O/T Insects in Cleveland

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Posted By: David Smith

Rob,

Maybe the soap, shampoo, body wash, hair spray, cologne or after shave Chamberlain uses had something to do with it.

Maybe it is just Chamberlain's natural body oils and smell that attracted them.

Maybe Chamberlain just hung onto a pitch too long or tried to over throw it.

Then again, maybe Chamberlain felt the pressure of the situation and just choaked. You know it wouldn't be the first time that has happened to a Yankees player in the Post Season the last few years.

I am just guessing because I didn't watch the game. I mean, I didn't watch the Yankees or Red Sox the 70 or so times during the regular season when they were on either ESPN or FOX sports, so why start now??

If (hopefully when) both teams are knocked out of the Play-Offs, I will just sit back and smile as I think of the guys at ESPN crying and tearing their hair out because NEITHER team will have won the World Series.

David

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Posted By: Jeff Lichtman

David, I sense some bitterness. Do you live in Pittsburgh?

Having watched most of Joba's appearances this year, I can assure you that the bugs were the reason that run scored. The guy threw like one wild pitch all year and then 2 in one inning yesterday. He has great command and has pitched in pressure situations before.

That being said, the Yankees should have had more than 3 hits in 11 innings. In the end, they probably got what they deserved with that performance.

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Posted By: Kevin Andrews

Jeff - Give the Indians some credit here. The reason that the Yankees had three hits yesterday and only eight in two games is because of the Indians pitching. Top to bottom they are much better than what the Yankees have. In the starting rotation once you're past Wang (and possibly Pettite) it's mostly old, maybe good sometimes and maybe bad sometime. Sabathia and Carmona have been nasty good all season an less Lackey tossing a shut-out last game of the year Carmona would have had the lowest ERA in the league. Perez, Betancourt and Borowski have been solid all year in the Indians bull pen and Jensen Lewis has been good since he's been up. In the Yankees pen past Chamberlain and Rivera is there anyone they'd use when you absolutely had to have an out?

The Indians have played through adversity all year - snow, cold, home games at a nuetral site, playing as the home team in Seattle, losing all six games to the Yankees in the regular season, two of the their starters injured early in the season (Cliff Lee / Jake Westbrook), Cliff Lee and Jeremy Sowers back to the minors and they finished the year tied with Boston for the best record in the Majors. This is not the same team that the Yankees played in the regular season. They've hands down out pitched, out hit and out played the Yankees in the first two games. There's going to be absolutely no pressure on the Indians in New York. The media is going to be all over A-rod, Jeter, Matsui, Posada and Damon because their total lack of hitting and they won't even recognize the Indians pitching had any thing to do with it.

If the Yankee nation doesn't realize it by now, the Indians have come to play, and they've come with a better TEAM.

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Posted By: David Smith

No, Jeff, I live in Indiana.

As far as bitterness, it REALLY upsets me that ESPN and now FOX, primarily show Yankees and Red Sox games during the regular season. I think I read somewhere that ESPN was going to show the Yankees and Red Sox at least 20 times EACh during the regular season.

By primarily showcasing these two teams, it turns a LOT of fans off, especially those fans of "small market" teams. These fans know they are at a disadvantage every year because of the money the large market teams have and can throw around. THEN to have ESPN and FOX throw it their face every week just makes it worse.

I used to watch baseball on ESPN religiously. I also used to watch Baseball Tonight every night. It was fair and balanced and I could see highlights of games (instead of just reading about them in the newspaper or on the web). I could also see great performances and strange plays and not have to be told about them by somebody else. Finally, I could see the players and know who they were. I could see who was having a great year and who wasn't. This way, when it was Play-Off time, I would have an informed opinion on who I thought should win and why and if they didn't then I could see where I made the wrong assumptions or judgements. I could also have an informed opinion on who should win the individual awards and why.

Then ESPN and FOX started showing more and more of the large market teams and especially the Yankees and Red Sox. As they did that, I started watching LESS games. I thought it would get better after a year or two, especially after the Yankees and Red Sox were NOT winning the World Series and other teams (teams that ESPN almost totally forgot about showing - ala the Tigers last year) WERE winning it, but it only got worse.

The kicker for me was earlier this year, on a Friday night, when I heard that ESPN had a clock on screen that showed how much time was left before the start of the first game of the year between the Yankees and Red Sox. Like the graphic on ABC that shows how much time is left before the New Year and Dick Clark describes the ball coming down the pole. Well, that, to me, showed ESPN's arrogance. The season had already started and was a week or two old but, to them, it wasn't REALLY a baseball season until the Yankees and Red Sox had played.

That arrogance and East Coast bias is what turns the ratings into a self fulfilling prophesy for ESPN and FOX. They show ONLY the large market teams and highlight them at every juncture and that turns off the fans of small market teams. Then, when ESPN DOES get around to showing the small market teams, their fans don't watch because of previously being slighted. The executives of ESPN can then truthfully say that the small market teams just don't draw enough people so, they are going to show the large market teams more. A vicious cycle that is going to result in ESPN only showing five teams the WHOLE year.

As I have said previously, if I had ANY say in the matter, I would make it a rule that ESPN could NOT show ANY Yankees or Red Sox game until after the All-Star break. That way, the small market teams and unknown players would get more national air time and more people would watch. Then, when one of THOSE teams make it to the World Series and WINS it, people would know who they were and why they won. It wouldn't come as much of a surprise.

Last year, the Tigers ( I am not a fan of theirs, I am just using them as an example) played good baseball ALL season long but ESPN didn't show ANY of their games until almost the end of the season. Then ESPN and a LOT of people nationwide were SHOCKED when THEY made it to the World Series and neither the Yankees or Red Sox did. If ESPN had paid more attention to the actual teams and how they were doing during the regular season instead of just keeping their collective heads up the Northeast Coast teams behinds, they would have known the Tigers were good and wouldn't have been so shocked.

David

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Posted By: Al C.risafulli

David makes a pretty good point.

ESPN is way too heavy on the Yankees and Red Sox. Fans from those cities can watch their own home teams on local television. Fans of those teams from outside the area can purchase League Pass on DirecTV. People who watch a baseball game on ESPN are doing so because they're a baseball fan, and want to watch some team that they don't get to see all the time.

As a Yankee fan, I think it would have been cool to tune in a few Brewers games, or Mariners games, during the season. It would have been nice to watch Cleveland - they've got a dynamite young team. I would have enjoyed watching more of the young Tigers pitching staff, or seeing Ichiro leg out an infield single, or watching David Wells pitch for the Dodgers.

Instead, I turn on ESPN and watch Derek Jeter, who I watch every day.

My opinion is that these Yankees are very tough to dislike. Virtually every guy on the team is an enjoyable character. Even A-Rod has been tough to root against this year. But if I had the national sports media ramming the Yankees down my throat every day, I would hate - HATE - them.

-Al

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Posted By: Max Weder

No bothersome bugs on the wet west coast but the east coast would have to stay up too late to watch Ichiro. Count your blessings though. If they showed more Mariners games, you'd also have to watch Richie Sexson.



(image does not necessarily reflect feelings of the author of this post, who is actually feeling somewhat sorry for the Yankees right now)

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Posted By: dennis

speaking as a midwesterer and baseball fan,those boston yankee games are great,no better rivalry in baseball exists today.i wish espn would televise them all.

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Posted By: James Feagin

Greg,

I'm going to revise a statement I made earlier....

Although to their credit, the majority are far more knowledgable than MANY OF THE adherents of "Red Sox" ahem....."Bandwagon Nation"

For a good read about the burgeoning "Sawx" bandwagon phenomenon, from a Boston paper nonetheless, I offer this....

In all seriousness, I respect knowledgable and lifelong baseball fans, Yankees and Red Sox fans included, and that probably includes you Greg. However, with MLB's marketing efforts, and Seligula's lie that small market interest is higher than ever (it's not), there are many things I have come to resent. My wife's cousin from Northern Virginia asked me last week "so, are you a Yankees or Sox fan?" When I replied that "I hate both of them", she seemed puzzled. A neighbor from Rexburg, Idaho told me that he chose the Red Sox as his team because unlike the Orioles, they don't suck. To which I replied, "of course the Orioles suck, but fandom is the one abusive relationship you don't leave."

I resent that the national media and marketing firms have such a hold on the masses that at a Target in Baltimore, Maryland ,ONLY Red Sox and Yankees fan packs and Topps team sets are sold. I resent the national assertion that Red Sox and Yankees fans are the best and only fans in baseball. I'm amused that before 2001, I never saw more than a smattering of so-called "Red Sox Nation" at Oriole Park (Yanks fans have always travelled well), now these "day long" fans come out of the woodwork? These fly by night fans are not worthy of those who devoted years of their attentions to their teams. The only solution for the overall good of the game is a salary cap accompanied by a respective salary floor.

Back to the topic, I think Joba probably just smells and emits a foul odor that attracts such beasts. Just part of the game.



James

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Posted By: Dan Bretta

James, you just basically said the same thing you said earlier, but with more words. ESPN and Target are just good marketers. I'm not sure why anyone is arguing that ESPN should televise more small market games than they do Yanks/Red Sox games. They should lose money why?

Besides is there a small market team that doesn't have a TV contract? I live in the Kansas City market and I get every single Royals game...how exciting for me.

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Posted By: James Feagin

Dan,

You're right, it's just that money ruins everything.

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Posted By: Jeff Lichtman

Guys, while you all may be frustrated by the seeming daily presence of the Sox and Yankees on TV there is one reason for it: money. Higher ratings = more money. It's not an east coast bias or arrogance; it's the simple fact that more people watch the Sox and the Yankees than the Tigers and Indians. Sad but true, but this is the way the world works.

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Posted By: Joe D.

who is the person in the blue jumpsuit in Cleveland's dugout?

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Posted By: Dan Bretta

Joe you are a budding Wonkaite.

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Posted By: Jay

I'm a die hard Yankee fan and I think Jaba was affected by the bugs but that is not what lost the game. The Yankees have been shut down by the Indians pitching and if you can't score you can't win, period.

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Posted By: JimCrandell

I am in the NYC area and I dislike the Yankees intensely.

Al, I disagree. I think it is very easy to dislike the Yankees--two reasons:

1)George Steinbrenner
2)They try to buy their way to a pennent every year as they spent considerably more than any other team.

I root for the small market teams. I love Billy Beane and what he has been able to do.

I also now dislike the Mets and was happy to see them collapse.

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Posted By: Greg Theberge

Jim,

I'm not too convinced that you give any credence to your arguement that Red Sox fans are less knowledgable than their Yankee fan counterparts based on your reply, especially when you make such a bold statement on a pre-war Baseball forum. Everything you have to say simply pontificates pent up frustrations with your enjoyment of the sport or local team and does nothing to prove your statement.

Quite honestly, I have no idea what MLB marketing has to do with the fan who grew up with the team and his or her knowledge of the sport, or team, nor do I see any relevance to what your wife's cousin has to say about the Sox and Yankees. If I was trying to make an arguement to prove my point, I probaly wouldn't use my wife's cousin as a reference. I couldn't care less what your neighbor does, he doesn't represent the average fan. Every team has folks that will follow them for one reason or another.

Sorry, I don't even know what a "Fan Pack" is. I'm sorry your feathers are all in a ruffle since these things are geared towards Sox and Yankees fans down there at your local Target. Take it up with the manager at Target, not Sox fans.

Personally, I can't understand when people complain that their stadium is filled with Sox or Yankee fans instead of their own. Whose fault is this? I don't ever remember seeing where Sox or Yankee fans are given preference for getting tickets. Maybe if more Orioles fans gave a damn and supported their team this wouldn't be a problem. I'm quite certain all of the local retailers don't mind all of that extra income coming in either. You may not think these "fly by night" fans are worthy of gaining entrance to your park, but who the heck are you to pass judgement on them? They obviously care enough to go the extra mile to support their team.

I had the pleasure to visit Orioles Park at Camden Yards for a weekend series two years ago. Had a great time. Sat next to a season ticket holder and had a great conversation during the game. It was a pleasure to talk to someone that enjoyed the game for the game.

I suppose I wouldn't have reacted to your original statement so viscerally if you hadn't have made it on a vintage sports forum. So much for this, time to check on how the Cubbies are doing.