1952 Christmas Rack Pack with Mantle

[xbaggypants]

That mantle is 100% fake, colour is off

[bobsbbcards]

Originally Posted by xbaggypants

That mantle is 100% fake, colour is off

+lots

[braves_43]

I was following this listing all last week. I came across it when it was an auction with an opening bid of $3,500 and no bids. I exchanged a few messages with the seller and he answered all my questions with no problem, but it started sounding like a scam when he said he had the pack on consignment from an "elderly gentleman" and he explained his "7 day return policy." I was already skeptical knowing that these Christmas rack packs are commonly tampered with and once I received confirmation that the Mantle is 100% fake, I definitely wasn't going to bid, but kept watching. The seller then jacked up the opening bid to $15,000 and I saw it "sold" for $20,000. So now it's relisted for even more? Total scam.

[russkcpa]

Originally Posted by braves_43

I was following this listing all last week. I came across it when it was an auction with an opening bid of $3,500 and no bids. I exchanged a few messages with the seller and he answered all my questions with no problem, but it started sounding like a scam when he said he had the pack on consignment from an "elderly gentleman" and he explained his "7 day return policy." I was already skeptical knowing that these Christmas rack packs are commonly tampered with and once I received confirmation that the Mantle is 100% fake, I definitely wasn't going to bid, but kept watching. The seller then jacked up the opening bid to $15,000 and I saw it "sold" for $20,000. So now it's relisted for even more? Total scam.

How did you confirm that the Mantle card was fake ? I loved his 5% or 10% "restocking charge"
Give me a break !!

[jfkheat]

This is the same seller that is selling 1986 Fleer basketball packs graded by Atlas Grading Company for $350-400.
James

[Stampsfan]

Originally Posted by russkcpa

How did you confirm that the Mantle card was fake ? I loved his 5% or 10% "restocking charge"
Give me a break !!

If it is returned, he needs to put it back into his kids Christmas Stocking...

[nat]

"I tried to ask the seller a few questions but he banned me from asking questions or bidding."


Banned for asking questions? That's like putting up a bat signal saying "this is fake".

[bbcard1]

I have heard these are/were repacks. I would think it unlikely there would be both white and gray backs. It seems way too good to be true.

[russkcpa]

Originally Posted by nat

"I tried to ask the seller a few questions but he banned me from asking questions or bidding."


Banned for asking questions? That's like putting up a bat signal saying "this is fake".

He banned me to because I asked a question about the bottom of the package. Seller is a total AH

[hcv123]

Unknowing buyer would have to open pack to send in and find out card is a fake. If they bought it thinking it was real, they would likely never open it and find out

[irv]

I wrote the seller last night asking him some less than desirable questions about these packs and cards but received no reply as of yet.

As far as I know, I am not blocked/banned, but I will say I am disappointed to see he doesn't ship to Canada.

[russkcpa]

Originally Posted by irv

I wrote the seller last night asking him some less than desirable questions about these packs and cards but received no reply as of yet.

As far as I know, I am not blocked/banned, but I will say I am disappointed to see he doesn't ship to Canada.

Try and ask him another question. My guess is you have been BLOCKED
Let me know

[irv]

Originally Posted by russkcpa

Try and ask him another question. My guess is you have been BLOCKED
Let me know

"Message sent" so I am not blocked yet. I just finished asking him if he had any reply/answers to my questions.

[glynparson]

The rack with the bad Mantle has been bouncing around, someone attempted to sell to my friend who owns Mt. Penn Sportscards in Pa. Please avoid the fantasy Christmas packs.

[the 'stache]

For $24k, he should walk the card up to Canada!

Originally Posted by irv

I wrote the seller last night asking him some less than desirable questions about these packs and cards but received no reply as of yet.

As far as I know, I am not blocked/banned, but I will say I am disappointed to see he doesn't ship to Canada.

[irv]

Originally Posted by the 'stache

For $24k, he should walk the card up to Canada!

I agree!

Searching this site again, I seen some more info on these rack packs.
http://www.1952toppsbaseballcards.co...ckPackPage.htm

Anyone know who Robert Haimer is?

[Bestdj777]

The scary part about this all is the buyer isn't going to learn it's fake, if ever, until he opens the package and sends in the Mantle for grading, at which point good luck returning it.

[chalupacollects]

4 user ID's in 4 years.. newest one not even a month old...

[russkcpa]

Originally Posted by chalupacollects

4 user ID's in 4 years.. newest one not even a month old...

Nice pick up. Never bothered to check that. I guess that says a lot

[glynparson]

I am the son. My dad is not completely ignorant about cards but he would ask me what i thought. thanks for clarifying, Tony was a little vague on the text he sent me.

[savedfrommyspokes]

Looks like Vickey must have a stack of fake 52 Mantle's laying around her place in Harford CT....I believe she is the same seller offering this fine fake specimen.


http://www.ebay.com/itm/1952-TOPPS-M...p2047675.l2557



http://net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=245231

[ALR-bishop]

I think Mark Murphy was the first, or one of the first to sell these, and advertised them in SCD. He said they were restocked Topps cards repackaged by a 3d party and sold in retail stores. But he did not or could not name the retail stores or the 3d party packager, and the dates that the packaging supposedly took place have varied ( 60s, 70s, 80s).

There has also been disputes about which Topps issues were initially involved. I think Murphy originally sold 54-63. Later, earlier and subsequent years appeared. Even if his story is true, there is no doubt someone else is continuing the process.

Some people claim to be able to tell the "originals" from the later productions looking at staples and the configurations of the packaging. The folks claiming this are usually selling them.

Here is some correspondence I had with Murphy and his partner about them

[russkcpa]

Well it's back on Ebay as an auction item. SHOCKING that Mantle is now most likely a reprint.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/1952-TOPPS-...UAAOSw-5dZ9i19

[ALR-bishop]

The one negative the seller has is pretty funny

[lutherlafy]

I think that Christmas rack packs the majority if not all are faked.
Great idea to make a lot of money from vintage collectors.
I would not buy one with your money.
No grading company will grade or authenticate them.
That should be a clue.

[ALR-bishop]

Glen-- I could be tempted to buy one with "your" money

[BillP]

Always tempted to buy a rack pack Xmas or not, or wax. But I'm always thinking about condition, off center or other. In the end the odds of finding something legit or real good are very low. 1955 bowman mantle aside.

So in the end i'll stay away.

[jchcollins]

Originally Posted by BillP

Always tempted to buy a rack pack Xmas or not, or wax. But I'm always thinking about condition, off center or other. In the end the odds of finding something legit or real good are very low. 1955 bowman mantle aside.

So in the end i'll stay away.

The '55 Bowman Mantle from the National last year was out of cello, not a rack - at least that is my recollection. It's currently up in the Goldin October Legends auction where the current bid is $26k. Um yeah, I'll take two...

Fun to me to peruse this thread again. I am far too skeptical of the Christmas Racks phenomena to ever spend a decent buck on them, but must admit I like / love the idea of them if even a small percentage were "real" and ever done like this back in the 1960's or 70's or at least before the hobby became fully self-aware in the mid-1980's. As a kid, there were always cards I pined after and (certainly in the days before the interwebs...) could literally never find simply because I was not old enough. In my example, I started collecting in 1986, and would always want a particular card from maybe the early 80's or even the late 70's that I had seen somewhere, but could never find for myself with limited resources and having to beg my folks to take me to a card shop. So I'm picturing how cool it would have been for a kid in 1965 to walk into a store and find a 1956 or 1960 Christmas rack with a Mantle showing on closeout...

I guess we'll never know whether things like that actually happened or not...but if so I bet it made some kids really happy. :-)

[GasHouseGang]

There's a different 1952 Christmas pack opening posted on YouTube with the Page/Sain error. If the cards are real that pack might have been worth getting.
You can watch the video at:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OlmqRP6-HDM

Any opinions on authenticity?