The last thread ever on newbies buying bad cards

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Posted By: hankron

Our formum leader, Bill, said he was getting tired of all these posts about newbies bidding on bad Wagners, private auctions, etc-- and probably rightly so. It was further suggested that there be a separate permanent page of basic tips for beginning collectors, so they can refer to it or be referred to it-- and the same threads won't be regurgitated every other day (I admit that I participate!)

As such, I am making up a little page of helpful hints and common sense advice, that will both help collectors avoid scams but also make their collecting more enjoyable and rewarding ... From avoid private auctions to buy a copy of the Standard Catalog or Beckett Almanac

If anyone had any points they wish to be included, feel free to let me know.

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Posted By: steve k

Bill - you run a great forum and I sincerely enjoy it. Keep in mind that "newbies" who get scammed on say $10,000 worth of cards, then have $10,000 less to spend on yours and mine cards when we want to sell. "New" money in our hobby is what keeps it growing and the value of cards rising.

I'll admit that I enjoy the "scandalous" type threads about scammers, PSA screw-ups, etc., as well as the "regular" threads about the details, history, etc., of vintage baseball cards. But if there were not any "scandalous" threads, I would still enjoy the forum.

Certainly a page which people can refer to that helps them avoid bad transactions and scammers is a terrific idea.

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Posted By: bcornell

Speaking strictly as a reader and not as the interim forum custodian, I do find the volume of threads concerning "advice for newbie buyers" & "complaints about low-feedback sellers" overwhelming, i.e., there are too many of them. There's no mandate here about what can be discussed, but I think the arguments have been definitively made on both of these topics.

So - I fully agree with David's idea that we should have some primer about what to look out for when collecting and we can put a link to it on the homepage here. Revisions can always be made when needed. Since David volunteered to write up this document - I second that motion.

We're still waiting on the implementation of "sticky" threads from Network54. Once that happens, we can create a thread devoted to ongoing auctions.

Bill

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Posted By: Julie Vognar

on a card or a set you are not familiar with, ask a friend who is familiar with it to look at it first. And whatever he says, ask him why.
Whenever possible, win things which are 100% returnable.
If you are at a show, run over to a knowledgable friend with the card (leaving half your worldly goods as security) and ask him, and whatever he says, ask why.
When given the choice between buying something at a show, or through the mail with return priveledges, and buying on ebay or from any auction, go with the thing you can touch, or the thing you can return.

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Posted By: hankron

Julie's advice is well taken.

The key, I think, is to not only tell beginner's to get second opinions and seek advice, but to tell them where they can ask questions and get second opinions. Which is something I will do.

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Posted By: hankron

As there were no objections or suggestions concerning the 10 points I posted earlier, the list is finished (No one told me what is the official name for the Becket catalog, so only the Standard Catlog will be listed). I'm away from my home until tomorrow evening, but will post the list in a permenant spot when I return.

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Posted By: Rich Klein

The Beckett Almanac of Baseball Cards and Collectibles

Rich

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Posted By: Ben

David! You didnt leave us with enough time to read your list...I'm sure you would get some responses and additions if you left it up for more than a few hours. Please repost!

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Posted By: hankron

Beckett Almanac is included as a recommended book ... Ben, I started the thread in order to receive suggestions for the list. I incoperated every suggestion that was posted (e.g. Julie's-- and I thought her tips were good ones). This list is final for now. However, if in the future someone feels the list should be edited, I will sincerely listen to suggestions.

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Posted By: Julie

?

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Posted By: Joe P.

The last thread ever on newbies buying bad cards.

It's a give, you can bet your T205 Joss on it.

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Posted By: runscott

...so I don't recall if this item made it:

- most scammers can't avoid going for the jugular straight away, so look at the other items they are selling. Typically, if you see an American Caramel Joe Jackson, you will also see a '33 Ruth, a Dimaggio rookie, and a Play Ball Ted Williams. In real life, very few people are selling all of those at the same time, but on ebay it happens several times each month.

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Posted By: hankron

(I know the numbering is off, as I removed one tip)

Essential Tips for Starting Collectors of Vintage Baseball Cards



Collecting vintage baseball cards is an enjoyable hobby for all ages. As in all collecting areas, there are reprints, fakes and scammers. Beginners often misidentify and misvalue cards they own or are about to buy.

The following is a brief but important list of tips and points. The beginner should read over before jumping into the hobby with open pocketbook.





1) Start by knowing that there are reprints, counterfeits, fakes and scams out there. If you start by knowing you should doing your homework, having healthy skepticism of sellers’ claims and getting second opinions, you will be infinitely better off than the beginner who assumes everything’s authentic and all sellers are honest.



2) Buy and use a copy either of the following two books:

Standard Catalog of Baseball Cards, edited by Bob Lemke (Krause Publications)

or

The Beckett Almanac of Baseball Cards and Collectibles

Avaible at amazon.com, Barnes and Noble (bn.com) and many brick and mortar book stores. While the card prices should be taken with a grain of salt, each books lists and describes thousands of cards issued from the 1800 to today. An invaluable guide for both beginning and seasoned collectors.



4) Learn all you can about the hobby. Get the above guides, read books and articles, visit web pages, follow auctions, ask lots and lots of questions of collectors and dealers, visit shows, enjoy collecting and looking at cards. The mere act of collecting and enjoying looking at a large number of cards gives the collector an eye to what is authentic and what looks off.



5) Realize that novices in any area of collecting are more likely to overestimate, rather than underestimate, the value of items they own or are about to buy



6) Get second opinions and seek advice.

I can be contacted through Cycleback.com main page linked at top.

Two public message boards all about baseball cards are at:

Network54 Vintage Baseball Card Board : specializes in Pre-War Cards

PSA Message Boards : covers vintage to modern cards



7) Find out if a card grader is reputable before you purchase the graded card. Don’t assume that all card graders are equal, because they aren’t.



8) Start by buying inexpensive items. Put the 1933 Goudey Babe Ruths, 1952 Mickey Mantles and high grade T206s off until some other day.

Realize that, without exception, all beginners make mistakes. From paying too much to misjudging rarity to buying fakes. A beginner spending $10 on a $2 card or $5 on a reprint can be a healthy learning experience. Spending $1,000 on a $10 card or $5,000 on a fake is a disaster.



9) Gather a list of good sellers. A good seller is someone who is knowledgeable and trustworthy. A good seller fixes a legitimate problem when it arises.

Ask other collectors who they like. Discover good sellers on your own, by buying a few inexpensive items from an eBay seller and see how good are the transactions.

It’s best to buy real expensive items from good sellers, including those you have dealt with and those who otherwise have strong reputations.



10) Avoid private eBay auctions. These are auctions where the bidders' identities and sometimes the sellers’ feedback is hidden. Private auctions are often used by shill bidders and sellers offering problematic items



11) Make sure the seller has a solid authenticity guarantee and return policy. Legitimate sellers stand behind their products and will allow you to return it if there is a legitimate problem. Skip auctions where the seller refuses to guarantee the authenticity and doesn’t allow for returns.