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#1
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The Skydash Collection ... the aftermath
Posted By: Rob Dewolf
Because I know so little about the issue, I didn't have much of a clue what Skydash's Tin Tops would sell for in the Mastro Auction. I'm curious what the consensus is as far as prices realized: lower than what you thought? higher? biggest surprise? |
#2
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The Skydash Collection ... the aftermath
Posted By: Dan Bretta
I guess I would have thought the Thorpe would have gone higher...the rest I don't know about. |
#3
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The Skydash Collection ... the aftermath
Posted By: Tom Boblitt
for all the lots was about $130-$140K. I'd say that was a little low but mostly for the Thorpe result. I thought it'd go much higher. I think the Jackson will go in the $60K range. BUT....you gotta have at least two bidders to get it moving.........He has tons of T and E stuff too that'll be in the next auction I guess.......... |
#4
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The Skydash Collection ... the aftermath
Posted By: steve
I am stunned. The Skydash Tin Tops went for super low - absolutely amazed at the low, low winning bid amounts. The estimates were way higher for these rare high grade beauties. |
#5
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The Skydash Collection ... the aftermath
Posted By: Dave S
Totally in agreement that they sold much lower than expected...the 62 card lot Dan mentioned amazingly low! |
#6
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The Skydash Collection ... the aftermath
Posted By: Al Simeone
Im in agreement with you also. Yes the Thorpe card did fairly well. (could have been better) But if they were my lots I would have been very disappointed. Considering the rarity of the issue and the condition that these were in I as a consigner wouldnt have been happy. And a nice 20% juice. Might have been better if Skydash listed them himself on ebay with reserve! That 20% juice goes a long way for listing fees!! |
#7
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The Skydash Collection ... the aftermath
Posted By: Matt
The T205 lots I was following from the Skydash find did very well. |
#8
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The Skydash Collection ... the aftermath
Posted By: Rob Dewolf
Al, |
#9
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The Skydash Collection ... the aftermath
Posted By: Matt
Rob - is the "consignor's fee" something different then the 20% juice the auction house takes on top of the hammer price? |
#10
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The Skydash Collection ... the aftermath
Posted By: Rob Dewolf
Matt, |
#11
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The Skydash Collection ... the aftermath
Posted By: Matt
Rob - WOW - so in most cases you are saying that Mastro will charge the cosigner 20% of the hammer price, plus take in another 20% of juice from the buyer? Effectively, that means the buyer is out 40% of the market value of the item. |
#12
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The Skydash Collection ... the aftermath
Posted By: Al Simeone
Hi Rob, |
#13
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The Skydash Collection ... the aftermath
Posted By: Rob Dewolf
Matt, |
#14
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The Skydash Collection ... the aftermath
Posted By: Ed Hans
I think we may safely assume that Skydash didn't pay any consignment fee. For a collection of this stature, auction houses are in fierce competition with each other and may offer to waive the fee. The auctioneers revenue would come exclusively from the buyer's premium. In fact, I wouldn't be shocked if part of the hammer fee were credited back to the consignor; ie a negative 2% consignment fee. |
#15
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The Skydash Collection ... the aftermath
Posted By: Mark Steinberg
Mastro has always charged me 15% to consign. I believe this is still their standard rate. I am SURE that if Skydash negotiated at all, he was able to list these for less than the standard 15% commission (considering the breadth of items being offered). |
#16
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The Skydash Collection ... the aftermath
Posted By: Al Simeone
Hi Ed, |
#17
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The Skydash Collection ... the aftermath
Posted By: MVSNYC
you guys are off your rocker if you think Skydash had to pay any type of consignors fee...Auction Houses are dying to get their hands on top shelf material, and if he had any type of negotiation skills (or advice from fellow collectors), i am sure he not only paid 0% consignors fee, but i bet he got a cash advance... |
#18
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The Skydash Collection ... the aftermath
Posted By: PC
I'm not surprised at the prices. Most people who can afford these rarities are probably very, very concerned about the economy next year (primarily because they know more then we do about the issues on the horizon), and are not going to pay a premium for any collectible that has a significant risk of declining in value. |
#19
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The Skydash Collection ... the aftermath
Posted By: Al Simeone
Hi Mike, |
#20
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The Skydash Collection ... the aftermath
Posted By: Matt
Rob - we're on the same page - what I meant about the seller being out 40% is that if the seller would have sold that item without the auction house they would have kept the whole amount that the buyer paid; by going through the auction house, they're out approx 40% of that income. I just always assumed that the $$ the auction house took was from the buyer in the form of the 20%; I didn't realize they charge the consignor money as well! |
#21
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The Skydash Collection ... the aftermath
Posted By: Rhys
I was not really surprised by the prices, irrespective of the economy. I thought people were crazy for thinking the Thorpe was a 100K item to begin with and the final price was probably right where it should have been (35K-50K). The Jackson will go higher than the Thorpe, but 60K sounds about right. Once you get into rarities like this, condition does not matter as much as simply finding one. |
#22
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The Skydash Collection ... the aftermath
Posted By: leon
Read what Rhys just said.....go with it....(I have no inside information either)...regards |
#23
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The Skydash Collection ... the aftermath
Posted By: Al Simeone
Hi Matt, |
#24
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The Skydash Collection ... the aftermath
Posted By: MVSNYC
thanks Al... |
#25
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The Skydash Collection ... the aftermath
Posted By: Al Simeone
Leon, |
#26
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The Skydash Collection ... the aftermath
Posted By: Matt
Al - I've bid and won in the past - I just assumed the 20% went to the auction house and the consignor got the rest; |
#27
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The Skydash Collection ... the aftermath
Posted By: Al Simeone
Matt, |
#28
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The Skydash Collection ... the aftermath
Posted By: Tom Nieves
Matt, |
#29
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The Skydash Collection ... the aftermath
Posted By: Matt
Tom - would it involve you fronting $8k to a total stranger? |
#30
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The Skydash Collection ... the aftermath
Posted By: JK
Tom - very funny. |
#31
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The Skydash Collection ... the aftermath
Posted By: JimCrandell
Consignment fee??? You gotta be kidding me. The only question is did Mastro pay him for the privledge of selling his lots. |
#32
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The Skydash Collection ... the aftermath
Posted By: MVSNYC
Jim- agreed...we see eye-to-eye on this... |
#33
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The Skydash Collection ... the aftermath
Posted By: Bottom of the Ninth
My understanding is Robert Edwards is the only house who is not really negotiable on consignment fee. |
#34
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The Skydash Collection ... the aftermath
Posted By: Fred C
Looks like this thread is turning into one of those discussions about auction houses and the "juice". |
#35
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The Skydash Collection ... the aftermath
Posted By: Jason L
that Skydash-whoever didn't force them to put it all in the April auction, given the better spending patterns you often see after bonus and tax-return time. |
#36
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The Skydash Collection ... the aftermath
Posted By: JimB
I know the numbers did not hit the excited speculation of some, but I thought they were strong. Mastro certainly did all that was possible to hype them. If they did not get it in that auction, they would not have gotten it anywhere else either. Anywone who would have been interested knew about it. I disagree that he would have done better on ebay. No way! I also agree that the Jackson is much more desirable that the Thorpe and will probably bring more $. |
#37
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The Skydash Collection ... the aftermath
Posted By: Wesley
I am surprised the Cobb, Wagner and other cards sold for as much as they did. Jackson and Thorpe might have images unique to the Tin Top set, but it is near impossible to distinguish the other players from the regular Colgan Chips. |
#38
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The Skydash Collection ... the aftermath
Posted By: Rhett Yeakley
I am in total agreement with Rhys (kinda starnge for two brothers to agree on anything). But before the auction him and I talked about it and our estimate on the Thorpe was in the $35-45,000 range, with the possibility of reaching into the $50,000's. The other cards also ended for about what I had anticipated, some being slightly low, and some slightly high (or at least I thought), but the condition of the cards was truly rare for the issue. |
#39
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The Skydash Collection ... the aftermath
Posted By: David Smith
Because of their rarity (and condition) if I had the money, I would much rather spend a combined $200,000 or so on the Jackson, Thorpe and the rest of the Tin Tops than the same amount on a poor condition T206 Wagner. I mean, if you have THAT type of money to spend on cards, I think it would be better to spend it on high grade rarities than the more "common" T206 Wagner. |
#40
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The Skydash Collection ... the aftermath
Posted By: JimB
I would take a T206 Wagner in poor condition over some little round "cards" any day. I am sort of joking about the "cards" thing, but seriously, I don't think these are even in the same league as the Wagner. There are a handful of cards I might rather have than a Wagner, but these ain't among them. Not even close. But differences of opinion make the world go round. They also keep the vintage card market diverse. Occassionally there are differences of opinion here. |
#41
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The Skydash Collection ... the aftermath
Posted By: T206Collector
I get that there are some people that are not overly impressed by T206, with or without Wagner. But if you are weighing two choices: a bunch of black and white pogs that no one outside of a very small niche of very rich Americans has heard of -- and a T206 Wagner in whatever condition makes those two choices ecomonically the same at the time of the transaction, you take the Wagner each and every time. |
#42
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The Skydash Collection ... the aftermath
Posted By: Paul
Do any of you know what an SGC 88 / PSA 8 ordinary Colgan's Chips of Wagner would usually sell for? I'm thinking not a whole lot less than the Colgan's Tip Top from the Skydash Collection. But I don't really know, which is why I'm asking. |
#43
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The Skydash Collection ... the aftermath
Posted By: Richard
Paul - |
#44
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The Skydash Collection ... the aftermath
Posted By: Wesley
I hope I am not violating the VCP TOS by posting this, but a PSA 8 Colgan Chip Wagner sold for $2442 and a SGC 88 Colgan Chip Wagner sold recently on ebay for $2550. By contrast, the SGC 88 TIn Top Wagner sold last night for $8907. |
#45
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The Skydash Collection ... the aftermath
Posted By: steve
Assume current price levels equal. The choice of the T206 Wagner in beater condition vs. 1 of 1 rarity Cobb/Wagner/Ruth in top condition. I'll leave the T206 Wagner on the table. |
#46
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The Skydash Collection ... the aftermath
Posted By: T206Collector
...where you are coming from in the normal context of a beater card worth $1,000 and another nice card worth $1,000. But a Wagner beater isn't a beater -- it's a Wagner. Condition doesn't enter into it. |
#47
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The Skydash Collection ... the aftermath
Posted By: steve
From Memory Lane, a T206 Wagner PSA 2 closes shortly and is at $250.k |
#48
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The Skydash Collection ... the aftermath
Posted By: Rhys
T206 cards are the most overrated cards in the hobby. With literally millions of them out there I honestly cant see what the attraction is. Colgans are different and much rarer and as for the black and white thing, it does not seem to hurt Breisch Williams cards. I guess I am different but I would take the Colgans any day. In fact, I think I would take just about anything ahead of T206 cards but I feel as though Colgans are vastly underrated. With a large player selection, rarities being discovered every day, Real Horner Photos, and overall much tougher to find than T206 cards, Colgans have everything going for them except corners. If these cards were square instead of round they would be worth 3X as much as they are. But that is fine, keep them cheap and affordable. To each his own and I guess collecting T206 cards is cool and everything, but to me it is like waking up every morning and eating the same Wheaties breakfast for 30 years; Predictable and ordinary, but if that floats your boat than thats cool. Give me those nasty pogs anyday! |
#49
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The Skydash Collection ... the aftermath
Posted By: Tom Boblitt
I collected Colgan's for 20 years. Really only collected the Tin Tops towards the end and NEVER saw any on ebay for sale--maybe once or twice in REALLY low condition. By comparison, I saw (and won) quite a few red bordered E270's. The Tin Tops are VERY VERY scarce overall in relation to the normal Stars of the Diamond. I think the 5 to 1 ratio on Cobbs and Wagners is right on par......a 'common' ungraded Tin Top would typically sell for $125-$200 now which is 4-5X a common Stars of the Diamond. When I sold my Colgan's I had 25 or so Red Borders and 7-8 Tin Tops with about 230-240 of the Stars of the Diamond. |
#50
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The Skydash Collection ... the aftermath
Posted By: nbrazil
"With literally millions of them out there I honestly cant see what the attraction is." |
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