A 1952 Topps complete set. Starting "the" ultimate post war project

[toppcat]

Originally Posted by cardsagain74

Mathews!

Struck a deal on this PSA 3 for 2800. The last clean PSA 3 sale was 2700 from a pwcc auction in late March, and I think mine may be a little nicer.

Never noticed before that if you accept an offer outside of Ebay's initial "best offer" setting, the sold listings only show the beginning BIN price (overstating the sale).

You can enter the item number on this site and get the actual price: http://www.watchcount.com/

Not sure I understand about what an offer outside of Best Offer means though?

[cardsagain74]

Originally Posted by toppcat

You can enter the item number on this site and get the actual price: http://www.watchcount.com/

Not sure I understand about what an offer outside of Best Offer means though?

Thanks for the tip!

I meant that instead of the listing having the option to make a best offer, when you write a seller a general message to discuss a possible offer instead (and then they send you an initial offer on their own)

[toppcat]

Originally Posted by cardsagain74

Thanks for the tip!

I meant that instead of the listing having the option to make a best offer, when you write a seller a general message to discuss a possible offer instead (and then they send you an initial offer on their own)

Ah, got it. I doubt Watchcount can track that unless you agree the final deal you worked out back on the 'bay proper. Watchcount is very useful though for gauging how much of an offer to make. It's saved me a ton over the years.

[cardsagain74]

First, thanks to Ted and Cesar here for helping (mostly) finish off my missing low numbers.

Overall update coming very soon once my last recent order gets here.

Tonight, I came very close to a last minute auction bid on a great looking PSA 1.5 Mantle. But did not pull the trigger. It went for $17,300.

While I would've been satisfied with having that one for my set, it's just not exactly what I picture for it anymore. As this set has filled in, the overall outlook has changed a little. And for a once in a lifetime purchase, it has to fit just right.

The only problem with waiting is (obviously) prices going even higher. But if that happens and it affects what I can get down the road, then so be it. Always been a risk-taker anyway!

[cardsagain74]

The low number set is now complete! Pending the last seven commons/minors that will be here in the next couple days. Close enough to count New pics coming after those remaining few are in hand.

Got a nice looking PSA 2.5 Pafko to start out the set. Also picked up Mathews and Jackie Robinson (as shown prior) and a few other new high numbers.

Still need 73 high numbers, including Mantle, Campanella, Reese, Dickey, Wilhelm, and Bartirome. Going to make a small adjustment up in the calculated resale value from some price appreciation that's occurred lately.

Final low number avg condition:

Big cards: 4.0
Commons/minors: 2.6
Total low # cost: $4480

Current high # avg condition:

Big cards: 3.0
Commons/minors: 2.8
High number cost: $6800

Overall recap:

Total cost: $11,280
Total resale value: estimated $15,000 - $16,000

334/407

[cardsagain74]

Updated pics

Graded low numbers:




Rest of low number set:



Jackie R and Mathews:



Most of the other high numbers:

[irv]

Your cards look great, John.

Congrats on your progress so far!

[cesarcap]

So John, Which cards do you like more than you expected (say under rated) and I'm not talking value-wise, mean aesthetics-wise. I like the Zernial: That one is really a cool baseball card. I also like Johnny Mize, while it's a bit dark or brown but you can instantly tell that it's Yankee stadium.

And that Jackie Robinson! I used to think his 56 was his best card, but the red background and smile have changed my opinion on this card which I thought was over rated before.

[cardsagain74]

Originally Posted by cesarcap

So John, Which cards do you like more than you expected (say under rated) and I'm not talking value-wise, mean aesthetics-wise. I like the Zernial: That one is really a cool baseball card. I also like Johnny Mize, while it's a bit dark or brown but you can instantly tell that it's Yankee stadium.

And that Jackie Robinson! I used to think his 56 was his best card, but the red background and smile have changed my opinion on this card which I thought was over rated before.

Of the cards above, I love the look of the Billy Martin. The background is a contrast to the somewhat dark feel that much of the set has.

The other one that always stood out to me was Rocky Bridges (I'll have to flip back through and find more). He seems so happy to be taking a classic swing with the light sky in the background. Reminds me of my summer carefree playing days.

[cardsagain74]

A slightly important package got here this morning. Looked it over, took a pic. Just held it for a minute. Then straight to the safe deposit box!

Am still in awe:

[Republicaninmass]

Nice one! Sure is a keeper

Jansen, a fan favorite. For years people thought he was signaling the year "52" but in the reverse looking like "25".

Turned out, he has his 7th child, just prior to the photo

[cesarcap]

Wow that is a nice Mantle. Congrats!

[cesarcap]

So will you do a PSA set registry? I eventually plan to even if many of the low commons get a 3-4 and high's get a 1.

[cardsagain74]

Originally Posted by cesarcap

So will you do a PSA set registry? I eventually plan to even if many of the low commons get a 3-4 and high's get a 1.

I'm not planning to. Since every single low # common is raw (and many would be grade 2-3), just going to leave them alone.

The registry competition does seem fun. But that would mean effort

[cesarcap]

I hear you. I will break this up into stages. Grade the highs, HoF's, then maybe do by series.

I also will evaluate buying graded ones versus submitting mine as I like having everything in a binder.

I have a full 67 set and about 200 graded ones. I rarely lug the boxes down to look at the cards: 9 out of 10 times I reach for the binder.

[cardsagain74]

This has come to a halt lately at 335/407.

When it comes to all those high numbers, seeing a possible "lifetime" project after all! Now that I managed to get the rest of the big cards, it makes you feel more impatient to have the whole set.

But I can't stomach paying triple the going rate for BIN leftovers

[cardsagain74]

Naturally after the prior post, managed to get a few acceptable deals on small lots and singles of high number commons/minors.

Feeling a little closer now

352/407

[cardsagain74]

A shopping spree with ebay bucks during this month.

One away from being past the halfway point for the high numbers!

358/407

[irv]

Originally Posted by cardsagain74

A shopping spree with ebay bucks during this month.

One away from being past the halfway point for the high numbers!

358/407

Good stuff, John!

Continued good luck with your quest.

[cardsagain74]

For the first time in awhile, there are new additions here. Key ones too!

Picked up Campanella and Reese from a forum member. Now the only main cards left are Hoyt Wilhelm and....for the love of god....Tony Bartirome.

360/407

[irv]

Originally Posted by cardsagain74

For the first time in awhile, there are new additions here. Key ones too!

Picked up Campanella and Reese from a forum member. Now the only main cards left are Hoyt Wilhelm and....for the love of god....Tony Bartirome.

360/407

Great looking cards. John!

Congrats!

[cardsagain74]

Originally Posted by irv

Great looking cards. John!

Congrats!

Thanks Dale.

Now the question is: do I wait to see if Bartirome crashes eventually (or risk that situation getting even worse)?

[jingram058]

What a beautiful set you are putting together! To me, this would be the ultimate set to have...maybe in the next life.

[cardsagain74]

Originally Posted by jingram058

What a beautiful set you are putting together! To me, this would be the ultimate set to have...maybe in the next life.

Appreciate it!

If I do finish putting this together, it will feel so surreal. Especially since it was built from scratch. And if that happens, I won't be concerned with upgrades or finding more challenges with it. Will just enjoy.

Sure there are some other vintage sets that I'll finish or find eventually, but nothing else in my collection will ever come close to this.

So many people love your '53 Bowmans too. I feel like one of the few who hasn't joined that ship

[cardsagain74]

Three low grade PSA commons picked up.

I've joined the '52 Topps set builders page on facebook. It doesn't appear to get you any closer with the high numbers

363/407

[Republicaninmass]

Every 4....is 1% closer

[cardsagain74]

One more (very) low grade common picked up.

The race is (verrrrry) slow.

364/407

[LincolnVT]

Great thread! I've made some good progress recently on my lower grade (G -- EX) set. Such a great group of cards...so pretty...this is one of my favorite cards in the set. Now I'm looking for the following:

261, 289, 311, 312, 315, 330, 343, 345, 351, 356, 362, 369, 370, 373, 376, 378, 379, 382, 384, 386, 392, 395, 396, 398, 399, 403, 404, 406, 407.

[Exhibitman]

I am only putting together the HOFers and a few other cards I like (Zernial, Rosen, Minoso, etc.). I am down to a handful of cards I need.

Unfortunately, they are Rizzuto Snider Mays Mantle Reese Wilhelm and Matthews.

[cardsagain74]

A PSA 2.5 Bartirome is now on its way (along with some commons). Am glad to get him out of the way. Because even though the evolution of the market in the last four years for that card is so bizarre, and it could crash at some point, you just don't know if it will get even more impossible in upcoming years.

I'd rather risk mine losing 600-700 in value than have to possibly two or three thousand more for it down the road, or have the supply dry up even more for it.

Down to 34 left now.

373/407

[cardsagain74]

And one more common now coming from Ted. Two updates in an hour

374/407

[Republicaninmass]

Went against my own habits and bought the bvg 7.5.burgess. the ONLY high I've been able to add in months. Thanks again John, it's been fun watching

[campyfan39]

I haven’t bought 52’s in a while. Is the Tony B so expensive because that crazy guy bought so many of them? So did his strategy work?

Originally Posted by cardsagain74

A PSA 2.5 Bartirome is now on its way (along with some commons). Am glad to get him out of the way. Because even though the evolution of the market in the last four years for that card is so bizarre, and it could crash at some point, you just don't know if it will get even more impossible in upcoming years.

I'd rather risk mine losing 600-700 in value than have to possibly two or three thousand more for it down the road, or have the supply dry up even more for it.

Down to 34 left now.

373/407

[irv]

Originally Posted by campyfan39

I haven’t bought 52’s in a while. Is the Tony B so expensive because that crazy guy bought so many of them? So did his strategy work?

I believe that is the case? Many, from what I understand were also purchasing them and then re-selling them to him as he was continuing his quest to purchase as many as he could? (Link below)
https://www.net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=211710

[cardsagain74]

Originally Posted by campyfan39

I haven’t bought 52’s in a while. Is the Tony B so expensive because that crazy guy bought so many of them? So did his strategy work?

He succeeded in the value of the card going way up, though naturally there's no way of really knowing how many he had (or if/when he's sold them).

What stands out to me is that he began doing this over 5 years ago (but in all that time, nothing has changed with the card's "toughness" or price trend). Usually when there's a pump and dump or really artificial move higher in an asset's value, the rise and fall happens in just a matter of months. People are impatient to make their quick buck and move on.

But since that hasn't happened yet with the Bartirome after all this time, I didn't want to take the chance of the card (or the perception of it) continuing to get more difficult to find in upcoming years, and it becoming that much more expensive.

[Republicaninmass]

He has continued buying, and has not sold any to my knowledge. Last count, believe he had 50.

[irv]

Originally Posted by Republicaninmass

He has continued buying, and has not sold any to my knowledge. Last count, believe he had 50.

Assuming all those are his, he has 45 alone on the first page/first post I linked in the post above.

[cardsagain74]

Originally Posted by Republicaninmass

He has continued buying, and has not sold any to my knowledge. Last count, believe he had 50.

Is he still posting publicly about any of this? I figured he'd also been banned from other forums and who knows where else

[Republicaninmass]

I believe he is still lurking, but havent seen him post publically. His ID (s) has still been bidding on bartiromes.

[Exhibitman]

Originally Posted by cardsagain74

For the first time in awhile, there are new additions here. Key ones too!

Picked up Campanella and Reese from a forum member. Now the only main cards left are Hoyt Wilhelm and....for the love of god....Tony Bartirome.

360/407

Damned fine cards, John.

[cardsagain74]

Originally Posted by Exhibitman

Damned fine cards, John.

Appreciate it Adam.

I'm pleased with the eye appeal of the top of the set, and that I was able to get the big boys in grade 3 and most of the other huge cards in around grade 4 without breaking the bank. And all clean except for Jackie (even though it's a very weak 3, am glad to have gotten him at all just before the spike in recent months).

The commons (both high and low #) drag down the overall set grade a little since about half of them would be 1.5s or 2s, but that's ok. It's difficult enough to build this at all, much less get everything in at least VG

[savedfrommyspokes]

Originally Posted by cardsagain74

And all clean except for Jackie (even though it's a very weak 3, am glad to have gotten him at all just before the spike in recent months).

The Jackie card is the only regret (in regards to not seriously pursuing a copy pre-spike) I have had in building my 52 set...I simply waited way too long to find a Jackie as I had no idea this card would nearly double in value in such a short period of time. Earlier in the year, similar grades were going for almost half of what I paid for a copy last week.

In watching prices (as compared to typical market values) for the key cards in this set over the past 15 years, I noticed typically December is the best month to buy. Well this year that theory did not hold water as the Jackie was twice the price this December as it was last spring. I don't believe I have seen the Mantle, Mays or Mathews from this set double in value over any given 6 month period like the Jackie has.

Will the spike of this card continue in 2021?

[cardsagain74]

Originally Posted by savedfrommyspokes

The Jackie card is the only regret (in regards to not seriously pursuing a copy pre-spike) I have had in building my 52 set...I simply waited way too long to find a Jackie as I had no idea this card would nearly double in value in such a short period of time. Earlier in the year, similar grades were going for almost half of what I paid for a copy last week.

In watching prices (as compared to typical market values) for the key cards in this set over the past 15 years, I noticed typically December is the best month to buy. Well this year that theory did not hold water as the Jackie was twice the price this December as it was last spring. I don't believe I have seen the Mantle, Mays or Mathews from this set double in value over any given 6 month period like the Jackie has.

Will the spike of this card continue in 2021?

The '52 Mays has had a big push lately (though it took awhile to participate much in the covid boom). But once it finally did, it caught up quick.

Mathews has still been a laggard this year though. To the point where Jackie may have passed it as the second-most valuable card in the set. Neck and neck now. For a card that has always been so prized and seen as so incredibly difficult, you would've thought it would do a little better.

As far as 2021, I'd be surprised if things didn't level off. When even the easier cards like Mays have spiked, that could be a sign that the overall pop (even for the "leaders" like Jackie) has about run its course

[Exhibitman]

well, I am just watching and scheming and picking them up when it makes sense



Which is made much easier by me not giving a damn about grade or slab.




Though I will get a slab when it makes sense:

[campyfan39]

Great cards! I detest grading and have cracked my share of cases. Love seeing these "pure" (not raw) cards!

Originally Posted by Exhibitman

well, I am just watching and scheming and picking them up when it makes sense



Which is made much easier by me not giving a damn about grade or slab.




Though I will get a slab when it makes sense:

[Exhibitman]

Thing is I gravitate towards cards that looked like they did when i was a kid. My 1970s cards were pack-fresh but OC (Topps) and my vintage cards were well-loved. Makes it a lot easier to collect older cards on a reasonable budget.

[cardsagain74]

Originally Posted by Exhibitman

Thing is I gravitate towards cards that looked like they did when i was a kid. My 1970s cards were pack-fresh but OC (Topps) and my vintage cards were well-loved. Makes it a lot easier to collect older cards on a reasonable budget.

That's just how I've always felt. Along with it being cheaper, I even enjoy having sets with some off-centered cards. A mix of all kinds of centering gives it more of a realistic feel.

My arbitrary cutoff for not minding "well-loved cards" is all vintage prior to 1972. That's the year that the sets start to really lose value and feel more modern. With this '52, I would have been fine with a full set of grade 1.5s, but the better deals for the HOFers ended up being in that 3-4 range.

[JollyElm]

What would a basic (ungraded) 1952 high number common generally cost in mid-grade? I know this is a wide open question, but just think of it conversationally. A guy at yesterday's show had 4 or 5 high numbers (looking ex or so) and I asked him what he would need to get for them, and just wanna see if it was in the right ballpark (pun intended).

[savedfrommyspokes]

Originally Posted by JollyElm

What would a basic (ungraded) 1952 high number common generally cost in mid-grade? I know this is a wide open question, but just think of it conversationally. A guy at yesterday's show had 4 or 5 high numbers (looking ex or so) and I asked him what he would need to get for them, and just wanna see if it was in the right ballpark (pun intended).

Most of the PSA 5 Hi # commons in my set ran from $150-200...the centering of each card played caused any given card to fall on the lower or higher end of the range. I don't have any raw commons though, so I am unable to speak to raw prices.

[Republicaninmass]

Surprisingly the High's dont have as much disparity among grades as the low series. PSA 1-6 are usually below 400. I know it's weird, but Rosens big find of highs, unless you are 7 or better, kind of killed the mid grade market for highs. 75 for a psa 1 or 200 for a psa 4. There are exceptions for minor stars, but it is strange.


Myself, focused on solely dead centered cards after culling through probably 10,000 52s. From about good to VG, it doesn't matter, but centering is a must for me.