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#1
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Posted By: warshawlaw
It seems to me that most everyone bidding isn't stupid enough to bid without considering the BP, so it doesn't increase bidding levels. It also seems to me that consignors aren't stupid enough to forget the BP. So why have a BP at all? Why not just take a straight % of the gross proceeds? |
#2
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Posted By: barrysloate
Adam- I've thought about the same thing, and ebay proves you can do business without a premium. I guess psychologically it helps an auction house to offer a low or neglible fee to the consignor, but in the end the same means can be accomplished without it. For me, I guess it is just the pack mentality. Others do it so I just follow suit. That said, I will leave the 15% buyer's premium in place. But I agree if you think a lot is worth $1000, you should just bid in the $800-900 range and stop there, and the same final price will be realized as if there were no fee and you went to $1000. |
#3
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Posted By: Josh Wulkan
Adam, |
#4
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Posted By: ramram
Not to put words in Adam's mouth but I think he is just saying why don't they just have, say, a 30% consigners fee...nothing else. Straight as an arrow, no questions, easy as pie, etc.(which is probably the problem, much like a gas station that still uses the tenths digit). |
#5
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Posted By: peter chao
Josh, |
#6
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Posted By: Jeff Lichtman
The rationale behind the BP is to enable the auctioneers to run a first class auction. That was an easy question. |
#7
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Posted By: Josh Wulkan
if we just had a straight 30% fee, as Rob suggests, how many of you consignors would give us your great items to sell if you were charged 30% on your selling item? Sure, the buyer makes out, but how about the consignor? |
#8
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Posted By: ramram
???Josh, you lost me???? |
#9
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Posted By: ramram
Josh (et al.)- |
#10
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Posted By: warshawlaw
While I appreciate your willingness to address the issue, there are aspects to your contentions that I find to be either unrealistic or disingenuous: |
#11
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Posted By: Trevor Hocking
Well I would first like to say that the timing of the Mastro 2.5% BP hike was out of line and I would have been a little frustrated myself if I had consigned before this auction and was not notified about it. But to get back on topic here. I think that auction companies like Mastro and Huggins and Scott are a needed entity is this hobby and have always been one. If it wasn't for these companies we would never have the opportunity to bid on items that we have been trying to find or never knew existed. I also have an idea what it takes to run a auction company and I think that is taken for granted A LOT. I have spoke with many auction companies in the past regarding there fees. When I was given the tour and the needed day to day expenses it all made seance to me. I know 20%-30% sounds like a lot but most of the time a good auction company will get you that back and more for using their services. Granted some items are better sold in other venues like Ebay or retail but frankly most of use do not have the time or want to put fourth the effort to sell items that way. I think that if an auction company would put out a quarterly report to show it's cost vs profit most people would be surprised at how much of that % the auction companies are left with for salaries and profit in the end. I would guess a lot lower than perceived. I for one like the idea of a variety of auction companies to choose from and the slight difference in BP's and SP's. I think that we can see from the responses given by the leaders of these companies on this board, how much they do think about this hobby and how interested they are in making it far for everyone. Remember most of these people are hobbiest just like you and are usually accessible via a phone call. I would try to talk with them over the phone about your issues before you start to speculate and make gossip here. |
#12
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Posted By: warshawlaw
I am merely frustrated at the complicated way that auction fees are charged. It would be so much simpler to charge a flat commission and let the items sell for what they fetch. As I noted, the money could be the same if the % is jiggered. Since the simple approach is not the one chosen by the auctioneers, there has to be a non-mathematical reason for their choice and, as I noted, I think I know what it is. |
#13
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Posted By: Judge Dred (Fred)
I kinda liked Rob's idea. For a 15% SP + 15% BP, just make it a 26% SP. It makes it easier on the bidding. There's no need to figure out percentages. The auction house and seller get the same amounts. |
#14
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Posted By: Brian H (misunderestimated)
I would have virtually no seller's premium and try to make all of my profits on the other (buyer's) end in order to attract quality consignments. If you can get the items the bidders will come and you can build market share and compete for the best consignments. I doubt a slightly higher buyer's premium is likely to deter anyone from bidding on something that they really want that's not easy to come by. Personally, I just build it into my bidding calculatons -- its not integral calculus, just multiplication and addition. |
#15
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Posted By: Jeff Lichtman
I think the reason there is not a flat fee is due to the fact that the auction houses don't want to scare its clients off with a huge number. Instead, they can nickel and dime everyone to death and make it appear as if they are spreading around the pain instead of doing all that they can to take more money out of your pocket and more into theirs. 15% here, 20% there, $75 for a catalogue, blah, blah, blah. |
#16
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Posted By: Jeff Drum
....and they will continue to do it until someone builds a better mousetrap! |
#17
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Posted By: John_B_California
anonymous post .... |
#18
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Posted By: ramram
I just wanted to thank Barry and Josh for chiming in. It's been nice that several of the auction houses have taken the time to give some input to the many questions from this forum of late. I, for one, don't like the sucker punches that some people have been throwing at the houses but, in general, I think it's a good exchange of philosophy between auction houses and some of their clients. I think a lot of what goes on is "smoke and mirrors" but, hey, you go with what works. So far it's obviously been working. |
#19
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Posted By: Jeff Lichtman
By "sucker punches" do you mean such classics as "Do you alter the cards that you sell in your auctions?" Damn, what an unfair question! |
#20
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Posted By: Billy Stair
What I just can't get is why the buyer pays a premium??? Now I understand a seller should be charged a commission to sell an item, but a buyer paying a fee to spend their money????? This is why I refuse to bid on these auction house items and I usually find the cards I need privately or in other venues and I would participate in auction house items IF the buyer did not have to pay to spend money!!! I wonder how many more have this feeling? |
#21
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Posted By: Jeff Drum
The real reason they do and will continue to do it is that "we" have not demonstrated the restraint to refuse to pay up by not bidding. We can rationalize that we "build it" into our bid and maybe we do to some extent. It's like American Express charging you to "use" their product when you can get the same for free elsewhere. It's like the automakers continuing to churn out gas guzzling vehicles when gas is $3-4 a gallon. We have little to no restraint. It's a seller's market until there are no buyers. |
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