The Next "Big Cards"

[con40]

Keep an eye on players who played in the Negro Leagues. Once MLB adds their stats to the official record, their stats will be impressive, and collectors will take notice.

Of course ol' Satch, but Monte Irvin, Larry Doby, Roy Campanella, and Don Newcombe could all see some serious price increases.

[packs]

Originally Posted by rats60

No, the hobby has always treated only national issues as rookie cards, not regionals. The Bell Brand isn't considered a rookie for Maury Wills. The highest a Bond Bread has sold for is 32k last December.

Even if it the set doesn't meet the same definition as Leaf, the significance of the Portrait card should outweigh anything else. It is without a doubt the very first card of Jackie and the very first appearance of an African American in an MLB uniform on a card.

This Goldin write up has a nice summary on its distribution history:

https://goldinauctions.com/LotDetail...entoryid=27398

[DeanH3]

Originally Posted by packs

Even if it the set doesn't meet the same definition as Leaf, the significance of the Portrait card should outweigh anything else. It is without a doubt the very first card of Jackie and the very first appearance of an African American in an MLB uniform on a card.

This Goldin write up has a nice summary on its distribution history:

https://goldinauctions.com/LotDetail...entoryid=27398

That is a nice write up. According to the article, these should not be looked at as a regional issue as they were distributed throughout the country. I do think that perspective is gaining steam. As the "regional issue" myth diminishes these should compete or even surpass the Leaf at some point. The Bond Bread is just too important of an issue on so many levels not to be seen as more important than the Leaf. But that's just my opinion.

[rats60]

Originally Posted by DeanH3

That is a nice write up. According to the article, these should not be looked at as a regional issue as they were distributed throughout the country. I do think that perspective is gaining steam. As the "regional issue" myth diminishes these should compete or even surpass the Leaf at some point. The Bond Bread is just too important of an issue on so many levels not to be seen as more important than the Leaf. But that's just my opinion.

Black neighborhoods in a few cities is not a national issue. AHs write up whatever they want to sell a card. The Goldin Leaf 7 ended up at 392k. I don't ever see a regional competing with the Leaf RC.

[DeanH3]

We are all entitled to our opinions. But as long as AH's keep propagating that the Leaf is his rookie, like you said, just to sell a card, then that myth will continue. You can split whatever hair you want in defining what the definition of a "national issue" means. But to me if they were available in other cities, even if it was only in black neighborhoods, then that counts. I could be wrong and the Leaf reigns supreme. But, as more people are educated on the Bond Bread set the perception could change.

[Exhibitman]

The 1948 Swell Sports Thrills predates the Leaf Robinson...

[packs]

It is a historically significant card. That should supersede anything about the Leaf. I believe in time it will.

[irv]

Off topic, but can someone tell me what this PSA 9 Jackie finished for tonight including the BP.
https://goldinauctions.com/1952_Topp...-LOT77920.aspx

[here2havefun]

Originally Posted by irv

Off topic, but can someone tell me what this PSA 9 Jackie finished for tonight including the BP.
https://goldinauctions.com/1952_Topp...-LOT77920.aspx

$800K hammer price, $960K w/ BP

[rats60]

Originally Posted by DeanH3

We are all entitled to our opinions. But as long as AH's keep propagating that the Leaf is his rookie, like you said, just to sell a card, then that myth will continue. You can split whatever hair you want in defining what the definition of a "national issue" means. But to me if they were available in other cities, even if it was only in black neighborhoods, then that counts. I could be wrong and the Leaf reigns supreme. But, as more people are educated on the Bond Bread set the perception could change.

When the term "rookie card" was defined in the early 80s this was discussed. Nationally issued means the card is available to the majority collectors, not just a few in certain areas of the country. Bond Bread is the definition of regional. The only myth being spread is that something other than the Leaf and Bowman are rookie cards. Judging from Goldin last night, most of the hobby's opinion is still the Leaf is the rookie card to own. I don't see that ever changing.

[irv]

Originally Posted by here2havefun

$800K hammer price, $960K w/ BP

Wow, just under a million.

Thank you!

[packs]

Originally Posted by rats60

When the term "rookie card" was defined in the early 80s this was discussed. Nationally issued means the card is available to the majority collectors, not just a few in certain areas of the country. Bond Bread is the definition of regional. The only myth being spread is that something other than the Leaf and Bowman are rookie cards. Judging from Goldin last night, most of the hobby's opinion is still the Leaf is the rookie card to own. I don't see that ever changing.

The Leaf’s take off is extremely recent. I don’t think you can say things won’t change. In the time that the Leaf was taking off there haven’t really been too many sales of the Bond Bread Portrait card. If some were to hit the block right now I think you’d see a significant jump in the sale price of the Bond Bread too.

Definitions are what you make of them. The Bond Bread portrait card is one of the most significant issues in baseball card history and its place should be higher whether it’s “regional” or not. It predates the Leaf by at least a year and in some cases 2 years since Leaf was issued into 1949.

[Exhibitman]

if the 'rookie' is predated by other cards, often for years, then what's the point of the 'rookie' designation other than marketing? As I pointed out, and as Ted Z will attest, the Leaf was not issued in 1948, it was issued in 1949. That makes the 1949 Bowman just as much of a RC.

[LincolnVT]

Tough to find a numerically graded example under 10k these days. Great looking card and a key high number of the 1952 Topps set. Important card on many fronts.

Originally Posted by irv

Wow, just under a million.

Thank you!

[packs]

There is enough evidence, as the Goldin description points out, that the cards were available in mostly every major American city and even Canada. If something is available in every major city it is nationally distributed in my opinion.

[Exhibitman]

Originally Posted by packs

There is enough evidence, as the Goldin description points out, that the cards were available in mostly every major American city and even Canada. If something is available in every major city it is nationally distributed in my opinion.

Not only that, the evidence Goldin cites shows that the portrait was first in 1947 but the next six cards were issued in 1948, BEFORE the Leaf card. So, there are seven different cards from this issue that absolutely predate the Leaf card. Then there are the rounded-corner set of 48 cards. That one also predates the 1949-issued Leaf card. Also, the Jackie Robinson Exhibit card was issued 1949 or earlier.

[LincolnVT]

Reguardless of which card is his Rookie, we are talking about the next big card in this thread. Both the Leaf and the 1952 Topps are gaining much more quickly than the Bond Bread cards...likely because they are more widely recognized and key cards to multi-player sets.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Parade Sportive predates any of the ones just discussed.

[egri]

I could see the 1953 Topps Jackie Robinson taking off, although I haven't been following unsigned ones too closely. Signed copies have gone through the roof lately, to the point where I would be priced out if I still needed one. It's a beautiful card, and #1 in the set.

[Exhibitman]

Neither qualifies as the next big thing--already there.

[ezez420]

Memory Lane has the entire Swell Set with the Jackie Robinson in a high grade PSA 4 right now. Let’s see where it goes. People on eBay trying to push 1.5s at $12500


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[Exhibitman]

Originally Posted by ezez420

Memory Lane has the entire Swell Set with the Jackie Robinson in a high grade PSA 4 right now. Let’s see where it goes. People on eBay trying to push 1.5s at $12500


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I sold my 3 for $4K last month. Had to take that profit...if it goes up from there, good for the buyer.

As for next cards, I can tell you that the heat wave hasn't reached most football, hockey or boxing. Marquee star players have gone up but rank and file HOFers not yet. Not a bad time to be snapping up inexpensive second-tier cards.

[packs]

Originally Posted by LincolnVT

Reguardless of which card is his Rookie, we are talking about the next big card in this thread. Both the Leaf and the 1952 Topps are gaining much more quickly than the Bond Bread cards...likely because they are more widely recognized and key cards to multi-player sets.

I was bringing the Bond Bread Portrait up because I think it is the next big card. It is one of the most historically significant baseball cards ever issued (in my opinion).

[ezez420]

I agree the portrait bond bread is the rookie to get.


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[Frankish]

Originally Posted by Exhibitman

As for next cards, I can tell you that the heat wave hasn't reached most football, hockey or boxing. Marquee star players have gone up but rank and file HOFers not yet. Not a bad time to be snapping up inexpensive second-tier cards.

That's an interesting thought. I don't track prices closely unless it's something I'm actively building. But even a lunkhead like me has noticedcHowe, Richard, Orr and some of the early 80s (plus Gretzky of course) hockey RCs rise pretty sharply over the last year. And in football, Namath, Jim Brown, of course, Payton, and to a degree Starr, Unitas, Bradshaw, Staubach, Montana and more modern players.

Any idea where the current line lies, especially in football, for cards that haven't shot up yet? Many of the HOFers may never really appreciate (in my amateur and often wrong opinion). I love Ernie Barnes (as much or more for his painting as his playing), Rosie Grier, and Merlin Olsen, but I'm not sure enough collectors ever will top make a difference.....

[packs]

One of my favorite cards:

[LincolnVT]

Don't get me wrong, it is a beautiful, significant and important card...in any condition.

Originally Posted by packs

I was bringing the Bond Bread Portrait up because I think it is the next big card. It is one of the most historically significant baseball cards ever issued (in my opinion).

[Exhibitman]

Originally Posted by Frankish

That's an interesting thought. I don't track prices closely unless it's something I'm actively building. But even a lunkhead like me has noticedcHowe, Richard, Orr and some of the early 80s (plus Gretzky of course) hockey RCs rise pretty sharply over the last year. And in football, Namath, Jim Brown, of course, Payton, and to a degree Starr, Unitas, Bradshaw, Staubach, Montana and more modern players.

Any idea where the current line lies, especially in football, for cards that haven't shot up yet? Many of the HOFers may never really appreciate (in my amateur and often wrong opinion). I love Ernie Barnes (as much or more for his painting as his playing), Rosie Grier, and Merlin Olsen, but I'm not sure enough collectors ever will top make a difference.....

I would look at early cards (2nd, 3rd) of the superstars first. I think there's still room for those, esp. as the RCs soar out of range of most collectors even in 'collector' grade.

[JeremyW]

Looks like the '52 Topps Mantle is the next really big one. A PSA 3 just "sold" for $75K. A nice PSA 1.5 is at $36K.

[Popcorn]

Keep a eye on this one (not mine) :

https://www.ebay.com/itm/1939-Goudey...EAAOSwhCxgQ-pY

[itjclarke]

Originally Posted by ezez420

I agree the portrait bond bread is the rookie to get.


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1000%. It may never catch the Leaf in dollar amount, but has historically been a better value, and given its relative scarcity, has a lot more room to grow once the main stream collectors... errr, investors, get wind of it, and the fact it pre-dates Leaf by 2x years. Up until a few months ago it still seemed pretty easy to get a nice looking low grade example. No longer. Similar applies for the round corner version.

[Neal]

I love the portrait, but there are others too

robinson,j47.jpgrobinson47rev.jpg

[vansaad]

Originally Posted by Neal

I love the portrait, but there are others too

Attachment 445381Attachment 445382

Nice card. I wish PSA would clean up the registry and be more consistent with the variations. Here is the same version as "Awaiting Pitch".

[pawpawdiv9]

Originally Posted by JeremyW

Looks like the '52 Topps Mantle is the next really big one. A PSA 3 just "sold" for $75K. A nice PSA 1.5 is at $36K.

Looks like i need to 'up my insurance coverage'
I had no idea 2's where 40k cards now.

Originally Posted by con40

Keep an eye on players who played in the Negro Leagues. Once MLB adds their stats to the official record, their stats will be impressive, and collectors will take notice.

Of course ol' Satch, but Monte Irvin, Larry Doby, Roy Campanella, and Don Newcombe could all see some serious price increases.

didnt know this. explains the bid war going on with the Leaf Paige.

[Exhibitman]

Originally Posted by packs

I was bringing the Bond Bread Portrait up because I think it is the next big card. It is one of the most historically significant baseball cards ever issued (in my opinion).

I concur, which is why I am hanging on to mine.

[DeanH3]

Originally Posted by Exhibitman

I concur, which is why I am hanging on to mine.

I'm with you too Adam. I think this is the sentiment of those that have one. Most likely the reason we don't see many hit the auction block. It would be interesting to see what prices would be if a handful did hit the market.

[Exhibitman]

Nicer looking than the 1949 Leaf too.

[Frankish]

One player I'm surprised never really took off is Yogi Berra. An argument could be made for the greatest MLB catcher of all time, certainly top five. Ten World Series championships as player. One of the greatest baseball personalities off the diamond. Long career with one of the top franchises. Etc. Admittedly, he wasn't a home run king, but 358 career HRs is pretty impressive.

Maybe his long career hurts him some. 40+ years in the majors as player/coach/manager doesn't exactly lead to a rarity factor. He was always second or third fiddle on the Yankees, which almost anyone would be next to DiMaggio, Mantle, etc. And he didn't exactly have the leading man looks of Williams, Mantle, or Clemente.

Still, all told, especially given that his early cards are part of some iconic sets, I'm pleasantly surprised most of them are still (relatively) affordable. I love Yogi and like to pick up his cards when I can, so on net I guess it's positive....

[71buc]

I believe both Spahn and Snider are undervalued as well. Both of them are featured in some of the most iconic sets and most of their 1950s cards are highly visually appealing.

[itjclarke]

The rounded corner Bond Bread Robinson has been increasing steadily over the past few years, but if this sale is legit, seems may be ready for a breakout.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/1947-Bond-B...7/265081752083

Same grade sold for under $6K about 4 months ago, and was selling for less than $1K a year and a half ago.

[Exhibitman]

Originally Posted by itjclarke

The rounded corner Bond Bread Robinson has been increasing steadily over the past few years, but if this sale is legit, seems may be ready for a breakout.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/1947-Bond-B...7/265081752083

Same grade sold for under $6K about 4 months ago, and was selling for less than $1K a year and a half ago.

Sure hope it pulls up lesser value examples; I have a "1" out for grading right now.

[packs]

I know it’s basketball but I think Lebron rookies will be big cards. Not as big as Jordan but in a few years I think the same cycle will repeat where people who have grown up will now want the cards of Lebron.

[itjclarke]

Originally Posted by Exhibitman

Sure hope it pulls up lesser value examples; I have a "1" out for grading right now.

I feel like it inevitably will with a card like this. Not necessarily rare but far more scarce than leaf or bowman and as importantly, now seeming more scarcely available.

It was a pretty easy card to get a few years ago, routinely coming up for auction, and there were always a few slightly above market BINs at any given time. Just having a few of any card listed makes those seeking it feel more at ease about getting one. However seems like with many semi scarce vintage cards now, when the BINs sell, they’re not necessarily being replaced with others. I think these are being absorbed up into collections, or with investors who see more upside.

[scmavl]

I've been trying to get an example of this card recently and finally succeeded. The past few months it has been gaining a huge amount of traction as (yet another) Robinson RC. While some people argue "it's just a highlights set", I still feel it has a legit claim as a rookie card. Sure wish I'd known about this card years ago so I could've afforded a nicer example. This card has far more than doubled in price in the past two months, and there are only 164 graded by PSA compared to 1400 Leaf rookie cards. I'm sure I overpaid, but there were 31 bids from 17 different bidders, so I'm obviously not alone.

[ezez420]

There is a Complete Set in Memory Lane right now too. With a PSA 4.



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[Peter_Spaeth]

I think there is a chance the Swell Jackie really takes off into the stratosphere. My second choice would be 49B Paige.

[itjclarke]

Old Gold sold last night for close to $8K too. Think folks are hot to find alternates to the Leaf since it’s taken off. With a handful of pre-1949 issues to choose from, I’d guess all will be on the rise. Wish I landed an Old Gold and Swell Sports when they were cheap.

[jb217676]

As far as affordable alternatives go for Jackie, I always thought the 1950 J.J.K. Copyart Postcard of Jackie Robinson was a great piece. It seems like forever it was one of the cheapest career contemporary Jackie items. Even four days ago one sold for $215 on ebay. I have one of these, let's pump it up guys!
Jeff

[scmavl]

Originally Posted by jb217676

I have one of these, let's pump it up guys!

Ha! You can't pump it up until you own a few of them- one to keep and a few to sell.

[packs]

One of the biggest regrets I have in collecting is being satisfied with one. I remember when I bought my Ruth World Wide Gum I felt so accomplished because I had a Ruth. For some reason it never occurred to me that I should keep buying them.