Lena's Mud and Goodell's Balls - A Brief Commentary

[frankbmd]

The ability of each team in the NFL to coddle, fondle, inflate or deflate and rub their own balls before a game seems like a problem with a simple solution.

In baseball Lena's Mud has been used for decades to prep the game balls which I believe remain in control of the umpires before and during the game. Both teams' pitchers are presented with balls from the same box(es) during the game and the balls become an issue only when a pitcher doctors the ball in some manner, such as formerly with a hocker of spit and more recently with a concealed foreign substance or cut.

In football putting game balls under the control of each team seems to invite skullduggery, in which the Patriots seem inclined to participate.

I say "level the playing field", and let the NFL and officials prepare the balls for both teams. If Goodell had the balls to do it, the problem would be solved.

[Bocabirdman]

Originally Posted by frankbmd

The ability of each team in the NFL to coddle, fondle, inflate or deflate and rub their own balls before a game seems like a problem with a simple solution.

In baseball Lena's Mud has been used for decades to prep the game balls which I believe remain in control of the umpires before and during the game. Both teams' pitchers are presented with balls from the same box(es) during the game and the balls become an issue only when a pitcher doctors the ball in some manner, such as formerly with a hocker of spit and more recently with a concealed foreign substance or cut.

In football putting game balls under the control of each team seems to invite skullduggery, in which the Patriots seem inclined to participate.

I say "level the playing field", and let the NFL and officials prepare the balls for both teams. If Goodell had the balls to do it, the problem would be solved.

If Goodell had the Balls before the game then nobody could get their hands on them for the purpose of manually manipulating their hardness.

[steve B]

The first article I read said the refs checked the balls at halftime because the Colts told the league the one intercepted was soft. And that all were replaced before the second half.

So the score was close while they were supposedly cheating, and the blowout happened using balls the refs knew were just fine.

Somehow it seems silly to make an issue of what's basically a non-factor.
In fact, without the deflation maybe the interception never happens and the blowout is 7 points worse......Or maybe the Colts magically figure out how to stop a running play and it's not a blowout? Should the check Blounts shoes to see if they're special in some way? Maybe like Dorothys red ones ? click three times and say "take me to the end zone" (Heck, Gray must have had a couple pairs of those on a few weeks ago)

Among the rest of the "cheating" claims it's being blown up just like the taping thing. It wasn't actually defensive signals, nor that the taping was done. it was that the taping was done from an area forbidden by the NFL. If the camera guy had been on the sidelines it would have been ok. In fact, the Jets had been taping the Patriots practice from a similar location a few weeks before and it was handled by simply telling the camera person they had to tape from the right area. The Jets didn't do that but instead went straight to the league. The big penalty really wasn't for the taping, but for doing it essentially right after the league sent a memo outlining the allowable taping locations. A memo which was sent to ALL teams since taping what practices are available is standard practice.

But of course controversy sells. As if the Superbowl needs more publicity.

Steve B

[frankbmd]

Well I've learned from all this that

Brady likes soft balls

Rodgers likes hard balls

and Goldilocks likes bear (or is it bare) balls that are just right.

[steve B]

Here's a newer article with better details.

http://www.boston.com/sports/footbal...ls_for_af.html

The key part about the problem being fixed at halftime.

"ESPN Sports Radio 810 in Kansas City reported that the Patriots footballs were tested during halftme, re-inflated after when they were found to be under-inflated, then the balls put back in play for the second half and then tested again after the game."

Even disallowing all the first half points leaves the Colts down 28-7

Steve B

This whole controversy is completely overblown, a lot of hot air from blustery windbags....

[D.P.Johnson]

Frank.....Really???

The best games I've ever participated in included at least one hocker of spit, as well as a lot of ball rubbing throughout the contest...

[pgellis]

Whether the pressure of the balls meant a difference or not, THE MAIN POINT is that the Patriots have been accused of tampering with the balls after the officials deemed them legal which takes place 2 hours and 15 minutes prior to kickoff.

So, somebody deflated 11 of the 12 balls prior to half-time. Too bad Pats fans....caught cheating again.

[frankbmd]

Originally Posted by D.P.Johnson

Frank.....Really???

The best games I've ever participated in included at least one hocker of spit, as well as a lot of ball rubbing throughout the contest...

I hope you all realize I am taking this issue very seriously and with respect to this thread

De odor ain't from de flatus.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by steve B

Here's a newer article with better details.

http://www.boston.com/sports/footbal...ls_for_af.html

The key part about the problem being fixed at halftime.

"ESPN Sports Radio 810 in Kansas City reported that the Patriots footballs were tested during halftme, re-inflated after when they were found to be under-inflated, then the balls put back in play for the second half and then tested again after the game."

Even disallowing all the first half points leaves the Colts down 28-7

Steve B

How many times did the referees handle the balls in the first half and not notice anything? This is so much ado about nothing.

[pgellis]

Peter, I think you are wrong. Even if the officials noticed something, they need a team to make a complaint. It's much like in baseball last year when Michael Pineda had about a pound of pine tar on his neck. It may have been apparent to the umpires, but they needed the Red Sox to make a formal complaint before they could do anything.
Once the Colts intercepted a pass, they made their complaint.

To blame the officials does not lessen the fact that the Patriots cheated.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Originally Posted by pgellis

Peter, I think you are wrong. Even if the officials noticed something, they need a team to make a complaint. It's much like in baseball last year when Michael Pineda had about a pound of pine tar on his neck. It may have been apparent to the umpires, but they needed the Red Sox to make a formal complaint before they could do anything.
Once the Colts intercepted a pass, they made their complaint.

To blame the officials does not lessen the fact that the Patriots cheated.

So an NFL referee notices that there is something wrong with a game ball, and he is powerless to do anything about it? I haven't consulted the rulebook but that is very hard to fathom and if so it's a really stupid rule.

By the way my point is not to blame the officials but to suggest that this supposed deflation may not even have been perceptible.

Finally, they could have put a grapefruit out there and Brady would have outplayed Luck.

[frankbmd]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

So an NFL referee notices that there is something wrong with a game ball, and he is powerless to do anything about it? I haven't consulted the rulebook but that is very hard to fathom and if so it's a really stupid rule.

By the way my point is not to blame the officials but to suggest that this supposed deflation may not even have been perceptible.

Finally, they could have put a grapefruit out there and Brady would have outplayed Luck.

And if they kicked a field goal, the holder would be juiced?

[HRBAKER]

The Patriots must have also figured out a way to overinflate the Colts balls.

[clydepepper]

Am I the only one who never even knew that each team uses their own footballs while on offense? How strange is that? ESPN was discussing how it would never fly in either basketball or baseball. They surmised that the reasoning behind it was to keep all of thee quarterbacks happy.

They also brought up the fact that Brady was 11-for21 with one TD and one interception in the first half with the lower pressured balls and 12-for-14 with two touchdowns, no interceptions and twice as much yardage in the second half with the correctly pressurized footballs.

The questions are: If such a rule exists, but isn't enforced, then why even have the rule and if such a rule is broken what- if any should be the penalty. ESPN was stating that since it's Belichick, and since he has 'a past history of deception' the penalty should be sizable.

My question is: Isn't this just the minutia meant for a slow sports news day?

[frankbmd]

Originally Posted by HRBAKER

The Patriots must have also figured out a way to overinflate the Colts balls.

That's called epididymitis, Jeff.

[steve B]

From a couple articles the penalty appears to be $25000 for altering a game ball. Or 275,000 for eleven. (I see no mention of any bargain for an even dozen like donuts, there would be if I wrote the rules )

It will be interesting to see if they go beyond what the rules call for.

From comments from players especially quarterbacks, the rule appears to be almost universally ignored.

Steve B

[pgellis]

Originally Posted by steve B

From a couple articles the penalty appears to be $25000 for altering a game ball. Or 275,000 for eleven. (I see no mention of any bargain for an even dozen like donuts, there would be if I wrote the rules )

It will be interesting to see if they go beyond what the rules call for.

From comments from players especially quarterbacks, the rule appears to be almost universally ignored.

Steve B

Steve, you are just plain wrong with that. The $25,000 fine is the "minimum" penalty, not the only penalty.

And the rule is not ignored. I believe that QBs may alter balls before they bring them to officials, but once they are checked, 99.9% of teams/QBs do not then go back to them and alter them. That is what is being accused here.

[Runscott]

Originally Posted by pgellis

I believe that QBs may alter balls before they bring them to officials,...

Phil - that's standard protocol for all teams. I did extensive research on this, as well as handling of 'K Balls', last year. I wrote a yet-to-be-published article regarding it, but that's another story.

One of the things I did was to buy a new NFL football and prepare it as best I could, for 'game' use. It was a grueling experience involving wet towels, driers, heavy objects, etc. I wish we had known about this stuff when I was a kid - it really helps the 'play' of the ball, but then again - I only ever owned one new football until this most recent acquisition. I based some of my effort on the following article, but there are many others:

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/11/24/sp...king.html?_r=0

[itjclarke]

Originally Posted by Runscott

Phil - that's standard protocol for all teams. I did extensive research on this, as well as handling of 'K Balls', last year. I wrote a yet-to-be-published article regarding it, but that's another story.

One of the things I did was to buy a new NFL football and prepare it as best I could, for 'game' use. It was a grueling experience involving wet towels, driers, heavy objects, etc. I wish we had known about this stuff when I was a kid - it really helps the 'play' of the ball, but then again - I only ever owned one new football until this most recent acquisition.[/URL]

As said in the other thread, this story is ridiculous. If the league had ever really cared to enforce this, they would supply the teams' game balls in game rather than prior. As is, on every level besides the NFL, each team plays with whatever type and style game ball they're comfortable with. Wilson 1005 were "passing balls", while Wilson 1001 were standard balls. In the late '90's, I'd guess Nebraska used a 1001, while Florida used a 1005. Not sure what all the college variants are now, but they're still variants. Why would it be expected this level of choice and customization would stop in the NFL if it is allowed on every other level, and is not truly enforced in the pros?

As for wet towels, or whatever.. if the league ever decided to truly regulate games balls and give both teams balls randomly from the same batch, QBs would just wipe sweat from their belly or spit in their hands to achieve the same effect.

Think this story and the league's response is a vehicle to further hype the game.

[Runscott]

Originally Posted by itjclarke

As said in the other thread, this story is ridiculous. If the league had ever really cared to enforce this, they would supply the teams' game balls in game rather than prior. As is, on every level besides the NFL, each team plays with whatever type and style game ball they're comfortable with. Wilson 1005 were "passing balls", while Wilson 1001 were standard balls. In the late '90's, I'd guess Nebraska used a 1001, while Florida used a 1005. Not sure what all the college variants are now, but they're still variants. Why would it be expected this level of choice and customization would stop in the NFL if it is allowed on every other level, and is not truly enforced in the pros?

As for wet towels, or whatever.. if the league ever decided to truly regulate games balls and give both teams balls randomly from the same batch, QBs would just wipe sweat from their belly or spit in their hands to achieve the same effect.

Think this story and the league's response is a vehicle to further hype the game.

I can't sleep either

The wet towel thing wasn't a quick process - saturating an entire football multiple times with belly sweat is kind of scary.

I hope you are right about it just being a story to hype the game, but my thinking is that if everyone is doing it (deflating balls by as much as 2 pounds), then even if current quarterbacks and personnel aren't willing to admit it, there are plenty of ex-NFL quarterbacks and equipment managers who would come forward to get their moment in the spotlight just prior to the SuperBowl.

[itjclarke]

Originally Posted by Runscott

I can't sleep either

The wet towel thing wasn't a quick process - saturating an entire football multiple times with belly sweat is kind of scary.

I hope you are right about it just being a story to hype the game, but my thinking is that if everyone is doing it (deflating balls by as much as 2 pounds), then even if current quarterbacks and personnel aren't willing to admit it, there are plenty of ex-NFL quarterbacks and equipment managers who would come forward to get their moment in the spotlight just prior to the SuperBowl.

Haha, I slept eventually, but posted after a little bit of a bender.. Was actually in Seattle with the buddy that works for the Hawks, though I forgot to ask him about fate of last Sunday's NFC Champ game balls!!

I still have a handful of footballs, and always preferred them to be slightly under inflated when I was playing (also used belly/forehead sweat, spit, dew, etc to better grip). I have no idea what psi I was filling to since the cheap little pumps I've used don't have a gauge. That said, I'd be curious to feel footballs at 13 vs 10 and 11 psi. I'm guessing you would feel the difference if conscious of it, but am also guessing many, especially those who don't handle the ball on a regular basis, would not notice.

I doubt this has ever been considered a "point of emphasis" for refs, and doubt they or the league really cares unless someone complains. I think it was probably a free for all until they put out the K ball, but still doubt they really focused much on offensive game balls. I also doubt QBs taking some air out, or putting more in really feel they are cheating. My guess is Brady and other QBs have been able to do this since HS, college with no problem.. And then again in the NFL, since no one really cared to enforce the rule.

Again, if the league had been serious about enforcing this, they would (as has been suggested in these threads) just supply one group of game balls to be used by both teams, rather than allowing teams to supply them.

[Runscott]

Originally Posted by itjclarke

Haha, I slept eventually, but posted after a little bit of a bender.. Was actually in Seattle with the buddy that works for the Hawks, though I forgot to ask him about fate of last Sunday's NFC Champ game balls!!

Well, your thoughts on this make complete sense. In fact, you are totally correct!!!! (Now find me a game ball from last week's game )


Last night was incredibly weird. I NEVER give up during insomnia attacks - worst case, I meditate until I bore myself to death with inconsequential thoughts. But last night my dog decided to start chewing a bone in the bedroom, at 1:30 a.m. Then she crawled up in the bed and started coughing. I finally took her out and she took off around the corner of the house, in the rain. Had to get dressed and chase her down (15-yr old hound dog, half-blind, half-deaf, can barely walk). Back in the house, wet, she crawled back in the bed and started coughing again. Needless to say, going back to sleep was impossible.