, I liked that $20 item just as much if not better."

[Archive]

Posted By: scott hassel

As a long time pack collector ( sold you guys some of your better packs ) its a shame that a novice company with very little expertise would even think of grading these packs. There's been enough bad eggs in the card game , now it moves to vintage pack collectors. KNOW WHAT YOU BUY and from who. Heck I purchased an N162 on line that was GAI certified as a 6 with 20% of the back missing. Good hunting.

[Archive]

Posted By: Hal Lewis

I may be one of the "big budget" guys these days ... thanks to some good fortune in life ...

but I collected cards for 35 years on a VERY LOW budget and appreciate every little thing about the hobby.

Don't lump me in with the "investors."

[Archive]

Posted By: Hal Lewis

PS - My FAVORITE cards are still the ones that I collected as a kid and have kept forever:

1968 Topps "Super Stars" #490 - Killebrew, Mays & Mantle (first card I ever bought at a card show)

1973 Topps (first year of buying wax packs as a kid)

1977 Topps (first full set from Renatta Galasso)

Total Value: $34

Sentimental Value: Priceless!!

Without these memories ... I wouldn't be spending the amounts on cards that I am spending. I would be spending my money on some other hobby.

The "investors" will come and go ... but just because I spend a lot does NOT make me any less appreciative of a common card than anyone else!

[Archive]

Posted By: Richard Dwyer

My first box was my 1911 Old Mill. Bought it for $5 about 10 years ago. Right place, right time. Dumb seller.

[Archive]

Posted By: Jason

Has GAI got the BBkid to grade those 1950s Santy claus bogus HOliday racks with VGEX cards in them? ...........the ones he used to peddle on ebay? Just curious.

[Archive]

Posted By: Josh K.

Ive seen those Santa holiday packs on ebay recently - never bought any, but why are they bogus? Ive never heard anything about them.

[Archive]

Posted By: hankron

I'm no wax pack expert, but I beleive the 'Holiday Packs' were packaged some time after and don't have factory fresh (high grade) cards. As with any collectable, the bogocitiness (technical term) depends on how the packs are represented.

[Archive]

Posted By: scgaynor

I personally once opened a "holiday rack pack" and found a card in the center with ballpoint pen writing on the back.

Also, the header card is a photocopy and not printed, as it would have been if actually done in the late 1950s.

Scott