Sunday Estate Auction Finds

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Posted By: Dan Bretta

Picked up this Tris Speaker bat today at an auction...I only went to the auction because they listed a Winchester bat on the sale bill. The Winchester was nice, but it was a "Boys Special" model and measured up pretty short. When the bidding came around to the bats they pulled out the Winchester model and I let it go cheap ($65) to a guy I know doesn't give up if he wants something...so they had three more bats and they put all in one lot and sold them for choice...I snagged the Speaker for $50 and let the other two bats go...they were H&B Oil Tempered model and an MR Campbell model. I also snagged a KiKi Cuyler glove for $40 so overall a great day...I may go back as I noticed a Spalding Field Hockey stick in nice shape...it was very old.

The Speaker bat is 33 1/2" and I would guess the weight to be 40+ ounces.









I can't find a manufacturer on the Kuyler glove, but his name is plain as day to read on it.

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Posted By: MVSNYC

nice pieces! are you assuming the bat is a store model, or do you think there is a chance it is a professional model (game used)?

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Posted By: Turner Engle

Nice snag, Dan. Great pieces.

My best,

Turner Engle

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Posted By: Mike H

Dan...you magnificant bastard! That bat is fantastic. It dates from 1921-31. Speaker played til 1928. He used bats ranging from 34-36" and 40 oz. I would contact Bushing to check H&B records. Perhaps Speaker ordered a shorter bat toward the end of his career. Could be a gamer.

The Cuyler is nice also. Is the stamping bold? How are the lining and patch?

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Posted By: barrysloate

How on earth do you find a game used Speaker at an estate sale? That's amazing!

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Posted By: Dan Bretta

Thanks guys...I doubt it's a gamer because it measures just short of Speaker's specs...who knows though?

The Cuyler glove looks great on the palm side and the name is still bold, but I can't find a manufacturer...the other side is not so good anyway..looks like something layed on it for years and discolored it in a straight line across the glove.

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Posted By: Dan Bretta

I just re-measured the Speaker bat and it comes up almost exactly 34"....it is probably 1/10" shy of 34. I originally measured with a yardstick I found at the estate sale and it looked 33 1/2 to me, but it's definitely longer than that.

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Posted By: brock

Is 34 stamped on the knob, it looks like a 3 to the left of that carved line.

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Posted By: Dan Bretta

Nope...no stampings on the knob at all.

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Posted By: Clint

Dan, stunning find, way to go! It just shows there's more discoveries to be made.

Clint

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Posted By: Greg

Hi Dan,

Don't sell yourself short on this bat (no pun intended). MEARS has a Speaker lathe bat that measures between 33 1/2 and 34 inches, and have certified two short Speaker bats (one of them is mine, which like yours is just under 34 inches) as game bats.
There was a good deal of controversy over the other one a couple of years ago, because someone paid a ridiculous amount of money for it in an auction (well over 20K), and then wanted someone, either the auction house or MEARS, to refund their money. I'm a little fuzzy on the exact details.
I can tell you this -- while a bat this size isn't typically what Speaker used, it does appear that at least at one point he did order this shorter bat.
Again, Dave Bushing could tell you much more -- there's no doubt that you made an incredible find today!

Greg

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Posted By: Dan Bretta

I emailed Dave. Thanks for the help guys.

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Posted By: Mike H

There is one thing about the bat that bothers me. I have not seen a bat owned by a player that didn't have near perfect, bold, complete stamping. I am faaaaaar from being an authority, but I would assume that if one of the greatest players of the day ordered a bat, the guy stamping them would make sure it was darn near perfect for Mr. Speaker.

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Posted By: Anonymous

What is that mark that my arrow is pointing to.

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Posted By: Dan Bretta

I'm not sure what you're seeing Brock...nothing is stamped on the knob.

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Posted By: Brock G.

I see a faint image of a 3 but it does not look stamped. You dont see that Dan?

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Posted By: Dan Bretta

Are you talking about the dark "ring" on the knob? If so it's kind of strange that it shows up in a flash photo, but is not easy to see with the naked eye.

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Posted By: David Atkatz

It's karma, Dan.

Couldn't happen to a more deserving guy.

(I haven't forgotten that photo you sent me.)

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Posted By: Mike H

I'll bet it gets an 8 from MEARS.

Dan is my hero. There...I said it.

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Posted By: brock

I would say an A7 or A7.5

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Posted By: Brock G.

Can someone please explain to me how you can tell its a pro model bat rather than a store model? I know very little about game-used items and would like to take this opportunity to request a brief tutorial on the subject. What are the odds that Dan's bat comes back as game used? Is it like a no doubt about it kind of deal? or 50/50? I'd like to know in case I ever happen upon a bat like this. I can dream right?

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Posted By: brock

Brock,
Store model bats back then had 34,35,36 stamped on the knob. That was reference to how long the bat was. But game used bats intill early 1940's would have nothing stamped on the knob inless it was vault marked(Sent back to the factory). So for a bat to be called a pro model/game used it has to match the players records for length and weight which Dan's bat is close to. Speaker ordered bats around 35-36 inches and around 40oz. But like people have said he may have ordered 34 inches later in his career, and also we dont know if the records are 100% complete from back then. I hope this helps.

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Posted By: Mark

Dan:

Congrats on a wonderful find, and best of luck with your Mears submission!

Sure looks authentic to me... the little "3" that Brock notes might just be random ink from long ago. It appears to be strictly on the surface and not stamped/imbedded into the wood (as store-model bats would have been).

A question regarding Mears.... you contacted Dave Bushing, and are submitting the Bat to Mears. I had heard that Dave had retired from doing any authenticating for Mears. I know he is still actively buying/selling, but was curious as to who is now Mears' lead authenticator for Bats, Uniforms, Caps, etc.

Does anyone know? Is Troy Kinunen now doing it on his own? Any pertinent info would be much appreciated... thanks!

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Posted By: Dan Bretta

It appears I have a pro model bat here. Not sure what my next move is, but I think I'll be sending it in to MEARS. Thanks to those who have helped out here.

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Posted By: Dan Bretta

I weighed the bat and it came out at 41 oz.

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Posted By: Max Weder

Dan

Not sure if this helps, but I adjusted the photo in PS. Looks like an 8 or 6 to me, but could also be a 3.

Max

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Posted By: Brock

Well after looking at the center brand it looks like the bat is from 1928-1933. He retired in 1928. So im guessing its from his last year or a post career bat. But either way its worth more than the $65 you paid for it. In 1928 he ordered bats that weighed (38,37,38-39).

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Posted By: Brock G.

Here is a Speaker gamer sold by REA-
http://www.robertedwardauctions.com/auction/2006/1088.html

34", 41.8 ounces, center-band looks the same.

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Posted By: Dan Bretta

Brock, where did you get the info that the centerbrand dates it to 1928-33? My info has it as 1916-29.

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Posted By: Brock

Ok i just checked again and i was wrong by acouple of years. I believe its from 1923-25. It can't be from 1919-21 because it dont have the dash dot dash. My fault i was looking at the wrong photo in Vince malta's book.

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Posted By: Dan McCarthy

First, congrats Dan on finding that Speaker bat. If it's a gamer then it's an extraordinary find but it's a great piece either way.

My main question (and if this is better suited for another thread I can start one, I don't mean to intrude) is where do people find out about estate sales/auctions and how do you know if there will be baseball related things there? Are they the estates of former players or just regular people? As I am in the northeast I imagine there is a lot of pre-war baseball stuff lying around but I'm not sure where to find it. If it's big secret or you don't want more competition or something I understand, but my college-student budget won't allow me to come in and buy everything anyways.

Thanks,
Dan

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Posted By: Dan Bretta

Good questions Dan...I've been attending auctions for years as both of my parents were antique collectors when I was growing up, I just grew up with it...The only reason I went to the auction this weekend was because they advertised a Winchester baseball bat. That was the only baseball item I was expecting to see when I got there. I was pleasantly surprised to walk up into the garage and notice not one bat, but 4 bats and a splitfinger glove. The auctioneers are basically clueless when it comes to baseball items, but they sure know the name Winchester and that's the only reason they listed it. A lot of it is hit and miss as baseball memorabilia often doesn't even make it into the sale bill. The auctioneer from the sale this weekend knows me very well and usually will let me know when they have baseball stuff, but I never heard anything from him...I almost didn't go to this sale as I wasn't feeling well, but I figured I couldn't take a chance at letting the Winchester go for nothing.

edited to add: I guess I didn't answer all your questions...First off you can find estate sales by checking the classified ads in your newspaper. They should have a section just for auctions. Around here there are usually 2-3 sales per week until winter comes along...then they die down to just a few inside sales over the winter months. I have only been to one estate sale of a former major leaguer, Jack Bruner. I didn't even know about the sale until my brother called me from it and said I should come down because there were autographed baseballs...I went over there and I picked up 3 team signed baseballs of Western League clubs that Bruner had played on before he got called up...there was a trophy from his days with the Sioux City Soos and I had to make a deal with a guy to stay away from it and he would wouldn't bid me up on the baseballs...I kinda wish I had gone after the trophy anyway. The sale was not even listed as the sale of a former major leaguer, the auctioneers didn't even know. I asked the auctioneer if the people having the sale were present and he directed me to them...they invited me in the house and showed me all of Jack Bruner's baseball memorabilia...there were bunches of photos, his uniform, ephemera, et cetera. They were keeping all that stuff, but for some reason they didn't care about his minor league stuff.

Sometimes you just have to get lucky because like I said most auctioneers don't have a clue when it comes to baseball memorabilia so they don't even list it in the sale bill. Often you just have to show up and dig through the stuff and hope no one else notices it. A few years back I noticed an auction way up in the Northeast corner of Nebraska on the internet and they listed "old baseball equipment" so I emailed the auctioneer and he said it looked old and he didn't know much about it....so my brother and I headed up there one Sunday morning for the 3 hour drive and I walked in to the sale and there was a whole table filled with splitfinger gloves, birdcage masks, and a Spalding ring bat...I got the whole table full of stuff for $125.