Protection when we use paypal gift ?

[g_vezina_c55]

When we use Paypal Gift as a payment method, any protection for the buyer ?

Any reclamation possibilities ?

[npa589]

Short answer? No. Only use it for well established sellers and if a high dollar purchase, I recommend it be a requirement for the card(s) to be insured.

[bnorth]

No you have no protection as a buyer when using paypal gift. I am on 1 forum that will delete your account if you even ask to be paid with paypal gift because it is how scammers ask for payment to protect themselves.

It is ok with someone you know or a low end card. The fact almost everyone on this site asks for it and wants to sent $100 cards in a PWE really worried me at first till I had been on the site for a while and learned most on here could be trusted.

[HRBAKER]

Just a question, why would they offer you any protection for something you are not paying for?

[g_vezina_c55]

Thanks everyone for the reply.

[Texxxx]

Originally Posted by npa589

Short answer? No. Only use it for well established sellers and if a high dollar purchase, I recommend it be a requirement for the card(s) to be insured.

I am one that does not insure high dollar cards I sell. I self insure. I may have to pay out for a card that gets damaged or lost from time to time but in the long run I will come out way ahead money wise. I understand this is not for everyone. If I loose a $2000 card it's not going to kill me.

[frankbmd]

Originally Posted by Texxxx

I am one that does not insure high dollar cards I sell. I self insure. I may have to pay out for a card that gets damaged or lost from time to time but in the long run I will come out way ahead money wise. I understand this is not for everyone. If I loose a $2000 card it's not going to kill me.

I agree. If I had insured all the packages I have sent in the last seven years, it would have cost me at least $1000 and probably more. My total losses due to the post office or a dishonest buyer who claimed not to receive are $25. If requested, I will insure at the buyer's expense. Gifting on this forum has not posed any problems. For those uncomfortable with this, adding 3% for the buyer protection that PP offers is fine as well.

[autograf]

Do you use Delivery Confirmation then? If you don't insure and self insure, that's great but without DC or some form of it, you could be scammed without a card actually getting lost. Over a period of time, insurance does get to be very costly. I can see benefits for both ways..........

I'd also be concerned about anyone using a PWE on a $100 card. What does a padded envelope cost?

[Leon]

Paypal gift (Friends and Family) is a different product and I always know there are no protections. That is also why I don't mind taking it or giving it with most on this board, especially folks I know. This board is a bit different than most BUT WE ARE getting to be quite large. So, if you feel uncomfortable I strongly recommend using regular paypal and paying the fees. I do pay paypal fees many times because I want the protection.

[chipperhank44]

"I am a victim of fraud as a result of my own fraud." - People who have been screwed using Paypal Gift

[npa589]

Agreed, I have insurance through Collect Insure. It protects the collection, and added within the policy is insurance for an item on the way to its buyer, and the deductible is 150-200$.

Originally Posted by Texxxx

I am one that does not insure high dollar cards I sell. I self insure. I may have to pay out for a card that gets damaged or lost from time to time but in the long run I will come out way ahead money wise. I understand this is not for everyone. If I loose a $2000 card it's not going to kill me.

[4815162342]

Originally Posted by chipperhank44

"I am a victim of fraud as a result of my own fraud." - People who have been screwed using Paypal Gift

Please explain how using PayPal gift is fraud.

[chipperhank44]

Originally Posted by 4815162342

Please explain how using PayPal gift is fraud.

When you use "gift" to purchase goods or services via Paypal.



Not saying using Paypal Gift for purchases is a felony or anything, however, the point of my initial post might be better stated below:


--> When Paypal clearly offers an option for purchasing goods and services that includes protection for the involved parties, and that option is avoided (often dishonestly) for financial reasons, the parties who avoided the purchasing option are not entitled to the protection that they consciously avoided.

[4815162342]

Originally Posted by chipperhank44

When you use "gift" to purchase goods or services via Paypal.



Not saying using Paypal Gift for purchases is a felony or anything, however, the point of my initial post might be better stated below:


--> When Paypal clearly offers an option for purchasing goods and services that includes protection for the involved parties, and that option is avoided (often dishonestly) for financial reasons, the parties who avoided the purchasing option are not entitled to the protection that they consciously avoided.

I agree totally with your last statement, that neither party is entitled to any protection by PayPal for using PayPal gift, money owed, etc. But just because you choose not to pay for that protection and use another service that is offered free of charge, does not mean that it is fraudulent to use it. I have not had one single issue in either sending or receiving money and cards on the Net54 BST without any third-party guarantees/protection (other than shipping insurance). Would I ever send money via PayPal gift to anyone I did not know? Of course not.

[baseballart]

Originally Posted by 4815162342

I agree totally with your last statement, that neither party is entitled to any protection by PayPal for using PayPal gift, money owed, etc. But just because you choose not to pay for that protection and use another service that is offered free of charge, does not mean that it is fraudulent to use it. I have not had one single issue in either sending or receiving money and cards on the Net54 BST without any third-party guarantees/protection (other than shipping insurance). Would I ever send money via PayPal gift to anyone I did not know? Of course not.

From the paypal terms of use (to which all users have agreed):

“Personal Payment” means amounts sent between two individuals (not to or from a business) without a purchase. Examples of Personal Payments include sending a gift to a friend, or paying a friend back for your share of a lunch bill."

And:

"4.1 Receiving Personal Payments.
If you are selling goods or services, you may not ask the buyer to send you a Personal Payment for the purchase. If you do so, PayPal may remove your ability to accept Personal Payments."

It's thus a breach of your terms of agreement with paypal.

[Texxxx]

The notice I got last Friday saying my health insurance is going up 17% on Jan. 1 is from fraud also.

Sorry just had to vent a little.

[4815162342]

Originally Posted by baseballart

From the paypal terms of use (to which all users have agreed):

“Personal Payment” means amounts sent between two individuals (not to or from a business) without a purchase. Examples of Personal Payments include sending a gift to a friend, or paying a friend back for your share of a lunch bill."

And:

"4.1 Receiving Personal Payments.
If you are selling goods or services, you may not ask the buyer to send you a Personal Payment for the purchase. If you do so, PayPal may remove your ability to accept Personal Payments."

It's thus a breach of your terms of agreement with paypal.

Thanks for the information Max. I guess I'll go back to the old days - a check in an SASE.

[g_vezina_c55]

Originally Posted by 4815162342

Thanks for the information Max. I guess I'll go back to the old days - a check in an SASE.

yep thanks for the info.
I think i will not use the gift in the futur as a seller and also as a buyer.
Thanks

[HRBAKER]

Originally Posted by baseballart

From the paypal terms of use (to which all users have agreed):

“Personal Payment” means amounts sent between two individuals (not to or from a business) without a purchase. Examples of Personal Payments include sending a gift to a friend, or paying a friend back for your share of a lunch bill."

And:

"4.1 Receiving Personal Payments.
If you are selling goods or services, you may not ask the buyer to send you a Personal Payment for the purchase. If you do so, PayPal may remove your ability to accept Personal Payments."

It's thus a breach of your terms of agreement with paypal.

"An Inconvenient Truth," vol. 2.

[Leon]

When ebay told me I couldn't accept a cash or check for payment, I made some justifications with their sister company, paypal. As it says in their terms, they may tell me I can't do that anymore. I am ok with that. To each their own.

[HRBAKER]

I agree to each their own.
I understand your POV (as we have discussed it before), but when you ask someone else to pay that way you are asking them to break the terms too, not just yourself.

[Leon]

Originally Posted by HRBAKER

I agree to each their own.
I understand your POV (as we have discussed it before), but when you ask someone else to pay that way you are asking them to break the terms too, not just yourself.

I usually say I prefer F and F but will accept regular too. If someone ever told me they had an issue with paying a certain way I would gladly accept it another way, or by check. Just because I feel the way I do doesn't mean I should force that on others. I wouldn't do that.

[chipperhank44]

Originally Posted by Texxxx

The notice I got last Friday saying my health insurance is going up 17% on Jan. 1 is from fraud also.

Sorry just had to vent a little.

+1 (90% increase in the last 3 years and the addition of deductibles)

[Rob D.]

Originally Posted by baseballart

From the paypal terms of use (to which all users have agreed):

“Personal Payment” means amounts sent between two individuals (not to or from a business) without a purchase. Examples of Personal Payments include sending a gift to a friend, or paying a friend back for your share of a lunch bill."

And:

"4.1 Receiving Personal Payments.
If you are selling goods or services, you may not ask the buyer to send you a Personal Payment for the purchase. If you do so, PayPal may remove your ability to accept Personal Payments."

It's thus a breach of your terms of agreement with paypal.

Little-known addendum to 4.1 of the terms of use:

4.1a

If either seller or buyer is of the opinion that:

A. PayPal already makes too much money; and/or

B. eBay sucks;

then either party is entitled to breach the PayPal terms of use and use the Personal Payment for a purchase or other business transaction.