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  #1  
Old 11-23-2022, 04:45 PM
stat192 stat192 is offline
Giovanni N.
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Default Sam Jones Help (Baseball)

There were 2 Sam Jones who played, one who debuted in 1914 and one who debuted in 1951.

The 14 Sam Jones called himself Sad Sam Jones. I have the below autograph which I always thought was the 1951 Sam Jones, but it is signed Sad Sam Jones.

The GPC is postmarked from Cleveland on May 20, 1952, and the 1951 Jones was playing for Cleveland that year.

So which Sam Jones do I have, and if it is the 1951 one, why would he sign his name Sad Sam Jones.

Please help.

IMG.jpg

IMG_0001.jpg
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Old 11-23-2022, 05:00 PM
Republicaninmass Republicaninmass is offline
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I believe they were both Sad Sam, and that looks like the earlier player. The latter player his signature is not as clean, but is is rare and havent seen more than a few
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Old 11-23-2022, 05:38 PM
stat192 stat192 is offline
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that is what is confusing me i think its the earlier player but whats the chance of having a postmark from cleveland ohio in 1952
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Old 11-23-2022, 05:48 PM
Republicaninmass Republicaninmass is offline
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Talking

One in 50
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Old 11-23-2022, 06:02 PM
uga1980 uga1980 is offline
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The autograph you have is of Sam Jones who pitched for the Cleveland Indians who was also referred to as "toothpick". There was a thread discussing the two variances on net54 before but I don't recall the actual post date.
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Old 11-23-2022, 06:03 PM
uga1980 uga1980 is offline
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https://net54baseball.com/showthread.php?t=158940
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Old 11-23-2022, 06:17 PM
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Here is the earlier, former Yankee, Sam Jones.
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File Type: jpg sam jones 3x5 (sold) copy.jpg (154.5 KB, 167 views)
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Old 11-23-2022, 06:42 PM
Republicaninmass Republicaninmass is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by uga1980 View Post
The autograph you have is of Sam Jones who pitched for the Cleveland Indians who was also referred to as "toothpick". There was a thread discussing the two variances on net54 before but I don't recall the actual post date.
The guy who was supposedly illiterate ?

Aaaand (from the thread) "whats odd is BOTH Sam Jones have similar signature slants up and to the right"


I'd wager the PSA examples with smooth writing are forgeries, as well as the 2 sgc signed slabbed examples
Attached Images
File Type: jpg Screenshot_20221123-193514_Samsung Internet.jpg (200.2 KB, 162 views)
File Type: jpg 20221123_194026.jpg (88.8 KB, 161 views)
File Type: jpg Screenshot_20221123-193833_Samsung Internet.jpg (147.8 KB, 163 views)
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Old 11-23-2022, 06:46 PM
stat192 stat192 is offline
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Thank you all for your replies, everyone on this board is amazing
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Old 11-26-2022, 04:33 AM
etsmith etsmith is online now
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Default Sam Jones

So which Sam Jones would this autograph be?

Sam P. Jones Baseball.jpg
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  #11  
Old 11-26-2022, 06:47 AM
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Default Samuel Pond Jones AKA "Sad Sam" circa 1925 Payroll Check

Your check is signed Samuel P (Pond) Jones, which is Sad Sam.
For a reference point, here is a payroll check that I own of Sad Sam that is dated 1925.

Believe it or not, I purchased this check from a collector in Japan at least 13-15 years ago.
Collecting prewar vintage baseball is truly an international hobby.

I hope this helps!
Attached Images
File Type: jpg Sad Sam Jones 1925 payroll check - back 001.jpg (172.3 KB, 107 views)
File Type: jpg Sad Sam Jones 1925 payroll check- front 001.jpg (165.5 KB, 105 views)

Last edited by Scott Garner; 11-26-2022 at 06:56 AM.
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Old 11-27-2022, 12:41 AM
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It doesn't look much like the one on the 3x5 card a couple of posts up.
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Old 11-27-2022, 12:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by etsmith View Post
It doesn't look much like the one on the 3x5 card a couple of posts up.
Hi Ed,
As strange as it may seem, it was not an unusual practice for some players to use a more formal signature with more "flourish" when their signature was requested from friends, someone of note or occasionally a collector. Sad Sam Jones (Samuel Pond Jones) and Lefty Grove are great examples of this practice.

Here is an early vintage signed index card of Sad Sam that I own, that also shows his beautiful signature with the flourish that I mentioned.

Also for extra context, I will show an example of Lefty Grove's formal autograph. Compare it to about 95% of every Grove signature that you see on eBay and you can see there is a HUGE difference.

I hope this helps!
Attached Images
File Type: jpg Sad Sam Jones index card front.jpg (89.9 KB, 68 views)
File Type: jpg Sad Sam Jones index card back.jpg (61.8 KB, 65 views)
File Type: jpg Sad Sam Jones picture .jpg (111.0 KB, 66 views)
File Type: jpg Lefty Grove 1939 signed GPC.jpg (150.6 KB, 65 views)
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  #14  
Old 11-29-2022, 12:28 AM
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The Sam Jones is a really attractive signature, but most players back then had really great handwriting unlike today's players.
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Old 11-29-2022, 09:24 AM
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So true!
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