Antiquities of California....

[btcarfagno]

Whomever did that John Hancock must have been drunk. I mean, to say that isn't even close is a masterpiece of understatement. Wow. Just wow.

Tom C

[sayhey24]

I agree with Tom -- even for someone like me who isn't an autograph expert, that John Hancock looks hilarious.

Greg

[RichardSimon]

Could this place be the West Coast branch of a famed auction house?

[steve B]

The only reason the Hancock has any credibility at all -and it's almost certainly not his but his secretaries- is that those documents were very common. They were used for land grants, appointments, proclamations.. Darn near any situation that the government wanted to give out a big showy document. The secretary probably signed hundreds a week, handwriting the details (Joe jones is a fine fellow having been master of the will bucket for 20 years)The actual government official would only sign ones that were truly important, Like promotions to General or cabinet positions or something of that nature.

The signature is in the right place, and the parchment or paper used is very hard to get ink out of. So finding an original and removing a signature of little importance is just too much work for a forger. There's enough old unwritten on paper around that a hand written reciept fragment would be much easier.
Of course, land grants are often under a hundred, and a governors proclamation or something of that sort probably less.

Steve B

[RichardSimon]

Where is Eliot Ness when you really need him??

[Vintagedegu]

-

[henson1855]

I happen to use the same frame shop that this place does,and from time to time I am able to go in the back and see some of the horrible pieces this place is getting framed and matted , then passing off as authentic.Stevie Ray Vaughn's last autograph comes to mind,supposedly signed and dated for a security guard as he was getting on the helicopter,I have seen guitars signed by Elvis,Jim Morrison,& Jimi Hendrix, lots of bad Ruth/Gehrig pieces,it's a joke.But they are all double certified! This is an email exchange I had with the owner Toby back in June on the Ruth/Gehrig ball I posted on page 1 of the thread. Notice there was no reply from her after I mentioned a couple names.
From: michael henson (mhenson77@hotmail.com)
Sent: Mon 6/27/11 10:59 PM
To: tlstoffa@antiquitieslv.com


As I said fake I will post it on Net 54 for the forum to chime in with thier opinions, who certified it Ted Taylor? Chris Morales? STAT? LOL its a fake and a poor one at that


> From: tlstoffa@antiquitieslv.com
> To: mhenson77@hotmail.com
> Date: Tue, 28 Jun 2011 01:52:34 -0400
> Subject: RE: Babe Ruth & Lou Gehrig
>
> wrong, double certified.
> ________________________________________
> From: michael henson [mhenson77@hotmail.com]
> Sent: Monday, June 27, 2011 10:12 PM
> To: Stoffa, Toby
> Subject: RE: Babe Ruth & Lou Gehrig
>
> fake
>
> ________________________________
> From: tlstoffa@antiquitieslv.com
> To: tlstoffa@antiquitieslv.com
> Subject: Babe Ruth & Lou Gehrig
> Date: Mon, 27 Jun 2011 19:02:58 -0700
>
> Hi from Antiquities at The Forum Shops. Here is an extraordinary baseball treasure of a piece which is now available.
>
> Babe Ruth and Lou Gehrig, two of the very greatest names in Baseball history, signed, dated and doubly certified. The ball is somewhat aged, and the red stitching dates it to the year it was signed. The signatures are 10s, and it is hand dated 1935. This is in a terrific shadowbox display that pays tribute to Baseball's most important icons, with biography on the right side and Yankees prop ticket. Retail is $19,995 and your price $16,000.