The Aaron Judge Effect

[JustinD]

Originally Posted by packs

What do you mean by footnote, though? I don't think Roger Maris is a footnote. If you're a serious baseball fan, you know his name and what he did and whose record he beat. If Judge hits 62 I think he'll occupy a similar space. Some people still think of Maris as the "true" record holder. When I think of footnotes I think of guys like Earl Webb, the all time single season doubles record holder.

Maris held the record, 62 will not be the record and will be a footnote. It will have no mention in any record book (other than Yankees team records) and no ball will sit in the Hall.

As to anyone going on the notion of the game as some platonic ideal existing before the big bad performance enhancers is patently false and the reason why the HOF is a joke. Today's players are more than likely the cleanest in history with the tightest rules but you can make a salient argument that Tommy john surgery or even Lazik is a performance enhancer not had by previous generations so that beat will go on forever.

I can pretend that Willie Mays and Mantle did not take amphetamines (Mantle is an excellent example because the reason he was out of the race in 61' was a botched shot from a known doctor giving cocktails of speed and steroids), but that would be ignoring facts. I can pretend the deadball pitching records were not exacerbated by a legal spitball and a high mound. I can pretend that the first record of attempted steroid use was not by a HOF member in 1889. I can pretend that Lyle Alzado was not stacking steroids in college in 1967 and I am supposed to believe that something that easy to find was untouched in the major leagues even while legal until the mid-80's. I can pretend a lot, but that's just sitting in a bar and ignoring what really happened and just accept that life goes on.

We can't erase history any more and need to just move on. No matter what, the record is not 61 in any book. It is a great season for Judge and I will give him that for sure, but not historic.

[D. Bergin]

It's the AL record.

[JustinD]

Originally Posted by D. Bergin

It's the AL record.

ok, I stand corrected, It will go in the books for that reason.

Apologies for that omission.

[raulus]

Originally Posted by D. Bergin

It's the AL record.

And I'm all for that being a thing, although I'm not sure that it's all that meaningful in the modern game.

But sometimes, we have some silly stats/records out there. Highest batting average against left handed pitchers with last names starting with V under a corn moon comes to mind as one that I'm sure we'll see in the near future.

[JustinD]

Originally Posted by raulus

And I'm all for that being a thing, although I'm not sure that it's all that meaningful in the modern game.

But sometimes, we have some silly stats/records out there. Highest batting average against left handed pitchers with last names starting with V under a corn moon comes to mind as one that I'm sure we'll see in the near future.

I'll have to keep my fingers crossed for Verlander to still be playing in 2025.

[D. Bergin]

I mean, everybody has a different acceptance level for certain things. I don't think the AL HR record is exactly some marginalized new age stat, brought into play recently by the Sybermetric nerds.

....and I don't take very seriously Cy Youngs and Jack Chesbro's pitching wins stats, or Hugh Nichols single season stolen base record either.

I'm a Yankee fan, and I'm not going to start spouting that Judge is the single season king...but I do think it is very ground-breaking what he is doing...especially in a season when offense and HR's among his peers, is traditionally down.

[raulus]

Turns out I was wrong about it being news.

WSJ has this headline in yesterday's paper:

Aaron Judge Courts Home-Run History
The likable Yankee slugger chases baseball’s ‘clean’ record.

The last paragraph is good fun:

As Mr. Judge chases history and the good feelings spread, I can’t help but wish that my father were here to see it all. He was no Yankee fan, and he wasn’t shy about voicing his disgust with today’s “overpaid prima donnas.” His heroes all had off-season jobs and knew how to bunt. He would have delighted in Mr. Judge’s run at the record.

[jingram058]

I broke out my "All Rise For The Judge" t-shirt for the first time in a couple of years, and wore it to the neighborhood Publix yesterday. This is Red Sox land down here. Fenway South, otherwise known as Jet Blue Stadium is here. Both the Twins and the Red Sox hold spring training here, but make no mistake, the Red Sox own this town. My Judge shirt got lots of comments and compliments. People down here know what's going on, and yes, it is being talked about and seen as a big deal. When Red Sox fans compliment a Yankees accomplishment, it is a VERY big deal.

[rats60]

Originally Posted by JustinD

Maris held the record, 62 will not be the record and will be a footnote. It will have no mention in any record book (other than Yankees team records) and no ball will sit in the Hall.

As to anyone going on the notion of the game as some platonic ideal existing before the big bad performance enhancers is patently false and the reason why the HOF is a joke. Today's players are more than likely the cleanest in history with the tightest rules but you can make a salient argument that Tommy john surgery or even Lazik is a performance enhancer not had by previous generations so that beat will go on forever.

I can pretend that Willie Mays and Mantle did not take amphetamines (Mantle is an excellent example because the reason he was out of the race in 61' was a botched shot from a known doctor giving cocktails of speed and steroids), but that would be ignoring facts. I can pretend the deadball pitching records were not exacerbated by a legal spitball and a high mound. I can pretend that the first record of attempted steroid use was not by a HOF member in 1889. I can pretend that Lyle Alzado was not stacking steroids in college in 1967 and I am supposed to believe that something that easy to find was untouched in the major leagues even while legal until the mid-80's. I can pretend a lot, but that's just sitting in a bar and ignoring what really happened and just accept that life goes on.

We can't erase history any more and need to just move on. No matter what, the record is not 61 in any book. It is a great season for Judge and I will give him that for sure, but not historic.

WADA disagrees with you. They consider MLB's testing and penalties inadequate. Tim Montgomery set the world record in the 100 meters. If you look in the record books you see no record of him ever setting the record. He was one of BALCOs clients along with Barry Bonds.

We certainly can erase the history of cheaters. That is the international standard of sports. Lance Armstrong won zero Tour de Frances. You are entitled to believe Bonds holds the record just as anyone else is entitled to call Maris the true record holder and if Judge hits 62, the new record holder.