NonSports Forum

Net54baseball.com
Welcome to Net54baseball.com. These forums are devoted to both Pre- and Post- war baseball cards and vintage memorabilia, as well as other sports. There is a separate section for Buying, Selling and Trading - the B/S/T area!! If you write anything concerning a person or company your full name needs to be in your post or obtainable from it. . Contact the moderator at leon@net54baseball.com should you have any questions or concerns. When you click on links to eBay on this site and make a purchase, this can result in this site earning a commission. Affiliate programs and affiliations include, but are not limited to, the eBay Partner Network. Enjoy!
Net54baseball.com
Net54baseball.com
T206s on eBay
Babe Ruth Cards on eBay
t206 Ty Cobb on eBay
Ty Cobb Cards on eBay
Lou Gehrig Cards on eBay
Baseball T201-T217 on eBay
Baseball E90-E107 on eBay
T205 Cards on eBay
Baseball Postcards on eBay
Goudey Cards on eBay
Baseball Memorabilia on eBay
Baseball Exhibit Cards on eBay
Baseball Strip Cards on eBay
Baseball Baking Cards on eBay
Sporting News Cards on eBay
Play Ball Cards on eBay
Joe DiMaggio Cards on eBay
Mickey Mantle Cards on eBay
Bowman 1951-1955 on eBay
Football Cards on eBay

Go Back   Net54baseball.com Forums > Net54baseball Postwar Sportscard Forums > Modern Baseball Cards Forum (1980-Present)

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 10-30-2021, 02:51 PM
butchie_t butchie_t is offline
β∪τ∁ℏ †∪RΩεΓ
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2021
Location: Nevada
Posts: 1,210
Default 1991 Topps Baseball Error/Variations question

For those that building a master set or have build a master set of the 1991 Topps Baseball Set (excluding Desert Storm). What are you using for the master set checklist?

I am using the Keymans Collectibles and the Baseball Card Variation Checklist Vol. 2. Becketts really does not cover the details enough for me.

What, in your opinion do you consider the complete variation list to consider your respective master set completed?

There is a card listed in the BBCVC Vol.2: #573 Rodriguez that has a logo on the back and no logo on the back. Anyone have a no logo version they can take a picture of and show me? All I ever have seen are various examples of a very faint Topps 40 year logo. Never seen one with what is considered no logo.

Any one variation harder to find than another?

Thanks,

B. T.
__________________
“Man proposes and God disposes.”
U.S. Grant, July 1, 1885

Completed: 1969 - 2000 Topps Baseball Sets and Traded Sets.

Senators and Frank Howard fan.

I collect Topps baseball variations -- I can quit anytime I want to.....I DON'T WANT TO.

Last edited by butchie_t; 11-01-2021 at 02:23 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 10-30-2021, 03:31 PM
4reals's Avatar
4reals 4reals is offline
Joe W.
J0seph Wi.er
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: SoCal
Posts: 2,014
Default 1991 Topps Baseball Error/Variations question

There is a bigger story to this than just number 573. I’m surprised any publication started recognizing this which is refreshing to hear. I spent decades opening 1991 topps just to try and find as many variations as possible. In doing so I discovered six cards, all of which I personally confirmed exist because I either own or used to own them. You said they were called “no logo” variations. I personally refer to them as bio box variations because the reason these exist is during production the sheet was fed through the press backwards and six players on the sheet have back where manager cards should be and six manager cards have logos where bio boxes should be. As far as I know it only effected the C sheet cards for a very short time. As such, these are very scarce.





Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
__________________
COLLECTING BROOKLYN DODGERS & SUPERBAS

Last edited by 4reals; 10-30-2021 at 08:34 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 10-30-2021, 03:36 PM
4reals's Avatar
4reals 4reals is offline
Joe W.
J0seph Wi.er
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: SoCal
Posts: 2,014
Default 1991 Topps Baseball Error/Variations question

There were six managers cards on the C sheet so this variation would have effected a total of 12 cards. As I said before, I confirmed the six players variations exist, however, I was only ever able to confirm four of the six manager cards. Two of them I never found but I can deduce who they are and it isn’t unreasonable to presume they exist. Here is one of them.






Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
__________________
COLLECTING BROOKLYN DODGERS & SUPERBAS

Last edited by 4reals; 10-30-2021 at 08:34 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 10-30-2021, 03:59 PM
butchie_t butchie_t is offline
β∪τ∁ℏ †∪RΩεΓ
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2021
Location: Nevada
Posts: 1,210
Default

4reals,

Thanks for the pictures and additional insight. Bio box is a much more accurate description. Until your reply, the description of no logo just did not make sense.

Time for a trip back through my dupes in hopes of a stumble-find. Somehow I doubt I will be so lucky though, but I won’t know until I look.

The search for the 6 misprints will be an interesting journey though. Did you end up with multiples or just one-off finds when you did come across them?

Regards,
__________________
“Man proposes and God disposes.”
U.S. Grant, July 1, 1885

Completed: 1969 - 2000 Topps Baseball Sets and Traded Sets.

Senators and Frank Howard fan.

I collect Topps baseball variations -- I can quit anytime I want to.....I DON'T WANT TO.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 10-30-2021, 04:23 PM
4reals's Avatar
4reals 4reals is offline
Joe W.
J0seph Wi.er
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: SoCal
Posts: 2,014
Default

I have a couple duplicates. Had all my remaining ones graded. Sold all my previous ones for A LOT to a collector who made an offer I couldn’t refuse. I’ll pm you.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
__________________
COLLECTING BROOKLYN DODGERS & SUPERBAS
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 10-30-2021, 04:46 PM
ALR-bishop ALR-bishop is offline
Al Richter
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: San Antonio
Posts: 8,958
Default

Depending on your definition of a variation, particularly if you include back differences, I do not think a complete master/super checklist exists for the 1991 set. Dylan has a good list

https://junkwaxgems.wordpress.com/ca...1991-baseball/

Last edited by ALR-bishop; 10-30-2021 at 04:49 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 10-30-2021, 06:50 PM
butchie_t butchie_t is offline
β∪τ∁ℏ †∪RΩεΓ
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2021
Location: Nevada
Posts: 1,210
Default

Thanks Al,

I am using that site too, I just forgot to include it in my op. It is hard to draw a line as to how far to take the 91 set. I know for sure I won’t chase the print code variations. I have quite a few now and 4reals has opened my eyes to more.

I believe the remaining for me will be hard to come by now and I may just have to draw a proverbial line and call it good.

Thanks,

B. T.
__________________
“Man proposes and God disposes.”
U.S. Grant, July 1, 1885

Completed: 1969 - 2000 Topps Baseball Sets and Traded Sets.

Senators and Frank Howard fan.

I collect Topps baseball variations -- I can quit anytime I want to.....I DON'T WANT TO.
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 10-30-2021, 07:55 PM
4reals's Avatar
4reals 4reals is offline
Joe W.
J0seph Wi.er
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: SoCal
Posts: 2,014
Default

Here are the bio box variation numbers on the C sheet that I have identified. Those with a "C" are confirmed. If you look closely at the number, you can make out the card number of the other card it should have been.

(C) Cal Ripken 150 > matched with 351
(C) Danny Gladden 778 > matched with 321
(C) Rich Rodriguez 573 > matched with 231
(C) Mike Jackson 534 > matched with 639
(C) Oscar Azocar 659 > matched with 261
(C) Bobby Cox (Mgr.) 759 > matched with 294
(C) Joe Torre (Mgr.) 351 > matched with 150
(C) Bob Rodgers (Mgr.) 321 > matched with 778
Doug Rader (Mgr.) 231 > matched with 573
(C) Frank Robinson (Mgr.)639 > matched with 534
Bud Harrelson (Mgr.) 261 > matched with 659
(C) Mike Moore 294 > matched with 759
__________________
COLLECTING BROOKLYN DODGERS & SUPERBAS

Last edited by 4reals; 10-30-2021 at 07:59 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 10-30-2021, 08:24 PM
4reals's Avatar
4reals 4reals is offline
Joe W.
J0seph Wi.er
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: SoCal
Posts: 2,014
Default

Here are past pics I took of others. That Ripken should be a pain for Ripken collectors to find.







Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
__________________
COLLECTING BROOKLYN DODGERS & SUPERBAS
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 10-30-2021, 08:48 PM
butchie_t butchie_t is offline
β∪τ∁ℏ †∪RΩεΓ
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2021
Location: Nevada
Posts: 1,210
Default

Dang!

You must have busted quite a load of 91’s in order to amass that many cards. How long did this end up taking you? And are you still looking for them today?

Thank you very much for this information. It is awesome what can be found on this site by only asking!

Much appreciated.

B. T.
__________________
“Man proposes and God disposes.”
U.S. Grant, July 1, 1885

Completed: 1969 - 2000 Topps Baseball Sets and Traded Sets.

Senators and Frank Howard fan.

I collect Topps baseball variations -- I can quit anytime I want to.....I DON'T WANT TO.
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 10-31-2021, 08:45 PM
4reals's Avatar
4reals 4reals is offline
Joe W.
J0seph Wi.er
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: SoCal
Posts: 2,014
Default 1991 Topps Baseball Error/Variations question

Since the price of junk wax went up over the recent hobby surge I stopped looking. I could get an unopened box for less than $20. Now it’s not worth the cost IMO. Over the last 6-12 months I started focusing on the Desert Shield cards to familiarize myself more with those and see if I could identify any similarities, variations, etc.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
__________________
COLLECTING BROOKLYN DODGERS & SUPERBAS

Last edited by 4reals; 10-31-2021 at 08:47 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 11-01-2021, 05:52 AM
deweyinthehall deweyinthehall is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2015
Location: Ellicott City, MD
Posts: 688
Default

And in all of that ripping of 1991 Topps, did you ever come across a vintage card or an expired redemption card?

I remember when this stuff was new - every time I'd go into a LCS (there were a LOT more back then) some one would be saying "my friend in Peoria found a '67 Yaz!" and then someone else would say "My friend in Billings said he pulled the '75 Yount and HIS buddy in Texarkana found a '78 Ryan AND a '71 Munson!" - sounded a lot like the college stories of the mythical girlfriend in another state.

Me? I opened a few boxes and didn't find anything. I always thought with my luck, I'd probably get a '90 checklist.

Last edited by deweyinthehall; 11-01-2021 at 05:53 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 11-01-2021, 08:24 AM
judsonhamlin judsonhamlin is offline
Member
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Scenic Central NJ
Posts: 982
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by deweyinthehall View Post
And in all of that ripping of 1991 Topps, did you ever come across a vintage card or an expired redemption card?

I remember when this stuff was new - every time I'd go into a LCS (there were a LOT more back then) some one would be saying "my friend in Peoria found a '67 Yaz!" and then someone else would say "My friend in Billings said he pulled the '75 Yount and HIS buddy in Texarkana found a '78 Ryan AND a '71 Munson!" - sounded a lot like the college stories of the mythical girlfriend in another state.

Me? I opened a few boxes and didn't find anything. I always thought with my luck, I'd probably get a '90 checklist.
I actually got a 1990 Joey Meyer. And that’s out of about 30-40 boxes.
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 11-01-2021, 09:32 AM
butchie_t butchie_t is offline
β∪τ∁ℏ †∪RΩεΓ
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2021
Location: Nevada
Posts: 1,210
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by judsonhamlin View Post
I actually got a 1990 Joey Meyer. And that’s out of about 30-40 boxes.
So you are saying that I got a chance........

Not a fan of those odds unless the boxes are a buck a piece or less.

Cheers,
__________________
“Man proposes and God disposes.”
U.S. Grant, July 1, 1885

Completed: 1969 - 2000 Topps Baseball Sets and Traded Sets.

Senators and Frank Howard fan.

I collect Topps baseball variations -- I can quit anytime I want to.....I DON'T WANT TO.
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 11-01-2021, 09:38 AM
saucywombat saucywombat is offline
Dave L.
member
 
Join Date: Jul 2020
Location: Charleston
Posts: 50
Default

About 10 years ago, looking for AB print code variations and the other abundant errors in this set I did pull a 1962 Dallas Green from a wax pack.
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 11-01-2021, 09:46 AM
4reals's Avatar
4reals 4reals is offline
Joe W.
J0seph Wi.er
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: SoCal
Posts: 2,014
Default

I’ve opened well over 100 boxes over the years and only ever came across two, both forgettable. They weren’t stamped or marked in any significant way so into the commons box they went.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
__________________
COLLECTING BROOKLYN DODGERS & SUPERBAS
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 11-01-2021, 10:24 AM
JoeDfan JoeDfan is offline
Sean Sullivan
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Maine
Posts: 1,036
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by deweyinthehall View Post
And in all of that ripping of 1991 Topps, did you ever come across a vintage card or an expired redemption card?

I remember when this stuff was new - every time I'd go into a LCS (there were a LOT more back then) some one would be saying "my friend in Peoria found a '67 Yaz!" and then someone else would say "My friend in Billings said he pulled the '75 Yount and HIS buddy in Texarkana found a '78 Ryan AND a '71 Munson!" - sounded a lot like the college stories of the mythical girlfriend in another state.

Me? I opened a few boxes and didn't find anything. I always thought with my luck, I'd probably get a '90 checklist.
When I was a kid, I invariably pulled a Vern Ruhle card out of just about every pack I opened. I must have 50 Ruhle cards kicking around my baseball room somewhere.

A couple of years ago, I did pull a vintage card from a '91 Topps box.
I will let you guess who it was.

If I find my cards, perhaps I will see if I can become the top PSA Vern Ruhle collector.
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 11-01-2021, 11:21 AM
bnorth's Avatar
bnorth bnorth is offline
Ben North
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: South Dakota
Posts: 9,822
Default

I opened a lot of it back in the day and got a 1988 common.
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 11-01-2021, 12:52 PM
Rich Klein Rich Klein is offline
Rich Klein
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Plano Tx
Posts: 4,484
Default

After this set, Topps did make sure to have any buy backs cards ID'd with a stamp. You had nowhere to go when you pulled a 1989 common as a friend of mine did get.

And as always, if anyone wants me to go through and break out 1991 Variations of any card let me know and I'll go through the data base and make those changes if we have any in the COMC data base.

Rich
__________________
Look for our show listings in the Net 54 Calendar section

Last edited by Rich Klein; 11-02-2021 at 03:05 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 11-01-2021, 01:41 PM
steve B steve B is offline
Steve Birmingham
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: eastern Mass.
Posts: 8,097
Default

I don't think there are any truly complete lists.

I'm not familiar with the Keyman one, but the one at Junkwax gems is excellent.

That being said, my batch of them has cards he doesn't list, and some oddball stuff I'm still needing to look into.

Besides those.....

There's the glow backs and non- glow backs, and some that react a very dark red that's hard to tell given using a blacklight in darkness.
A few that have strands in the cardstock that react. I'm still unsure of these.
And a possible thing where the glosscoat may react greenish under a blacklight.

I really have to find my notes and type them up.
Reply With Quote
  #21  
Old 11-01-2021, 01:49 PM
butchie_t butchie_t is offline
β∪τ∁ℏ †∪RΩεΓ
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2021
Location: Nevada
Posts: 1,210
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by steve B View Post
I don't think there are any truly complete lists.

I'm not familiar with the Keyman one, but the one at Junkwax gems is excellent.

That being said, my batch of them has cards he doesn't list, and some oddball stuff I'm still needing to look into.

Besides those.....

There's the glow backs and non- glow backs, and some that react a very dark red that's hard to tell given using a blacklight in darkness.
A few that have strands in the cardstock that react. I'm still unsure of these.
And a possible thing where the glosscoat may react greenish under a blacklight.

I really have to find my notes and type them up.
w w w dot keymancollectibles dot com and find the 91 set. He has a number of the variations listed. I incorporated all three; key man, junk wax and BBCVC Vol. 2.

I went back through my 91 dupes and I found a couple Ben McDonalds that have an extremely hard to see, almost invisible to the eye, logo on the back of two of them.

Old Ben may have to be my poor mans missing Topps Logo back card instead of the Rodriguez and others listed in this thread.

Regards,
__________________
“Man proposes and God disposes.”
U.S. Grant, July 1, 1885

Completed: 1969 - 2000 Topps Baseball Sets and Traded Sets.

Senators and Frank Howard fan.

I collect Topps baseball variations -- I can quit anytime I want to.....I DON'T WANT TO.
Reply With Quote
  #22  
Old 11-01-2021, 10:31 PM
jacksoncoupage jacksoncoupage is offline
Dylan
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: OR/CA
Posts: 366
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by butchie_t View Post
Thanks Al,

I am using that site too, I just forgot to include it in my op. It is hard to draw a line as to how far to take the 91 set. I know for sure I won’t chase the print code variations. I have quite a few now and 4reals has opened my eyes to more.

I believe the remaining for me will be hard to come by now and I may just have to draw a proverbial line and call it good.

Thanks,

B. T.
Just curious but why wouldn't you include them if you're pursuing a master set? They are the very definition of a variation in that Topps made a deliberate change to a card and/or the printing plate.

Quote:
Originally Posted by butchie_t View Post

There is a card listed in the BBCVC Vol.2: #573 Rodriguez that has a logo on the back and no logo on the back. Anyone have a no logo version they can take a picture of and show me? All I ever have seen are various examples of a very faint Topps 40 year logo. Never seen one with what is considered no logo.
I have found a handful that are not part of the C* sheet, including Chipper's Draft Pick card (twice). No logo or red area behind the bio information at top.
__________________
JunkWaxGems - Showcasing the rare, little-known and sometimes mysterious cards of the 1980s and 1990s. https://junkwaxgems.wordpress.com/

Oddball, promos and variations:http://www.comc.com/Users/JunkWaxGems,sr

Last edited by jacksoncoupage; 11-01-2021 at 10:35 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #23  
Old 11-02-2021, 05:46 AM
butchie_t butchie_t is offline
β∪τ∁ℏ †∪RΩεΓ
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2021
Location: Nevada
Posts: 1,210
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by jacksoncoupage View Post
Just curious but why wouldn't you include them if you're pursuing a master set? They are the very definition of a variation in that Topps made a deliberate change to a card and/or the printing plate.
Well, it comes down to finding them and then paying for them. I’m not inclined to drop a potential grand or more on the remaining cards that are near impossible to find. And the fact that they are not really recognized as error-variations also comes into play. A sampling of the two back errors may be as far as I probably take it.

I have most all but a handful of documented variations. For me, that is the definition of a master set. The others are an excellent find by 4reals but are probably out of reach in many instances. Especially the Ripken.

Other opinions can be different on this subject, and that is ok.
__________________
“Man proposes and God disposes.”
U.S. Grant, July 1, 1885

Completed: 1969 - 2000 Topps Baseball Sets and Traded Sets.

Senators and Frank Howard fan.

I collect Topps baseball variations -- I can quit anytime I want to.....I DON'T WANT TO.
Reply With Quote
  #24  
Old 11-02-2021, 09:51 AM
ALR-bishop ALR-bishop is offline
Al Richter
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: San Antonio
Posts: 8,958
Default

Butch---I generally agree with your points here, especially since I still don't think anyone has a fully agreed upon master set checklist for 1991

But your term " documented" variations is also an elusive standard because whose documentation one chooses to use can vary as well.

In the end we all set our own parameters for what we collect. Nothing wrong with that
Reply With Quote
  #25  
Old 11-02-2021, 09:55 AM
butchie_t butchie_t is offline
β∪τ∁ℏ †∪RΩεΓ
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2021
Location: Nevada
Posts: 1,210
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ALR-bishop View Post
Butch---I generally agree with your points here, especially since I still don't think anyone has a fully agreed upon master set checklist for 1991

But your term " documented" variations is also an elusive standard because whose documentation one chooses to use can vary as well.

In the end we all set our own parameters for what we collect. Nothing wrong with that
Agree, documented is purely subjective in oh so many ways. So, I picked 3, right or wrong, I picked them. And that is what I am going on. I can do no better than that at this point as no company has really stepped up and said... "yeah verily, these are the chosen ones." So I chose myself.

Sorry for the nebulous use of the word documented. It does take on many a definition. Especially in this hobby.

Oh, and opinions regarding this hobby are as plentiful as the variations/errors too, no problems with that at all. --Cheers!


Regards,

B. T.
__________________
“Man proposes and God disposes.”
U.S. Grant, July 1, 1885

Completed: 1969 - 2000 Topps Baseball Sets and Traded Sets.

Senators and Frank Howard fan.

I collect Topps baseball variations -- I can quit anytime I want to.....I DON'T WANT TO.

Last edited by butchie_t; 11-02-2021 at 10:21 AM.
Reply With Quote
Reply



Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Some pretty cool new(?) 1963 Topps Printing Error/Variations Cliff Bowman Postwar Baseball Cards Forum (Pre-1980) 50 01-25-2021 05:56 AM
1991 Topps Variations toppcat Modern Baseball Cards Forum (1980-Present) 21 11-02-2020 04:20 PM
Error variations vs. Print Variations: 1990 Fleer Martinez deweyinthehall Modern Baseball Cards Forum (1980-Present) 16 04-25-2020 07:28 AM
1991 Topps Glow Backs/variations/game cards judsonhamlin 1980 & Newer Sports Cards B/S/T 0 01-20-2020 08:13 AM
1991 Topps Desert Shield - Error - Currahee4 Zach Wheat Modern Baseball Cards Forum (1980-Present) 0 02-02-2019 02:00 PM


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 02:09 AM.


ebay GSB