I Decided on a Ty Cobb

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Posted By: Jason Miller

Hello my name is Jason. I been reading all about baseball cards because I like to collect them. I dont have any old ones yet because they cost too much and my dad said I had to learn about them first before I spend all my money so he showed me here.

He said we are called lurkers because we just listen and don't talk but I could write this if he read it first and said it was ok. I am almost 14 and in the eighth grade because I got behind a year at school not because I am stupid but because we moved.

My favorite person to read is Jay Behrens and my dad's is Gilbert Maines because he is funny. My most unfavorite is all the lawyers. I was thinking I wanted to be a lawyer so I could be rich and buy cards but now I want to be like Mr. Behrens and buy all my cards for nothing. My dad says if I do that he will kill me.

Anyways I was thinking that my favorite player is Ty Cobb and that my favorite card was T205. My dad says if I save up I can buy one and I was thinking that I should buy one that is graded authentic because I saw one that was really awesome but it said it was trimmed. I want this one because it is in a SGC and I think they look way cool. So my question that he said I could ask is how much should I spend and if its ok that I buy one like that. Everyone is always saying that the good ones might be trimmed so I was thinking that maybe I get lucky and the trimmed one turns out not to be but they made a mistake.

I hope I didnt make so many mistakes so I let my dad look at my english plus we had a assignment at school and this counts as homework.

Jason

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Posted By: Matt E.

Is this for real?

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Posted By: steve f

With all the options to occupy teens, Ipods, Playstation, chatrooms etc. It's refreshing and rare to find younger guys interested in BB history. Welcome Jason!

PS; Tell dad there are other SGC Cobbs auction that are graded

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Posted By: Matt E.

This kid wants find a labeled Authentic card that may have been misgraded.

what eighth grade kid is up at 6AM, guess dad was up also.

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Posted By: Jay

Hello Jason,

My name is Jay and I am in 11th grade (16 years old) and I also collect tobacco cards. It is great to know that there are others my age collecting tobacco cards. I have been solely collecting T206s for about a year now and have accumulated about 70 including many HOFers like Walter Johnson, Christy Mathewson, and Tris Speaker.

When I buy cards I look to find cards that are uncreased, unmarked, untrimmed etc and ones that if graded would be in the PSA 3-6 or SGC 40-80 range. I would note that these are more expensive than cards in the Authentic or SGC 10, PSA 1 range, and I haven't been able to find a Cobb in my price range at the grade that I want. Always find an idea for how much you would like to spend on a card, and try to stay somewhat within that number (within reason).

Although you might get lucky with an SGC Authentic being untrimmed, I would recommend that you start smaller with some of the commons or other HOFers, and work your way up to a Cobb. There are many other great HOFers in the T205 set that you could find in better condition for about the same price you would pay for that Cobb. I would look at Frank Baker, Chief Bender, Roger Bresnahan, Tinker, Evers, and Chance and the others in that price range.

Also, commons in VG to VG-EX condition are probably selling about 25 to 30 dollars, and you would get more for your money's worth with commons or HOFers in better condition. Don't forget you still have lots of time when you're older to buy the higher end cards in better condition. Feel free to email.

Regards to all,
Jay T206kid

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Posted By: jay behrens

Thanks, but listen to your Dad. You don't want to grow up to be like me, although I would recomend traveling the world like I did. It will give you a good appreciation for just how good you have it here in the US. If every kid grew up to live like me, the American economy would collapse.

Wanting to get cards on the cheap is a good thing though. Keep learning and get to shows that have dealers that sell vintage cards so that you can learn what real cards look and feel like. Keep reading and if you have questions, don't be afraid to ask.

Jay

I love pinatas. You get to beat the crap of something and get rewarded with candy.

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Posted By: Gilbert Maines

An SGC Authentic t205 Cobb sounds like a great first card to me.

t205s are one of the most attractive sets
the same for the holder and the reputation of the grader
and an authentic Cobb is a blue chip purchase with minimal downside

However, determining trimming of a card once holdered is difficult, particularly from a scan, but you could get lucky. And even if you don't get lucky, you still don't lose.

The way to determine how much to pay is to record the prices attained at auctions of similar cards while you are saving for your purchase. Then when you are ready to buy you are aware of the fair price range.

But not all authentic cards get that grade because of trimming.

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Posted By: Paul

With the T205 set, it is very common to find cards with retouched corners. Some of the gold flakes off the corners and the owner takes a gold pen and fills the color back in. These also will be graded "authentic" by SGC (unless they refuse to grade them at all). You might find that an "authentic" card with retouched corners looks better than a trimmed card.

As long as you're not looking for an investment -- and it sure sounds like you're not -- I think you are on the right track looking for an authentic Cobb. An SGC 10 or SGC 20 T205 Cobb could be very ugly, and might be more expensive than the authentic Cobb. So, authentic may be the way for you to go.

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Posted By: Lee Behrens

Buy what you can afford, you are not the only one in the same situation financial just because it is not up to standard of some people certainly doesn't mean there are people that enjoy what you enjoy. heck if you are happy with the card who elsee matters?

Lee

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Posted By: Cobby33

Listen to your dad!
Lawyering isn't all it's cracked up to be, but neither is being like...well...nevermind

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Posted By: Cat

Jason:

I have a son that is 15 and a sophomore in High School. He has a bit of a different baseball card collection strategy. He plays baseball on nearly a daily basis, but his only involvement with collecting is to root for me to spend large sums of money on cards that he likes. In the end, he knows that once I pass the cards will be his. I am not wishing your father any ill will but it's not a bad strategy. Do your homework (it looks like this thread contributes to that). Play sports. Collect cards with your spare time.

My son's future collection:

http://s6.photobucket.com/albums/y221/Cosbro/Collection/

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Posted By: John S

Jason,

If you are looking for a relative bargain check out Ty's T202. The end panel is nearly identical to the T205 plus you get the great Conlon center panel. I picked this example up on eBay for less than $300 and while it is fair at best it still presents well and was affordable.

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Posted By: Jeff Lichtman

Cat, I can't decide whose post was funnier, yours or Jay's.

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Posted By: Cat

Jeff:

I hope you are laughing "with me" and not "at me".

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Posted By: Jeff Lichtman

Oh, no doubt with you. However, I think sometimes people on this board don't realize how funny the stuff they post is.

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Posted By: jay behrens

Here is my lone Cobb card. Next to the t227, it is my favorite. The t205 would come in the 3rd. I will probablyly be replacing this card with a t205 as I have come to the conclusion that I would rather have a card with a biography than a card with no player info on the back.



If you want some other interesting players to check out, look up Ken Williams, Clyde Milan and Benny Kauff. These are a few of favorite non-HOFers.

Jay

I love pinatas. You get to beat the crap of something and get rewarded with candy.

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Posted By: Wesley

"I was thinking I wanted to be a lawyer so I could be rich and buy cards but now I want to be like Mr. Behrens and buy all my cards for nothing."

Welcome Jason. You have picked a super hobby role model in Jay Behren.

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Posted By: Joann

Jay,

Let me know when that E95 Cobb is headed for BST! And I'll respond to your email tomorrow when I have a little more time. Interesting, and thanks.

J

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Posted By: Cobby33

Nicely put.

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Posted By: Dylan

I've only been on the board a short time so im not well informed on everyone's personal life, what is it that Jay exactly does anyways? And why is it he gets cards for "nothing?"

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Posted By: davidcycleback

He mugs card collectors. It's a vocation and hobby all in one.

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Posted By: Dylan

As in hes a proffesional card theif? If he were i doubt hed talk about, in all seriousness whats the deal?

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Posted By: Jason Miller

Thank you so much for answering me. The teacher is going to let us show our letters on the class computer and whoever gets the most answers gets a surprise.

A girl named Sandy I used to like told me she did hers on Barbie dolls and she didnt get no answers. I was thinking that I dont want to like girls no more like you guys and just like cards from now on.

Well my dad says get of the computer now so I can get ready for school. I cant wait !!!!!!!

Jason Miller

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Posted By: Martin Neal

Hold on thar little doggy, there's nothing saying you can't like girls and cards, and in that order. It may appear that we may have our priorities askew but c'mon now, it's not that bad, is it?

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Posted By: Dave

wow

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Posted By: Bryan Long

and I come back to this. Jay is the best!!!!!! What have we become
As for the lawyers - he has a good point

Reading this forum is like having a puppy - you just never know what will happen next

.

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Posted By: Al C.risafulli

I want to be like Jay Behrens, too. Is there a class I can take?

-Al

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Posted By: jay behrens

Dylan, I basically gave a up on a lucrative, well paying career to live a stress free, non materialistic life. I've basically spent most of my adult life doing things that make me happy, rather than things that make me a lot of money. I drove limo for 10 years, managed night clubs and restaurants and owned a gaming and comic store for a few years. I currnetly work for Menards driving a forklift. Others will tell you I am card collecting terrorist

As to getting cards for nothing, that's not quite true. I keep detailed records of purchases and sales. Since my return to the hobby in 2001 my cash outlay, expendetures-sales, is just under $1800 on a collection of 278 cards worth about 10 times that amount. I have an asstute eye for good value and have been lucky enough to buy cards before they got hot, like t210s.

Jay

I love pinatas. You get to beat the crap of something and get rewarded with candy.

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Posted By: Ryan Christoff

Jason,

Glad to hear about your interest in vintage cards. I think the most important part of your collection-building process is educating yourself, which it sounds like you are doing. This is more important than owning a single card for now.

When I was your age I had a fairly substantial collection, at least compared to anyone else I knew that was my age. In fact, I bought my first car when I was 16 by selling off some Don Mattingly rookies. Well, after the Mattingly rookies were gone, everything else followed within a couple of years as girls and cars became much more important than building a collection. I think this is a pretty common experience for many collectors.

I didn't care about cards at all for a few years, but eventually I came back to them and started to build a collection again. I had a better idea of what I wanted to collect because I had some knowledge about the history of the game from when I was younger. I was reading about Ed Delahanty, Josh Gibson and Oscar Charleston while my friends were buying hundreds of Pete Incaviglia rookies.

Most of the cards I've ever made money on were ones that I overpaid for at the time, but bought because I loved them and never even considered the idea that I might one day sell.

I guess what I'm saying is if you buy cards you really like, you'll do just fine. If it's trimmed T205 Cobbs, then go get 'em.

Also, I agree with Jay, it wouldn't hurt to re-think your role models. (insert smiley face)

-Ryan

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Posted By: Jeff Lichtman

If I follow the Jay Behrens' stress-free model, what happens when I don't have the ridiculous monthly sums to spend on cards? I'd get very stressed out; then what? Jay, please advise.

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Posted By: jay behrens

You have to collect like I do, buy beaters and look for those hidden gems buried on eBay.

It's easy to throw large sums of money at the hobby and build a collection. Doing it on a very limited budget is a challenge in and of it itself. I no longer subscribe to the American way of life that involves instant gratification, so not being able to buy cards I want right now is not an issue and is a big reason why I can collect the way I do. With lots of disposible income, it is easy to get caught in the instant gratification thing and it's a hard habit to break.

Jay

I love pinatas. You get to beat the crap of something and get rewarded with candy.

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Posted By: JK

delete

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Posted By: Mike

The kid's convinced me. I too am giving up on girls, just like him and the guy who has over 3000 balls.

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Posted By: Anonymous

"I was thinking that I dont want to like girls no more like you guys..."

I think Jason believes that we are all gay...not that there is anything wrong with that.

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Posted By: Peter_Spaeth

But at least we get to hear more about Jay's philosophy of life which is a good thing. Lawyer bashing is always good too.

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Posted By: leon

I have not spoken with him (yet). Let's see what else goes on. I will not let this site become a farce for trolls. My immediate reaction was like yours but I want to be careful too. There must have been a dozen people who never believed Sean was 11-12 yrs old, EVEN after I said I spoke with him. I hope in a normal conversation on the phone I can tell the diference between an adult and a young child...

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Posted By: dennis

i'm w/jk & matt this "kid" can't be real!

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Posted By: jay behrens

His last response certainly is radically different from his original post. Dad obviously didn't screen that one.

Jay

I love pinatas. You get to beat the crap of something and get rewarded with candy.

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Posted By: Lee Behrens

Jay has a sugar Daddy.

Seriously, The second response seems to come more on the lines of Sean than the original post. I also question the legimicy (can't spell that word) but at least it is not as annoying as Sean's posts. I also question anyone that wants to makes Jay as a role model.

Lee

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Posted By: leon

I have emailed him and will find out later....This is one of those instances where the forum rules, about emailing a moderator, comes in handy. I would say this is 50-50 right now. He and I will speak on the phone and I will know more...or we won't and he won't post anymore.......too hard to tell (for me).

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Posted By: leon

I just received a very well written, very polite email, from Jason's father. I believe it's truly his father too. It's written as well as any letter on this board has ever been written (not from a very young child).

Here is what it said: (cut and pasted)


I will see to it that Jason understands that he is not allowed to post to your board again. He has been reading the board at my suggestion because of his interest in baseball cards.

He worked all weekend on his post for a school assignment, and I made sure that it was appropriate for your forum. This morning he asked if he could thank everyone because he was so excited by the responses. I did not think that your members would take offense to innocent comments from a child.

Please express my thanks to those that showed enough kindness to respond to Jason's question. To those that choose to doubt everything and everybody, and whose only contribution to your forum is to always assume the worst, I apologize for the intrusion. I am sure they did not think about the Jason's class reading their comments.

I appreciate the problems that you as moderator must handle. Leon, once again, I am sorry that we caused you any inconvenience..


my response...



Hi Mr. Miller
PLease understand that there are many people that come onto our board to start trouble. I am very protective for that reason. I can't tell you how many times people have impersonated other people in order to cause havoc. I almost always check on things just to make sure everything is on the up and up. I do it all of the time. It's my job Jason is more than welcome on the board but he needs to understand that he is on a board with older grown ups, for the most part. We do have a few teenagers though and they get along quite well. I did have to ban one 11 yr old as he kept doing things I asked him not too. I am sure Jason wouldn't do that. Again, he is more than welcome on the board I was just doing my job. Nothing personal. BTW, it's a pretty fun board most of the times. Sometimes it's rated PG though so you might want to be careful there.....Thanks for your kind email. (you are welcome to join in if you want to also)
best regards
leon

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Posted By: Al C.risafulli

I can't imagine anything cooler than a 13-year-old kid with an interest in vintage baseball cards, reading a message board with his dad. I wish my son (11 years old) had an interest in baseball cards; it would be an amazing activity to do together.

Jason and dad, welcome to a great hobby.

-Al

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Posted By: Frank Wakefield

Well I welcome the young man, and hope he returns, with a new question, one day.

I had a good mentor, and one excellent mentor, in this card collecting frenzy. Anyone out there completely self-taught?

From time to time I will give cards to kids when I learn they have an interest in cards. Some new cards of their favorite team, a few cards from when they were born, and then a T206 or a Goudey. About half the time that sets the hook, they want to know more about these old cards, and about the history of the game. Without some kids like that out there, who'll buy our cards from our heirs?

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Posted By: Bryan Long

Sometimes we are forced to think the worst of people just because a few bad apples have ruined it for everyone else. As an open forum we must protect ourselves in a way. I hope the kid keeps reading and heck, I hope he keeps posting questions. I wish I had this type of forum to read when I was his age. Of course, I also wish that I had started collecting these cards when I was his age. Sometimes we let the worst get a hold of us, but we all need to remember that card collecting is suppose to be fun, and I think that the younger blood on this forum keeps the kid in all of us a little closer.

You can always e-mail me with questions - I don't want to work anyway



.

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Posted By: JK

Welcome Jason and please accept my apologies for any doubts that I may have originally expressed.

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Posted By: John S

Jason, do not be discouraged by any negative comments or perceived lack of trust. As Leon stated, the board members are trying to protect this great resource. I was optimistic that your intentions were true. I vividly remember the treatment that I received as a young collector (I started before I was ten) interested in vintage material. Dealers and other collectors would shrug me off when I had questions either because they felt that I was just curious or had a light wallet (which I did). Almost thirty years later I continue to collect and to learn. Attaining knowledge would be my advice for you or any younger collector. Welcome aboard.

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Posted By: jay behrens

Jason, keep reading and ask questions when you have them.

Frank, I was very lucky to meet people such as Ron Oser, Bill Bossert, Mark Macrae, Dick Dobbins and John Spalding early in my collecting days and they taught me a lot. I had already read the book by Erbe and Mitchell, which in 1980 was about as good as it got for card info back then, but what these gentlemen taught was the ins and outs of the hobby, what truely was rare and what to look for in real cards.

Jay

I love pinatas. You get to beat the crap of something and get rewarded with candy.

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Posted By: dennis

Welcome Jason and accept my apologies for the doubts expressed. i think it's great a young person can show an interest in the old cards/history of bb. i have a daughter 15 and she thinks anything older than last year is ancient.

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Posted By: Josh Adams

Hi Jason! Happy collecting.
And remember, us lawyers aren't all that bad!

Go Go White Sox
2005 World Series Champions!

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Posted By: Rich Klein

The old rule about the only dumb question is the one not asked is very appropriate. How many of us when we were that age asked sophisticated questions about a complex hobby? However, I do agree that with this board, as well as most issues involving a computer, parent or guardian guidance is a big help. I could discuss issues such as MySpace.Com but let's stay with cards for now and help the young man when we can; just as certain dealers always make it a point to help youngsters.

Regards
Rich