Any National Updates?

[felada]

Any updates from those at the national on autographed cards? Particularly signed pre war cards or the tougher signed rookie cards?

[tazdmb]

Didn’t go this year, but was told there was not much of vintage autographs, besides the usuals (Cobb, Ruth, Jackie). Most stuff was consigned to various auction houses.

[BillyCoxDodgers3B]

It's been that way for I don't know how many Nationals. After Cleveland in 2018, I threw in the towel.

[BillyCoxDodgers3B]

Thinking more about it, the last really good National for buying autographs was 15 years ago. That was only due to one longtime collector setting up a booth and divesting. Anything I've managed to purchase at subsequent shows was of much lesser note. By 2018, the continual feeling that my travel expenses weren't justified nagged at me enough to say no more.

[egri]

Good to know; I'm glad to know all this before I go through the hassle of going to the National. I might still make it to one, but I'll adjust my expectations.

[Michael B]

Originally Posted by egri

Good to know; I'm glad to know all this before I go through the hassle of going to the National. I might still make it to one, but I'll adjust my expectations.

You won't know what is there until you go. Why take the advice of a PAM (pisser and moaner) who has not attended since 2018. There were quite a few autographs there not just in auction previews. I was privy to an extremely large and significant transaction related to pre-WWII signatures. The purchaser told me because they trust me, but will not publicize it and neither will I. I also travelled from Virginia with very little expectations of finding signatures I could use. Other than paying to get a few items signed by one of the athletes my total autograph expenditure was $15 for 4 signed index cards and two signed picture postcards. I will drive to Chicago next year and visit antique malls along the way. Last year I found a certificate signed by Morgan Bulkeley, first president of the National League and Hall of Famer in one of those antique malls. I enjoy flying, but that made the drive worth it.

[Republicaninmass]

Originally Posted by felada

Any updates from those at the national on autographed cards? Particularly signed pre war cards or the tougher signed rookie cards?

Prices were astronomical.

I saw 2 signed 1952 topps May's priced at 30k.


Signed cards, stars and rcs are stronger than death itself right now.

[egri]

Originally Posted by Michael B

You won't know what is there until you go. Why take the advice of a PAM (pisser and moaner) who has not attended since 2018.

Fair point.

[BillyCoxDodgers3B]

Yeah, I was of the "You won't know what is there until you go" camp. I kept going, and going...and nothing. For years. Other people I know shared the same experience. Mind you, this is strictly regarding autographs; I wasn't there for anything else.

I still have many colleagues who are forced to attend for the sake of business. They've continued to say the same thing as I have in their annual play-by-plays of the event. The good autographed material goes to the auction houses. The majority of this stuff is rehashed and familiar to anybody who has been collecting for more than a few years.

Don't get me wrong, there will come a show sometime in the future that will be great. That's just the law of averages coming into play. I'll surely regret not attending THAT show, but not knowing when it will happen, combined with all the ones where nothing happens except a lighter wallet, makes staying at home a much more desirable option.

Many people love the social aspect of the show. If I want to visit with any hobby friends or customers, I'll take a road trip and go see them. Much more comfortable and relaxed.

The money I wasted has earned me the right to piss and moan.

[mr2686]

Originally Posted by BillyCox3

Yeah, I was of the "You won't know what is there until you go" camp. I kept going, and going...and nothing. For years. Other people I know shared the same experience. Mind you, this is strictly regarding autographs; I wasn't there for anything else.

I still have many colleagues who are forced to attend for the sake of business. They've continued to say the same thing as I have in their annual play-by-plays of the event. The good autographed material goes to the auction houses. The majority of this stuff is rehashed and familiar to anybody who has been collecting for more than a few years.

Don't get me wrong, there will come a show sometime in the future that will be great. That's just the law of averages coming into play. I'll surely regret not attending THAT show, but not knowing when it will happen, combined with all the ones where nothing happens except a lighter wallet, makes staying at home a much more desirable option.

Many people love the social aspect of the show. If I want to visit with any hobby friends or customers, I'll take a road trip and go see them. Much more comfortable and relaxed.

The money I wasted has earned me the right to piss and moan.

I'm in your camp on this one. I'd still have a good time going (if only for a day or two) but it probably wouldn't be worth the money in the long run. One reason to go for me would be to get some of the newer hof'ers to sign my hof book or any other hof project I have started...although they probably could be obtained at the actual hof show in Cooperstown and I'd get to go to the museum too.

[David Atkatz]

Originally Posted by Michael B

Other than paying to get a few items signed by one of the athletes my total autograph expenditure was $15 for 4 signed index cards and two signed picture postcards.

Sounds to me like the "pisser and moaner" is quite correct. (BTW, if he is who I think he is, he's forgotten more about vintage autographs than you'll ever know. Be a bit more careful before you resort to insults.)

[Republicaninmass]

But an amazing t206 collections walked in....and happened to just know to go to goldin for a live reveal. Not to mention all the star cards grouped sorted by order, there are more gems to uncover like doyle and wagner buried in the boxes.....right

It's become a circus, bit it's fun to watch! Que footage of guy pulling the 55 bowman mantle

[BillyCoxDodgers3B]

Originally Posted by mr2686

I'm in your camp on this one. I'd still have a good time going (if only for a day or two) but it probably wouldn't be worth the money in the long run. One reason to go for me would be to get some of the newer hof'ers to sign my hof book or any other hof project I have started...although they probably could be obtained at the actual hof show in Cooperstown and I'd get to go to the museum too.

Before I even finished reading your post, I was all ready to suggest doing what you concluded it with! They had a very nicely rounded lineup of signers this year, that's for sure. If next year looks similar, maybe go that route. Sounds like you think you'd have a better time in that environment, and I can't blame you one bit.

You never know who you're going to bump into during the festivities. In '89, I went specifically for Yaz. Seated on the lawn next to us was an older couple. It turned out to be Yaz' first ever manager in semi-pro ball. Got to spend hours with him and his wife. Great people. Met a few genuinely kind old HOFers who were signing for $2-3 each and waived the fee for me for no reason at all other than to be nice to a kid. 10 minutes later, I bumped into Tom Hume at the same card show. He was there as a fan and collector, just like the rest of us. Who knew he collected 1980's Topps Coins?!

[Michael B]

Originally Posted by David Atkatz

Sounds to me like the "pisser and moaner" is quite correct. (BTW, if he is who I think he is, he's forgotten more about vintage autographs than you'll ever know. Be a bit more careful before you resort to insults.)

You need to get off your high horse and perhaps bone up on reading comprehension. I was not commenting on his knowledge of signatures but rather the snarky comment which would discourage others from attending. Neither he, nor I, nor you know what the OP's level of collecting or price tolerance is. Only he can make that determination. It is fine that the commenter chooses not to attend any more. That is his choice.

It serves no purpose to make comments that would cause someone to question whether they should attend at all. His attending is a much more accurate litmus test than any comments on this board. My comment "You won't know what is there until you go." is much more appropriate. It does not matter what I bought or the price I paid. I enjoyed the show. I found items I wanted AND I will make a very good profit on what I bought and what I paid to have signed. Last year I spent under $300 in Chicago and quadrupled that in the sales of the items. That excludes the Morgan Bulkeley which I will sell for 6-7 times what I paid for it.

Also, you do not know me, how long I have been collecting or what knowledge I have. YOU should be a little more careful before you resort to insults, your words not mine!

[Jewish-collector]

duplicate post - error

[Jewish-collector]

Michael - Tell us your experience meeting Spencer Haywood ? What Olympic items did you have him sign ? beer chug.gif

[Michael B]

Originally Posted by Jewish-collector

Michael - Tell us your experience meeting Spencer Haywood ? What Olympic items did you have him sign ? Attachment 527898

Look in the July pickups thread. All of the items are shown and I added some comments at the bottom.

[BillyCoxDodgers3B]

Originally Posted by Michael B

You need to get off your high horse and perhaps bone up on reading comprehension. I was not commenting on his knowledge of signatures but rather the snarky comment which would discourage others from attending. Neither he, nor I, nor you know what the OP's level of collecting or price tolerance is. Only he can make that determination. It is fine that the commenter chooses not to attend any more. That is his choice.

It serves no purpose to make comments that would cause someone to question whether they should attend at all. His attending is a much more accurate litmus test than any comments on this board. My comment "You won't know what is there until you go." is much more appropriate. It does not matter what I bought or the price I paid. I enjoyed the show. I found items I wanted AND I will make a very good profit on what I bought and what I paid to have signed. Last year I spent under $300 in Chicago and quadrupled that in the sales of the items. That excludes the Morgan Bulkeley which I will sell for 6-7 times what I paid for it.

Also, you do not know me, how long I have been collecting or what knowledge I have. YOU should be a little more careful before you resort to insults, your words not mine!

The OP has been posting on here for long enough so that I actually do know at least a little of what he collects. My comments were accurate for his needs, at least in regards to what I know of them, as I too keep my eyes open for similar things.

If people want to go to meet any of the signers like you did, my comments don't serve to discourage anything or anybody. They'll attend for those quite different purposes. I was talking about autographs being sold by dealers, not paid signings and meeting those athletes.

Nothing snarky in what I wrote. If I can help save somebody a few days of their time, a lot of walking around and wasted expense, I don't see that as a bad thing. Apparently, I need to be even more clear in what I write so that nothing is left over to misinterpretation:

Insofar as vintage baseball autographs of any note are concerned, both HOF and non-HOF, there was nothing good to see or purchase at any National I attended from 2008-2018. Most quality material was on display in auction house booths and not being offered for sale. The precious little quality material that was being sold by dealers was offered at price points that did not make sense to even inquire about. I tried to remain positive, but came up pretty much empty handed show after show. I quit attending and have not regretted this decision one bit. Everyone I've talked to who has continued to attend and work the event has told me this was a wise decision and they wished they didn't have to be in attendance. Collectors I have dealt with for many years are in the same camp. It might or might not be of interest that the two other folks who echoed my sentiments in this thread have around 100 years of combined collecting experience between them.

If you'd like to meet your favorite athletes and pay to have items signed, then by all means, go for that reason. If you treat the show as your social
event of the year, great. Go for that reason. If you wish to buy shiny, newer autographed items from recent private signings, go for that reason. If your optimism outweighs coming up with noting decent to buy year after year, then keep those hopes up and keep right on attending. People who answered "yes" to any of the above won't be listening to my advice, anyway.

You said you found a few items and spent a total of $15 on them. Putting aside your meet and greet and signatures from that encounter, was attending this show truly worth it for those items? I am not putting you down in any way for asking this. I'm just trying to weigh your expenses versus these pickups and any profit that is hoped to be generated. If I was going into this situation knowing that's all I would purchase, and didn't want to meet the basketball player, then that would be a colossal waste of time to me. But that's me. If you're happy with it, I tip my hat to you.

[packs]

If someone has to travel somewhere to attend something and wants to know if the trip will be worth it for them, how else are they supposed to find if they don't ask? And who would only want to hear one side of the coin if they're making a trip all that way?

Isn't all information valuable when shared?