Cornering the market on one card?

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Posted By: Eric

Has anyone ever tried buying up all they can of one single card?

With some of these vintage cards having well under 100 graded examples... if someone were to collect a large quantity of them, would it increase the value dramatically since it would be harder for other collectors to acquire?

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Posted By: Shawn Chambers

I'm having flashbacks to "Silver Spoons" where Ricky (Shroder)and his distinguished grandfather (John Houseman) tried to corner the market on Tommy Lasorda rookie cards (which all seemed to have 1983 topps backs if I remember correctly...LOL). We all know how THAT turned out! Boy Erin Gray sure was hot when I was twelve...

Shawn

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Posted By: Zinn

Recall a fellow named Miller is cornering the market on all of his grandfather's 1911 Obaks and Zeenuts.

I heard that Reggie Jackson also was enamoured by his rookie card and had a grunch.

Certainly has an affect on market price especially with the Miller cards. The grandson will go whatever ends and price to pick up the cards.

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Posted By: David Smith

At one time, a relative of Tommy Thevenow was doing that with his cards, especially the 1933 Goudey's.

The downside to doing this is if you have a bunch of cards and they are somehow destroyed. Then, a somewhat rare card might become impossible to find.

David

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Posted By: scott brockelman

At one time there was a collector/dealer from the Houston area who shall remain nameless unless someone guesses his name, that was convinced he could corner the T206 market. He would buy them by the 100's or thousands, singles or whatever he could get. Needless to say it did not work.

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Posted By: Pat

I remember a fellow with a ton of money was stopped on the NJ Turnpike by the State Police with a car full of Drakes Cakes sets. I don't think they were 1950's though.

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Posted By: MVSNYC

Dan Koteles-

post your Red Cobbs!

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Posted By: john/z28jd

I remember reading that Rocky Colavito's family bought up a bunch of his rookie cards hoping to corner the market. I got one a couple years ago just to make sure they can never do that!

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Posted By: Matt

There's a board member who tried to corner the market on a certain T205 card; perhaps he will way in...

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Posted By: D. C. Markel

I too have heard that Reggie Jackson tried to corner the market on his '69 Topps rookie card. In fact a dealer friend of mine made a "find" of several '69 vending boxes from that same series in the late '80s and sold all 23 rookie cards he pulled from that find and made the deal with Reggie in person.

I also know a person who tried to corner the market on vintage PSA 10 cards (basically cards from the early '50s to the mid-70's). Needless to say, that venture failed.

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Posted By: Jerry

Scott, I have lived in Houston all my life and can't think of a collector/dealer that was hoarding t206's. What decade was this in? Larry Diluhy & Tom Kennedy were biggest collector/dealers in the 70's & 80's in Houston.

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Posted By: scott brockelman

This was 1990's early 2000's, he was not a full time dealer, but used to have a card company and website.

Scott

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Posted By: SC

You'd just have to be very selective on what you chose. The item would need to have:

1) Inherent demand - if the goal is to move the market, you're going to need people who want the card as well. Otherwise, no one is going to care if they can't get a particular card, if there's no real desire for it.

2) A reasonable quantity. If the item is too rare, it already suffers from a lack of demand because collectors can't want more what they already can't have. Equally, good luck trying to get a card that can still be found in bricks!

3) A price/quantity total that is within reason. Of course, they will tend to average, as many more expensive cards are that due to scarcity, or visa versa.

In looking at it, I would target a card as follows:

A 1950s Topps card - pre-57 there's still some scarcity (in relative terms) to Topps cards compared to anything later, and prewar cards as a whole just don't have the market appeal of the baby boomer generation players.

A major HOF rookie, but not Mantle as he's just too expensive

My thought would be to go after the rookie cards of Aaron, Banks, Kaline, Clemente, or Koufax. I would probably choose Aaron or Koufax because they have the widest market appeal.

How many Koufax RCs are on the market? eBay shows 10 active (1955 topps koufax search) and 40 in stores. Are there more than 1000 Koufax's in the available market? Maybe if you want to narrow it further, only go after Koufax RCs in 7 or better.

IT's a couple hundred thousand dollar project, but it would be interesting.

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Posted By: Rawn Hill

I'm trying to get all of the low grade T206 Carringan's from the market, so if you should care to help with my endever, please do so.

Rawn

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Posted By: Bob

The problem with all this is that disgruntled collectors who need a particular card to complete a set or subset are going to eventually start running up the bids against the buyer. The Miller card has been mentioned and I have seen several Obak and Zeenut Millers go much, much higher than they should because frustrated collectors have decided to make his grandson (I believe) pay through the teeth for them.

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Posted By: Bob

Scott- I remember who you are talking about. I think his website was T206.com and he was buying up all the 206s he could lay his hands on. He was undone by ebay, IMHO.

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Posted By: Andrew

I had nine 1964 Topps Stand-up Yastrzemski's...a long way from a monopoly.

"Take your life in your own hands and what happens? A terrible thing: no one to blame." -- Erica Jong

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Posted By: Scott M.

When I was collecting as a kid in 1974 I thought I had the market cornered on Bill Russell of the Dodgers as he showed up in EVERY damn pack I bought that year.

When I went to trade with my neighborhood friends, sadly, I found they each had at least 5-10 Bill Russells as well

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Posted By: Andy Cook

In the early 80s I corned the market on Mariano Rivera slurpe discs.

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Posted By: Scott Levy

Matt,

Are your referring to T205 Matty cycles LOL. The problem with someone like me trying to corner the market on something like that is that as a collector there are always things that I'd rather have than the 10th Matty cycle card -- Just ask Brian W.

I also remember back in the 1980s a certain someone buying up all the doyle hands above head cards with the hope of finding a few more NY NAT'L ones. Look like that worked out pretty well.

Regards,
SGL

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Posted By: Trae R.

It would be awesome to see all of Dan's Red Cobbs!




---
"There ain't much to being a ballplayer, if you're a ballplayer."
-Honus Wagner

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Posted By: Darren

In the late 80's as a high schooler I tried to corner the market on 1988 fleer Greg Jeffries because those damn 1988 donruss's were just too plentiful.

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Posted By: peter ullman

I started to hord t206 g. browne...chic versions...I got to 4 or 5 of them before I lost interest in addition to realizing they were very common.

pete in mn

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Posted By: Jason L

how many red Cobbs does Dan K have?!

Dan, please illustrate!


I only have 17 of that color.

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Posted By: Dan

I guess a good case study would be to buy up the modern serial number cards. I know I have (2) of a Greg Maddux card that was serial numbered to 25. It would be interesting to see if you had them all, what it would do to the market.

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Posted By: Zinn

I had 17 T206 Downey Batting at one time. Can't recall why.

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Posted By: MVSNYC

i'll let Dan chime in, but from what he has said, he was going for 50, i think he had 40-something, then sold a few, i believe he has around 30 now...

Dan?

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Posted By: Brian

Let me start off by saying that my intention was never to drive the prices up of the particular cards that I collect, but ultimately by buying as many cards of my great-grandfather as I can find, it does create a reduced supply. Bob pretty much nailed it. You can get away with it for just so long before others that want the card realize they are going to have to bid higher to have a shot at aquiring one.

My first T212 was $25, the last two were over $200:



My first Zeenut cost $38; the last Zeenut I bought ended up closing over $500 on eBay I think:



So, to answer the original question, collecting a large quantity of a single card does have an effect on the market. I have no intentions of ever selling any of my cards (although I would consider a trade for a 1912 Zeenut), so increased prices only hurt me. I think the supply is starting to dry up; it has been almost 8 months since my last purchase.

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Posted By: Zinn

I'm suspecting that these pictures are making a few people sick to their stomachs.

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Posted By: peter ullman

especially the first one...dizzying!!!

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Posted By: Brian

And I could probably name most of them. Unfortunately, you don't make many friends with this type of collecting (except with the sellers I guess). Most people at least understand why I do what I do, but I have had exchanges with some collectors that I feel were not called for.

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Posted By: leon

Nice cards.....If someone wants to buy them when they come on the open market all they have to do is pay more than you....I don't see that much harm in it.. It's no different than when I/we compete for any other card, imo.....

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Posted By: peter ullman

brian...i have no issue with your collection either...collect what you like/want! It certainly must be easy to keep your focus!

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Posted By: T206Collector

I had the inclination to corner the market for signed T206 cards. In fact, most of the signed cards that came onto ebay from the Pittsburgh find were shown/offered to me before they hit ebay. Economically, it stopped making sense for me to buy the doubles, so I let them go onto ebay.

And that has been a double-edged sword. It brings down the prices of the signed cards somewhat so new acquisitions are not so expensive. But it also means resale is not particularly high. Moreover, I have found that when I do not bid on a signed pre-war card, it goes for well under what I would have paid for it if I didn't have a double of it already in my collection.

But finally, it is actually good for the market to have some people with access to these cards in their collection. That actually generates interest in the cards and makes them more valuable over the long term.

_ _ _ _ _ _ _ _

Visit http://www.t206collector.com for my blog, interviews, articles, card galleries and more!

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Posted By: Cobby33

I tried that with the T206 New Orleans players (not truly a "corner," but wanted a good majority). Seemed somewhat conceivable judging by the population reports, but there are SO many raw examples out there, it became impossible.

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Posted By: Anthony S.

It's just a matter of time before the 17,300 1979 Topps Johnnie LeMaster cards I've hoarded are reflected in the marketplace. I can feel it.

edited to add: I just checked my Obak set checklist and realized I don't have Miller yet. Sigh.

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Posted By: Anonymous

those pictures are just amazing!

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Posted By: Jeff Lichtman

Brian -- I think it's cool what you're doing. You're not doing anything wrong as these cards were available on the open market and you just paid more than anyone else.

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Posted By: Zinn

I don't think anyone is suggesting that what Brian does is wrong.

But Jeff, think about it, how would you feel if I started to hoard all of the Zinn cards.

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Posted By: barrysloate

As noted, all Brian does is try to be the high bidder on each individual auction. I bet there are a few that he lost too (maybe not).

There are two known 1932 U.S. Caramel Lindy Lindstroms and the Fritsch family has them both. They've cornered the market on that one.

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Posted By: Richard Masson

Who has the only Maple Crispette Stengel?

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Posted By: boxingcardman

The family connection makes it all the more fun. I have six copies of my cousin's exhibit card and two copies of the Ring magazine he was on the cover of, and I try to win them whenever I see them.

http://imageevent.com/exhibitman/interestingexhibitcards

Sic Gorgiamus Allos Subjectatos Nunc

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Posted By: Brian

Thanks for the comments, the majority of the collectors here are great.

7 of my 28 T212s are graded (I submitted one of them) to give you some idea of what is out there raw vs graded.

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Posted By: Andy Cook

I think you could make the argument about not only hoarding individual cards (e.g., T212 Miller), but anyone who's hoarding cards of a tough set that they're "corning the market". There are a number of sets where the majority of all the cards are in the hands of a relatively small number of collectors and unless one of them decides to liquidate -- it's unlikely anyone else could have a legitimate shot at collecting that set. For example, I know of four large collections of T213-2 (including mine) and unless one of us decides to break it up (I'm not) -- no one else is likely to get close to this set. There are a number of examples of set collections like this. On a personal note, I hope to get a T212-2 Miller so that I can complete my set (need about 30), but if the worst thing in my life is that I have a little tougher time finding a baseball card, I'm not going to sweat it.

Andy

PS - I liked my Great Grandfather very much and if he had been on a card, I would hoard it too. He was a huge baseball fan and had seen everyone play - Cobb, Young, Wagner, Matty, you name it.

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Posted By: cmoking

"At one time, a relative of Tommy Thevenow was doing that with his cards, especially the 1933 Goudey's."

I believe that is still the case, but he isn't bidding as strong as he used to.

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Posted By: James Gallo

Brian

What is your reasoning behind just getting so many of one card?
I understand he is your grandfather and all but what is the point or purpose? I see nothing wrong with it, just want to understand the motive behind it.


There is a limit and everyone has it. I was trying to get all of a Ryan Howard rookie that is limited to only 900. I think I got to about 15 when I just lost interest, there are too many other things I would like to have and are more interesting then multiples of the same card. There are a select few cards that I do try to buy whenever they come up mostly because I feel they are under valued.

I don't think this would work. Recently there was a collector that want 15-20 e-90 Jackson cards. At one point I think he had 15 and started selling. Well when he was buying he pushed the market and now that so many have gotten out so quickly the market has dropped off a great deal. The one I sold him sold recently for a couple thousand then he paid. I know he took a hit and I just don't get the need or desire to horde a card especially one that expensive and especially when you go out of your way to aquire them.

James G

Looking for 1915 Cracker Jacks and 1909-11 American Caramel E90-1.

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Posted By: Andrew

Only four shown, but I had six at one point. Yes, I was probably the only one who cared.



"Take your life in your own hands and what happens? A terrible thing: no one to blame." -- Erica Jong

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Posted By: Ken McMillan

At one time I had 23 Elmer Miller cards, does that count?

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Posted By: Brian

I got my Miller.

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Posted By: Rich Klein

Who for some reason decided to corner the market on 2001 Bowman Chrome Ron Davenport Cards. I think they are limited to 500 IIRC and all signed -- but because of this collector -- this card of this player who has going into this year all of 12 spring training at-bats is cataloguing at several times the value it should be it at compared to the other commons in this set.

And does Teddy Z know the Philadelphis Urban Legend about Fred Wenz who allegdly upset some collector so much that they snap up just about every 1971 Topps card of his they find and get them out of circulation.

I used to buy so many Joe Cunningham cards in the 70's-80's because he was the only player from my home town that I believe CCP used to list him at a slight premium because I had wiped out so many dealer stocks of his cards. Now, of course, no one really cares

Regards
Rich