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#51
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Good one, Jay!!
__________________
Seeking very scarce/rare cards for my Sam Rice master collection, e.g., E210 York Caramel Type 2 (upgrade), 1931 W502, W504 (upgrade), W572 sepia, W573, W575-1 E. S. Rice version, 1922 Haffner's Bread, 1922 Keating Candy, 1922 Witmor Candy Type 2 (vertical back), 1926 Sports Co. of Am. with ad & blank backs. Also T216 Kotton "NGO" card of Hugh Jennings. Also 1917 Merchants Bakery & Weil Baking cards of WaJo. |
#52
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I have never understood why that bothers people. If you know what you want to pay, make an offer, no?
__________________
My avatar is a sketch by my son who is an art school graduate. Some of his sketches and paintings are at https://www.jamesspaethartwork.com/ He is available to do custom drawings in graphite, charcoal and other media. He also sells some of his works as note cards/greeting cards on Etsy under JamesSpaethArt. |
#53
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Quote:
Likely a small sample size; however, personal experiences tend to shape one's personal opinions.
__________________
Eric Perry Currently collecting: T206 (132/524) 1956 Topps Baseball (193/342) "You can observe a lot by just watching." - Yogi Berra |
#54
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Peter--I think the reason is that making the first move conveys information to the other party. If one is willing to sell an item for $X but the potential buyer indicates he is willing to pay $X+ then the seller has been advantaged by not making the first move. The same is obviously true if the seller shows an offer before the buyer has bid.
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#55
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It bothers me because, if you really want to sell it, put a price on it. I'm not making an offer on anything. If you're trying to sell it, price it. Otherwise you're just trying to get rich.
__________________
James Ingram Successful net54 purchases from/trades with: Tere1071 (twice), Bocabirdman (5 times), 8thEastVB, GoldenAge50s, IronHorse2130, Kris19 (twice), G1911, dacubfan, sflayank, Smanzari, bocca001, eliminator, ejstel, lampertb, rjackson44, Jason19th, Cmvorce, CobbSpikedMe, Harliduck, donmuth, HercDriver, Huck, theshleps Completed 1953 Bowman color & b/w Completed 1962 Topps *** Raw cards only, daddyo! *** |
#56
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How many other marketplaces work like that? Not many; not even a few.
__________________
Working Sets: Baseball- T206 SLers - Virginia League (-1) 1952 Topps - low numbers (-1) 1954 Bowman (-3) 1964 Topps Giants auto'd (-2) |
#57
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Quote:
__________________
My avatar is a sketch by my son who is an art school graduate. Some of his sketches and paintings are at https://www.jamesspaethartwork.com/ He is available to do custom drawings in graphite, charcoal and other media. He also sells some of his works as note cards/greeting cards on Etsy under JamesSpaethArt. Last edited by Peter_Spaeth; 12-24-2023 at 04:52 PM. |
#58
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Quote:
How many other marketplaces have 90 percent of the items priced at levels nobody will pay? Those sellers put a price on their items, does that make people feel better about offering?
__________________
My avatar is a sketch by my son who is an art school graduate. Some of his sketches and paintings are at https://www.jamesspaethartwork.com/ He is available to do custom drawings in graphite, charcoal and other media. He also sells some of his works as note cards/greeting cards on Etsy under JamesSpaethArt. Last edited by Peter_Spaeth; 12-24-2023 at 04:57 PM. |
#59
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As opposed to someone with an absurdly high price?
__________________
My avatar is a sketch by my son who is an art school graduate. Some of his sketches and paintings are at https://www.jamesspaethartwork.com/ He is available to do custom drawings in graphite, charcoal and other media. He also sells some of his works as note cards/greeting cards on Etsy under JamesSpaethArt. |
#60
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__________________
Read my blog; it will make all your dreams come true. https://adamstevenwarshaw.substack.com/ Or not... |
#61
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I tend to ignore absurdly high prices.
Going back to the "make me an offer" tactic: I used to try to work with people who chose that route. In the vast majority of those encounters, I wound up buying nothing and spending lots of time doing so. Nearly everything I chase is fairly common. For example, the last card I picked up was a '56 Ted Williams in VG-EX. When I was looking for that card, I simply passed by any listing (post, showcase, etc.) where the card wasn't priced. There are plenty of copies for sale at any given moment. I'm getting too old to waste time with people who also want to squeeze every possible penny out of me. Now, if y'all will excuse me, I'm gonna go outside and yell at some clouds.
__________________
Eric Perry Currently collecting: T206 (132/524) 1956 Topps Baseball (193/342) "You can observe a lot by just watching." - Yogi Berra |
#62
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Make me an offer...
I remember a few years ago, a member here posted something I was interested in, with the "make me an offer" tag. I responded with, "so it's a reverse auction, right?" He got all offended, but that's what that is, basically. I haven't seen the douche muppet on here lately, so maybe he's gone now.
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#63
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Quote:
Sent from my SM-S906U using Tapatalk |
#64
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Mic drop!
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#65
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Nor does the earth get repopulated with humans.
Brian |
#66
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Graded cards for someone who is a collector is stupid. How do you display a bunch of slabs in a way that doesn't look like a bank vault rather than a collection?
If your thing is graded cards, then you aren't someone who collects cards in a hobby. If you collect graded cards, just come out, get it over with, and say it... you're are investor. You know nothing about the ballplayers, the era in which they played, or any of that. You care about what your cards are monetarily worth. You get all excited if you discover, God forbid, a wrinkle or a crease or an ink drop, or...cardiac arrest here... it's trimmed! I couldn't care any less about that, because, for me, it's a hobby. I don't even care if my cards are counterfeit fakes, because if they are, someone went to an awful lot of trouble, more than the actual manufacturer ever did.
__________________
James Ingram Successful net54 purchases from/trades with: Tere1071 (twice), Bocabirdman (5 times), 8thEastVB, GoldenAge50s, IronHorse2130, Kris19 (twice), G1911, dacubfan, sflayank, Smanzari, bocca001, eliminator, ejstel, lampertb, rjackson44, Jason19th, Cmvorce, CobbSpikedMe, Harliduck, donmuth, HercDriver, Huck, theshleps Completed 1953 Bowman color & b/w Completed 1962 Topps *** Raw cards only, daddyo! *** |
#67
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Quote:
Last edited by Vintagedeputy; 12-26-2023 at 12:30 PM. |
#68
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Quote:
A card I guess I must be into stupid stuff since I've owned two graded copies of this card. Couldn't just be that I enjoyed it so much that when I sold the first one I immediately started looking for its replacement... ETA: nothing is wrong with being an investor either. Just don't be a douche.
__________________
Read my blog; it will make all your dreams come true. https://adamstevenwarshaw.substack.com/ Or not... Last edited by Exhibitman; 12-26-2023 at 01:03 PM. |
#69
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I don’t see how any of the 3 groups - investors, collectors, or investor-collectors - are better than any of the other groups. The investors throw tantrums and attack if a collector doesn’t put the fiscal interest of investors over their own collecting, the collectors are bitter and angry at the investors and do much the same thing. It also seems to me that selling and buying cards is a painless and easy experience 99.9% of the time on either end, but that is evidently a minority view. And thus we have 67 posts in the holiday bitchfest thread and 6 in the Merry Christmas thread .
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#70
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Happy Festivus! Airing of Grievances 2023 Edition
Narrow take.
Just because I consider myself more a "collector" than an investor, does that mean I'm supposed to just totally throw caution to the wind with my resources and disregard what anything in my collection might be worth? I have brokerage accounts and savings that are the bulk of my "investments", on which I hope to be able to retire one day. I'm not one of those counting on cardboard or PSA slabs to do that for me in 20+ years. But even if the cards are largely a fun thing for me as a hobby, clearly they still cost money to obtain. If I decide to get rid of something one day or shift direction as a collector, the monetary value of some of my collection might be something of interest to me, even if only for the purposes of acquiring new cards - maybe ya think? To be ignorant of such things as a collector might be the opposite of being a hardcore investor, but I would argue being totally ignorant of value at some point - especially if you are going to possess valuable cards - just makes you a dumb collector. Given all the scandals of late like slabgate, altered cards in numbered slabs and the like coming out of Covid - there is a certain price point by now that I will not buy a card above if it's raw, if I cannot physically inspect it in-person first. That's just common sense. Maybe you don't care about authenticity, sorry; but I do; that's the entire freaking point. I recently was able to acquire an (admittedly low grade, but authentic) 1963 Topps Pete Rose RC. Why in a million years at this point would I ever buy a card like that raw online? That would make zero sense - again assuming I give a flip about authenticity. First, even in low grade - it's what I consider a fairly valuable (north of $500 anyway...) card. Second, this is one of the most notoriously faked / counterfeited cards of all time. Why take the chance, why waste my time? Yes even with crappy raw scans, I can generally tell if something is genuine or not online, I've been around the block enough times to know what to look for. But even if ebay would stand behind me, or some other entity - why would I risk going through the hassle of being out real money and having to wait on a refund or judgement when I could just buy a slab? Sure, PSA and SGC and others have made mistakes, have made BIG mistakes, and undoubtedly will continue to do so. But once the dust settles from all of that is the more or less undisputed fact that they also get more than 95% of it RIGHT. If you don't like slabs, or like I used to in the past - don't like the look, but can appreciate the limited value that the service provides even if you bust them later - who freaking cares? I wouldn't disparage you for hating slabs, or buying only raw. The more money you spend on raw cards, the more risk you take on. But risk tolerance is a hugely personal thing - whether you are a collector, an investor - or some combination of both - which yes sorry, is entirely possible and happens. Maybe don't worry so much about how those different from you "hobby"...
__________________
Postwar stars & HOF'ers. Prewar, Bowman & Topps Cubs team endeavors. Last edited by jchcollins; 12-26-2023 at 06:37 PM. |
#71
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Don't drink and post!
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#72
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Well, I am totally not surprised by the responses. I would expect the regular posters to respond the way they have. net54, while I love it dearly, is what I would call "the palace of graded cards". That's how I see it. We had a saying in the Navy, "perception is reality".
There are only 2 reasons, and 2 reasons alone, for having your cards graded: you are concerned about condition, which equates to monetary value, and/or you are concerned about authenticity. I like having my cards, and I like handling them from time to time. Likewise, the memorabilia that accompanies them. They are a direct link to both the era they come from, and to my very happy childhood. I don't care about card grading. I am not worried in the slightest about my cards value, condition, or authenticity. They are fine for me. I doubt seriously if they are fake, but if they are, they were so well done that I can't tell. My wife and daughter will be fine if I pass away. For personal, selfish reasons, I hope and pray I go first. They will be financially fine, from my converted Veterans Group Life Insurance to real estate to health care. Not from baseball cards. They know their potential worth, but beyond that, very little interest. They both love modern day baseball, but aside from Ty Cobb and Babe Ruth, the rest of baseball history beyond the 1970s is lost on them. So you guys can get my cards and other stuff from them if I up and croak. Feel free to have them graded.
__________________
James Ingram Successful net54 purchases from/trades with: Tere1071 (twice), Bocabirdman (5 times), 8thEastVB, GoldenAge50s, IronHorse2130, Kris19 (twice), G1911, dacubfan, sflayank, Smanzari, bocca001, eliminator, ejstel, lampertb, rjackson44, Jason19th, Cmvorce, CobbSpikedMe, Harliduck, donmuth, HercDriver, Huck, theshleps Completed 1953 Bowman color & b/w Completed 1962 Topps *** Raw cards only, daddyo! *** |
#73
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James, that's all well and good as long as you would concede the rest of us are not "stupid" simply because we hobby different from you.
N54 is hardly the only haven for graded cards. Look everywhere else around you...eBay, shops, shows, auction houses. They've been around for quite some time and are likely to stay. Whether you or I or anyone else likes it or not...
__________________
Postwar stars & HOF'ers. Prewar, Bowman & Topps Cubs team endeavors. |
#74
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Quote:
I also hope the market will have a true collapse, as it will make cards cheaper for collectors like me. I understand a couple of the more intense or immature investors throw a very public tantrum any time it's said (50/50 odds we'll have a new thread tomorrow whining a collector isn't putting someone else's investment portfolio first) but most seem to understand collectors and investors are doing two different things that are advantaged by different market movements. Most people have to care at some level though; most of us don't have a guaranteed retirement and families who are fine no matter what happens to our stuff. Maybe I will have to care someday if things change or if I get really sick - 99% of the population is just one run of very bad luck away from having to scrape by or is scraping by already. I am conscious it is a position of financial privilege that I have been able to collect some cards at all in my life. Not all of us have that fortunate guaranteed future you seem to have. That's a wonderful thing, good for you, but most of us are not in that boat. Most investors still know their stuff. I haven't come across anyone in card land who "knows nothing about the ballplayers" as you claimed. As a 100% collector and 0% investor, some of my favorite people in the hobby are in the investor class. A person need not have the same goal I do to not be "stupid". In fact we can usually benefit each other - they want money more and I want cards more, so we can usually work a deal out that leaves us both happy and satisfied. I even, dare say, have probably had more help and aid from the investor class in my boxing research projects and surveys than I have had from the true-collector class. People can have different ends in a hobby and still be decent folk. My way, which seems to effectively be the same as your way, is no better than X or Y's way. There's just a couple extremists on each 'side' that can't stand to hear anything done differently from them. One of the nice things about a hobby like this is you get 100% free choice of how to do it. You can collect, invest, do both, be social and active, or just quietly do things your own way. What another person chooses to do, while interesting because it's my hobby, doesn't really affect me much. |
#75
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Quote:
__________________
James Ingram Successful net54 purchases from/trades with: Tere1071 (twice), Bocabirdman (5 times), 8thEastVB, GoldenAge50s, IronHorse2130, Kris19 (twice), G1911, dacubfan, sflayank, Smanzari, bocca001, eliminator, ejstel, lampertb, rjackson44, Jason19th, Cmvorce, CobbSpikedMe, Harliduck, donmuth, HercDriver, Huck, theshleps Completed 1953 Bowman color & b/w Completed 1962 Topps *** Raw cards only, daddyo! *** |
#76
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Quote:
__________________
James Ingram Successful net54 purchases from/trades with: Tere1071 (twice), Bocabirdman (5 times), 8thEastVB, GoldenAge50s, IronHorse2130, Kris19 (twice), G1911, dacubfan, sflayank, Smanzari, bocca001, eliminator, ejstel, lampertb, rjackson44, Jason19th, Cmvorce, CobbSpikedMe, Harliduck, donmuth, HercDriver, Huck, theshleps Completed 1953 Bowman color & b/w Completed 1962 Topps *** Raw cards only, daddyo! *** |
#77
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Quote:
__________________
FRANK:BUR:KETT - RAUCOUS SPORTS CARD FORUM MEMBER AND MONSTER NUMBER FATHER. GOOD FOR THE HOBBY AND THE FORUM WITH A VAULT IN AN UNDISCLOSED LOCATION FILLED WITH NON-FUNGIBLES 274/1000 Monster Number Nearly*1000* successful B/S/T transactions completed from 2012 to 2024. Over 680 sales with satisfied Board members served. If you want fries with your order, just speak up. Thank you all. Now nearly PQ. |
#78
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Haha...No, it certainly was not you, Frank!
Cheers, Geno |
#79
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All good. Thanks.
__________________
Postwar stars & HOF'ers. Prewar, Bowman & Topps Cubs team endeavors. |
#80
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People who make (usually lowball) offers on eBay items with no OBO option. If I wanted to hear how much less you feel like paying, the OBO option would have been part of the listing. Get lost!
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#81
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Even with OBO, one can set the auto-reject threshold.
Check it for laughs every so often. I had one item that sold for the asking price (which was already at market price) get a ton of offers that were 1/3 to 1/2 the value.
__________________
"Don't mistake activity for achievement." – John Wooden |
#82
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I am guilty of this just without the lowballing part. I have around a 75% success rate making offers on items without the make offer option in the listing. I don't sell much so I rarely receive them.
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#83
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Quote:
__________________
Read my blog; it will make all your dreams come true. https://adamstevenwarshaw.substack.com/ Or not... Last edited by Exhibitman; 12-27-2023 at 08:54 AM. |
#84
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Quote:
Me: List item at $99 with no OBO option. Message from eBay user: fourty $$$$ bucks shiped??????????
__________________
Eric Perry Currently collecting: T206 (132/524) 1956 Topps Baseball (193/342) "You can observe a lot by just watching." - Yogi Berra Last edited by Eric72; 12-27-2023 at 01:33 PM. |
#85
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You have that right, Eric. Still, I'm just not a fan of offers in general.
When I think of bartering, I'm more prone to conjure up images of some bazaar halfway around the world. In most retail settings in western civilization, if I offered a fraction of the listed price, I'd be either laughed out the door or yelled at. Why shouldn't this apply to my profession as well? And yes, my saying this does prove me a hypocrite, as I've certainly made offers in my life! Although, in relation to this particular eBay scenario, I do try my best to work with a listed price if there's no OBO or simply move on. I assume the seller has their reasons for no OBO as I have for my items. I remember making far more offers on eBay many years back, before the implementation of the OBO option, but we all did, ergo eBay's introduction of OBO. Last edited by BillyCoxDodgers3B; 12-27-2023 at 02:12 PM. |
#86
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A reporter once asked Gandhi what he thought of western civilization. He replied, "I think it would be a good idea."
__________________
192/240 1933 Goudeys (Ruth #144, #149, Gehrig #92) 130/208 T205s 29/108? Diamond Stars |
#87
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That or my personal favorite from some mouth breather: "HOWMUCH."
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#88
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The OBO on eBay anymore I see as mainly a gesture of goodwill. People like to feel like they are getting some type of discount; it's part of the psychology of buying. So I know what I want to sell something for, I'll list it for a small percentage higher. I can come down to that price on an offer, and the buyer feels like they are winning, or sometimes they just hit the BIN regardless and I sell it for my starting price. That works too...
__________________
Postwar stars & HOF'ers. Prewar, Bowman & Topps Cubs team endeavors. |
#89
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Quote:
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#90
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The proactive seller offers are different. Would agree I've rarely been on the receiving end of any bargains there.
__________________
Postwar stars & HOF'ers. Prewar, Bowman & Topps Cubs team endeavors. |
#91
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Just put an auto-reject on the floor price and all of the tire kickers and bottom feeders will be shut out automatically.
__________________
Read my blog; it will make all your dreams come true. https://adamstevenwarshaw.substack.com/ Or not... |
#92
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It hasn't stopped them from PMing after their offers are rejected. If only it was that easy.
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#93
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I've (rarely) tried to sell other things on eBay, like used iPhones and expensive watches. The unsolicited offer game is much worse there, in my experience...
__________________
Postwar stars & HOF'ers. Prewar, Bowman & Topps Cubs team endeavors. Last edited by jchcollins; 12-28-2023 at 09:18 AM. |
#94
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Is a douche muppet a collectible?
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#95
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__________________
Successful B/S/T deals with asoriano, obcbobd, x2dRich2000, eyecollectvintage, RepublicaninMass, Kwikford, Oneofthree67, jfkheat, scottglevy, whitehse, GoldenAge50s, Peter Spaeth, Northviewcats, megalimey, BenitoMcNamara, Edwolf1963, mightyq, sidepocket, darwinbulldog, jasonc, jessejames, sb1, rjackson44, bobbyw8469, quinnsryche, Carter08, philliesfan and ALBB, Buythatcard and JimmyC so far. |
#96
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That would be one of the few collectibles I'd prefer to own in non-fungible form.
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#97
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Being somewhat new here I’m surprised how many new members use their first (sometimes only) post to test the waters of an obvious fake card or autograph .
Edit note : I do you not mean to imply all these are scammers It’s certainly possible they joined To ask a honest question , but there’s a strong pattern Last edited by Beercan collector; 01-03-2024 at 08:49 AM. |
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