NonSports Forum

Net54baseball.com
Welcome to Net54baseball.com. These forums are devoted to both Pre- and Post- war baseball cards and vintage memorabilia, as well as other sports. There is a separate section for Buying, Selling and Trading - the B/S/T area!! If you write anything concerning a person or company your full name needs to be in your post or obtainable from it. . Contact the moderator at leon@net54baseball.com should you have any questions or concerns. Enjoy!
Net54baseball.com
Net54baseball.com
T206s on Ebay
Pre-WWII Cards
Post WWII Cards
Vintage Memorabilia
Babe Ruth Cards
Ty Cobb Cards
Lou Gehrig Cards
Mickey Mantle Cards
Goudey Cards
Bowman Cards
T205s on Ebay
Tobacco "T" Cards
Caramel "E" Cards
Vintage Baseball Postcards
Football Cards on Ebay
Exhibit Cards
Strip Cards
Baking Cards
Sporting News
Playball Cards on Ebay

Go Back   Net54baseball.com Forums > Net54baseball Postwar Sportscard Forums > Modern Baseball Cards Forum (1980-Present)

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #101  
Old 02-25-2020, 01:53 PM
bswhiten's Avatar
bswhiten bswhiten is offline
Ben W.hitener
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: Charleston, SC
Posts: 372
Default

I was looking at The Trading Card Database and noticed they don't call the Blackless cards variations either. They list them as a "Parallel" set

https://www.tradingcarddb.com/Insert.../89/1982-Topps
Reply With Quote
  #102  
Old 02-25-2020, 03:18 PM
Tripredacus's Avatar
Tripredacus Tripredacus is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2015
Location: Buffalo
Posts: 273
Default

Yes, they get to decide whether a variation is an actual variation (which means they show up on the regular checklist) or is a parallel. I'm not sure I would consider it to be a parallel set, since not all cards are on the checklist.
Reply With Quote
  #103  
Old 02-25-2020, 07:46 PM
ALR-bishop ALR-bishop is offline
Al Richter
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: San Antonio
Posts: 6,699
Default

The 68 Topps Milton Bradley set is viewed by some as a parallel set and by others as variations to the 68 set. It also is only a partial set. Interestingly two of the MB cards, Cox and Brinkman, have long been viewed as variations to the 68 set ( incorrectly in my view)

There are many views on what is or should be a "variation" but there is no real standard hobby definition or official arbiter of what should be on a set check list. The process has been mostly ad hoc
Reply With Quote
  #104  
Old 02-26-2020, 04:58 AM
swarmee's Avatar
swarmee swarmee is offline
J0hn Raff3rty
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Niceville FL
Posts: 5,183
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ALR-bishop View Post
The 68 Topps Milton Bradley set is viewed by some as a parallel set and by others as variations to the 68 set. It also is only a partial set. Interestingly two of the MB cards, Cox and Brinkman, have long been viewed as variations to the 68 set ( incorrectly in my view)
If the MB cards never came in 1968 Topps packs, I'm not sure how anyone can think they are a variation. Only makes sense to me to call them an independent reprint set, along with the football and car cards that came in the board game. A complete set would be all the cards from the board game; just the baseball would be a subset.
__________________
--
PWCC: The Fish Stinks From the Head
PSA: Regularly Get Cheated
BGS: Can't detect trimming on modern
SGC: Closed auto authentication business
JSA: Approved same T206 Autos before SGC
Oh, what a difference a year makes.
Reply With Quote
  #105  
Old 02-27-2020, 11:06 AM
toppcat's Avatar
toppcat toppcat is offline
Dave.Horn.ish
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 2,365
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by bswhiten View Post
Interesting info back from Fred on Blackless cards. If anyone has any of these early 80's ads, articles, price guides that reference "No Black Ink" or "Blackless" I would love to see them.


"Hi Ben,

As best I can recall, the term "No Black Ink" Errors was used by variation-and-error columnist Ralph Nozaki (spelling?) in BASEBALL HOBBY NEWS during the 1980's BEFORE (and after?) I coined what I considered to be a much better term "BLACKLESS" Variations. Nozaki did not consider the 1982 Topps Blackless to be real variations but instead deemed these cards as merely "printing errors" (as did other writers in various baseball card hobby publications back in the 1980's). I find it interesting that time as proven my belief that the 82T Blackless are very much notable and significantly valuable variations and NOT the virtually worthless "printing errors" that Nozaki and other hobby writers back then denounced these great cards as being.

Ads by "JMB Trading Cards" (during 1982 and/or 1983?) represented the first published use of my coined term "Blackless" for the 1982 Topps variations. Again as best I can recall, those ads offering a number of the 82T Blackless in BASEBALL HOBBY NEWS and SPORTS COLLECTORS DIGEST (and BASEBALL CARD NEWS?). Unfortunately I do not have handy the identity of the specific issues in which the ads appeared.

The scan that you sent me of the page from a price guide appears to be from a 1980's issue of the monthly baseball card price guide which (as best as I recall) was entitled CURRENT CARD PRICES. That price guide was edited and published by a fellow here on Long Island (New York), Richie S. At least back then the card prices in that guide were regarded by dealers and collectors (at least locally, if not much more widely) to much more accurately reflect actual market prices at the time than the Beckett monthly baseball card guide.

- Fred/crystalentia(eBay)"
I actually did a lot of the pricing for the first couple years of CCP, guess I was accurate. Richie used to say I wasn't always LOL

Last edited by toppcat; 02-27-2020 at 11:06 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #106  
Old 02-27-2020, 12:19 PM
ALR-bishop ALR-bishop is offline
Al Richter
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: San Antonio
Posts: 6,699
Smile

Quote:
Originally Posted by swarmee View Post
If the MB cards never came in 1968 Topps packs, I'm not sure how anyone can think they are a variation. Only makes sense to me to call them an independent reprint set, along with the football and car cards that came in the board game. A complete set would be all the cards from the board game; just the baseball would be a subset.
I assume it is because everyone has there own notion of what is or should be a variation and they do not always agree, and there is no hobby standard.

I personally agree they are not variations, and am ok with calling them reprints or a parallel set, but I think the hobby has ruled otherwise on Cox and Brinkman, so I keep a second copy of their MB cards in my 68 set as well as in my MB set

I also agree that they are a subset, but SCD and Lemke have listed several Topps baseball subsets independent of the other non baseball subjects in such sets in The Standard Catalog. I have collected just the baseball subjects listed in the Catalog for the 48 Magic Photos, 55 and 56 Hocus Focus, the 54 Topps Scoops and Look and See, the 63 Great American Stamps and Valentine Foldees ( 63 and 66), the 65 Push Pulls and the 68 MBs.

And there is a variation of the MB checklist. There are 2 versions of the 107. Although Carlton Miller, our resident MB expert would disagree with me on that point. He would say the 2nd CL is card 77 in the set ( subset) and not a variation, I think because it is a DP. I tend to think of DP differences, although not necessarily intended but resulting from set up of the sheet layouts, as variations ( for example the 2 different 52 Mantles, Robinsons and Thompsons). I understand not all would agree, and that's ok with me. I am not sure anyone has a monopoly on what constitutes a real variation. Ultimately I guess the hobby as a whole decided over time

Last edited by ALR-bishop; 02-27-2020 at 12:42 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #107  
Old 03-30-2020, 03:51 PM
bswhiten's Avatar
bswhiten bswhiten is offline
Ben W.hitener
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: Charleston, SC
Posts: 372
Default cloud

Picked up the Cecil Cooper - "Cloud" on back
I know they are just defects of defects but I will still try to track down the others
I have only seen the Madlock. If anyone has pics of any of the others I would love to see them. I asked Fred and he didn't save the scans. Thanks!

Would be interesting to know if these specific defects occurred on the typical non blackless cards too.

9 Ron Guidry with Gray “flying saucer”

60a Tony Armas small gray “egg” on back

137a George Cappuzello Purple George

365a Bill Madlock gray cloud on back

385a Ken Forsch Red strip on Cap

564a Doug Decinces gray cloud by ©

664a Dan Spillner Letters underlined

675a Cecil Cooper gray cloud on back
Attached Images
File Type: jpg 2.JPG (53.1 KB, 476 views)
File Type: jpg 3.JPG (54.4 KB, 469 views)

Last edited by bswhiten; 03-30-2020 at 03:52 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #108  
Old 03-30-2020, 03:59 PM
ALR-bishop ALR-bishop is offline
Al Richter
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: San Antonio
Posts: 6,699
Default

I have the 137 variant. My cards are on the move to a new location but will post a scan later. Also have at least 2 other cards not on Fred's list that also have defects not on the "regular" blackless cards in my set

Have never tried to run down if the defects can be found on non blackless cards but suspect they do
Reply With Quote
  #109  
Old 03-30-2020, 05:45 PM
savedfrommyspokes's Avatar
savedfrommyspokes savedfrommyspokes is offline
member
Larry More.y
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 1,556
Default

Wanted to see if my Madlock with and w/o a cloud match what Ben has seen previously....
Attached Images
File Type: jpg 1.jpg (75.1 KB, 469 views)
File Type: jpg 3.jpg (76.3 KB, 469 views)
Reply With Quote
  #110  
Old 03-30-2020, 05:48 PM
Cliff Bowman's Avatar
Cliff Bowman Cliff Bowman is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Near Atlanta
Posts: 1,341
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tripredacus View Post
Yes, they get to decide whether a variation is an actual variation (which means they show up on the regular checklist) or is a parallel. I'm not sure I would consider it to be a parallel set, since not all cards are on the checklist.
I tried and tried to get them to recognize this as a variation, they refused.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg 80-81 jams silas.jpg (79.6 KB, 472 views)
File Type: jpg s-l50080 monroe.jpg (44.1 KB, 466 views)
File Type: jpg s-l160080 phegley66.jpg (43.5 KB, 464 views)
__________________
“interesting to some absolute garbage to others.” —- “Error cards and variations are for morons, IMHO.”
Reply With Quote
  #111  
Old 03-31-2020, 05:45 AM
bswhiten's Avatar
bswhiten bswhiten is offline
Ben W.hitener
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: Charleston, SC
Posts: 372
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ALR-bishop View Post
I have the 137 variant. My cards are on the move to a new location but will post a scan later. Also have at least 2 other cards not on Fred's list that also have defects not on the "regular" blackless cards in my set
Would love to see those too Al. Thanks!

Quote:
Originally Posted by savedfrommyspokes View Post
Wanted to see if my Madlock with and w/o a cloud match what Ben has seen previously....
Larry, yep that is it. You can send it to me for safekeeping if you wish
Reply With Quote
  #112  
Old 03-31-2020, 08:17 AM
Cliff Bowman's Avatar
Cliff Bowman Cliff Bowman is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Near Atlanta
Posts: 1,341
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by bswhiten View Post
I know they are just defects of defects but I will still try to track down the others


137a George Cappuzello Purple George
Unfortunately I couldn't find a scan of the 1982 Topps blackless George Cappuzzello with the print defect that changes the color of his name, but I have seen it before and if it is going to be considered a "variation" then the card below it on the uncut sheet should also be included on the list as it was also affected by the same print flaw, Hector Cruz. ETA, I did run across the Blackless George Cappuzzello purple name on WorthPoint. The 82 Blackless cards of Cappuzzello and Cruz are much more difficult to find without the print flaw than ones with it.
__________________
“interesting to some absolute garbage to others.” —- “Error cards and variations are for morons, IMHO.”

Last edited by Cliff Bowman; 03-31-2020 at 06:11 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #113  
Old 04-02-2020, 12:16 PM
Blackless Collector Blackless Collector is offline
member
 
Join Date: Jan 2020
Posts: 28
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cliff Bowman View Post
Unfortunately I couldn't find a scan of the 1982 Topps blackless George Cappuzzello with the print defect that changes the color of his name, but I have seen it before and if it is going to be considered a "variation" then the card below it on the uncut sheet should also be included on the list as it was also affected by the same print flaw, Hector Cruz. ETA, I did run across the Blackless George Cappuzzello purple name on WorthPoint. The 82 Blackless cards of Cappuzzello and Cruz are much more difficult to find without the print flaw than ones with it.
Hi guys, Here my Two Cappuzzellos:
Attached Images
File Type: jpg 1982 Topps George Cappuzzello Blackless.jpg (27.3 KB, 437 views)
File Type: jpg 1982 Topps George Cappuzzello Blackless (1).jpg (28.2 KB, 433 views)

Last edited by Blackless Collector; 04-02-2020 at 12:19 PM. Reason: Add a letter
Reply With Quote
  #114  
Old 04-02-2020, 12:55 PM
Cliff Bowman's Avatar
Cliff Bowman Cliff Bowman is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Near Atlanta
Posts: 1,341
Default

It looks they’re both the normal version, not the one affected by the print flaw that makes his first name purple. When I looked for a blackless 1982 Hector Cruz a few years ago all I could find were ones that have the large print defect and gave up on trying to find one without it. I imagine all of the Hector Cruz cards without the defect are sitting in collections and are unavailable. The print defect that makes the Cappuzzello name purple is part of the same one that covers the Cruz card. ETA: The Cappuzzello I have scanned is poor quality but it shows the version with the purple GEORGE.
__________________
“interesting to some absolute garbage to others.” —- “Error cards and variations are for morons, IMHO.”

Last edited by Cliff Bowman; 04-02-2020 at 12:58 PM. Reason: Addition
Reply With Quote
  #115  
Old 04-02-2020, 02:43 PM
Blackless Collector Blackless Collector is offline
member
 
Join Date: Jan 2020
Posts: 28
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cliff Bowman View Post
It looks they’re both the normal version, not the one affected by the print flaw that makes his first name purple. When I looked for a blackless 1982 Hector Cruz a few years ago all I could find were ones that have the large print defect and gave up on trying to find one without it. I imagine all of the Hector Cruz cards without the defect are sitting in collections and are unavailable. The print defect that makes the Cappuzzello name purple is part of the same one that covers the Cruz card. ETA: The Cappuzzello I have scanned is poor quality but it shows the version with the purple GEORGE.
The only difference i note in my cards, additional for faint signature andother pure Blackless is one is a little soft image, and other is more color. All blackless cruz card i saw have this print defect, very interesting.
Reply With Quote
  #116  
Old 04-02-2020, 03:28 PM
Cliff Bowman's Avatar
Cliff Bowman Cliff Bowman is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Near Atlanta
Posts: 1,341
Default

I believe there are 82 Hector Cruz blackless cards without the print flaw but I imagine the few that exist are sitting in whale collections.
__________________
“interesting to some absolute garbage to others.” —- “Error cards and variations are for morons, IMHO.”
Reply With Quote
  #117  
Old 04-03-2020, 11:35 AM
Blackless Collector Blackless Collector is offline
member
 
Join Date: Jan 2020
Posts: 28
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cliff Bowman View Post
I believe there are 82 Hector Cruz blackless cards without the print flaw but I imagine the few that exist are sitting in whale collections.
If them exist, is possible less of 5.
Reply With Quote
  #118  
Old 04-05-2020, 05:28 AM
bswhiten's Avatar
bswhiten bswhiten is offline
Ben W.hitener
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: Charleston, SC
Posts: 372
Default

Cliff, thanks for posting the Cappuzzello and adding another one to the list with Cruz. What shall we call that one - orange sprinkles on chin? Curious if that same defect went to the Gossage below Cruz on the sheet.

I only have a couple of the partial blackless like that George. Would be quite a task to track a set of those down too.

I believe this is the 564 Doug Decinces gray cloud by ©

I had no luck finding any other images but i did find an image of a sealed cello Blackless pack. How cool is that! Would love to get my hands on one of those.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg 564 cloud by c.jpg (50.0 KB, 413 views)
File Type: jpg stargell 01.JPG (43.2 KB, 415 views)
File Type: jpg stargell 02.JPG (45.9 KB, 408 views)
Reply With Quote
  #119  
Old 04-06-2020, 11:35 AM
Blackless Collector Blackless Collector is offline
member
 
Join Date: Jan 2020
Posts: 28
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by bswhiten View Post
Cliff, thanks for posting the Cappuzzello and adding another one to the list with Cruz. What shall we call that one - orange sprinkles on chin? Curious if that same defect went to the Gossage below Cruz on the sheet.

I only have a couple of the partial blackless like that George. Would be quite a task to track a set of those down too.

I believe this is the 564 Doug Decinces gray cloud by ©

I had no luck finding any other images but i did find an image of a sealed cello Blackless pack. How cool is that! Would love to get my hands on one of those.
Very interesting Blackless Package ben!
Reply With Quote
  #120  
Old 04-06-2020, 03:04 PM
Cliff Bowman's Avatar
Cliff Bowman Cliff Bowman is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Near Atlanta
Posts: 1,341
Default

I'll probably get reprimanded for outing this auction, but currently on eBay there is an E* sheet 1982 Topps Yankees Future Stars card that has just the faintest remnants of their names and positions in what is supposed to be black ink. It has a complete back. The seller describes it as blackless and I would have to agree with him. Are there any known E* or F* sheet 1982 Topps blackless cards and are they accepted as such? ETA: The seller doesn't refer to it as blackless, only as a print error.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg 82 blackless yankees a.jpg (77.0 KB, 399 views)
File Type: jpg 82 blackless b.jpg (79.8 KB, 402 views)
__________________
“interesting to some absolute garbage to others.” —- “Error cards and variations are for morons, IMHO.”

Last edited by Cliff Bowman; 04-06-2020 at 03:09 PM. Reason: Forgot back scan
Reply With Quote
  #121  
Old 04-06-2020, 09:11 PM
bswhiten's Avatar
bswhiten bswhiten is offline
Ben W.hitener
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: Charleston, SC
Posts: 372
Default

Cliff, I saw that one too. Similar to the F sheet Ripken I posted on page 2 of this thread. I would call it by Fred’s term - Blacklessing. Minimal black names but not completely blackless. I’m not tracking the blacklessing but I’d be kidding myself if I said I didn’t at least want the Ripken.
Reply With Quote
  #122  
Old 04-06-2020, 09:13 PM
bswhiten's Avatar
bswhiten bswhiten is offline
Ben W.hitener
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: Charleston, SC
Posts: 372
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Blackless Collector View Post
Very interesting Blackless Package ben!
Can you imagine finding one of those full cellos Christian? Wow!
Reply With Quote
  #123  
Old 04-07-2020, 10:57 AM
Blackless Collector Blackless Collector is offline
member
 
Join Date: Jan 2020
Posts: 28
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by bswhiten View Post
Can you imagine finding one of those full cellos Christian? Wow!
Jajaja Ben, amazing a Package of full Blackless, insane.
Reply With Quote
  #124  
Old 04-07-2020, 01:31 PM
Blackless Collector Blackless Collector is offline
member
 
Join Date: Jan 2020
Posts: 28
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by bswhiten View Post
Can you imagine finding one of those full cellos Christian? Wow!
.

Last edited by Blackless Collector; 04-07-2020 at 01:33 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #125  
Old 04-09-2020, 05:00 PM
bswhiten's Avatar
bswhiten bswhiten is offline
Ben W.hitener
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: Charleston, SC
Posts: 372
Default

Scanned the A, B, and C sheets today for reference. This is a thumbnail of the high res images.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg 1.jpg (87.8 KB, 374 views)
Reply With Quote
  #126  
Old 04-18-2020, 07:36 PM
robw robw is offline
member
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Posts: 65
Default

How many cards were in here? Incredible! Think I may have bought a card or two from you. So incredibly hard to find.
Reply With Quote
  #127  
Old 04-18-2020, 07:37 PM
robw robw is offline
member
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Posts: 65
Default Last message was for Ben

Thought I was replying to the post about the box you picked up.
Reply With Quote
  #128  
Old 04-19-2020, 11:54 AM
bswhiten's Avatar
bswhiten bswhiten is offline
Ben W.hitener
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: Charleston, SC
Posts: 372
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by robw View Post
How many cards were in here? Incredible! Think I may have bought a card or two from you. So incredibly hard to find.
Hey Rob, I thought it was an incredible find too The entire set was in the box - 396 cards.

I haven't sold any of those but I probably will end up selling or trading the 25% or so of the set that I have in addition to the full set.

Are you collecting the set, a specific team, or player?

Ben
Reply With Quote
  #129  
Old 04-21-2020, 05:14 AM
robw robw is offline
member
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Posts: 65
Default

Holy smokes. That is insane! Congratulations! That Ripken is so cool! I’ve been buying the All-Star Cards and any HOFers. If ever looking to part with any, please hit me up!
Reply With Quote
  #130  
Old 04-22-2020, 05:54 PM
Blackless Collector Blackless Collector is offline
member
 
Join Date: Jan 2020
Posts: 28
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by bswhiten View Post
Hey Rob, I thought it was an incredible find too The entire set was in the box - 396 cards.

I haven't sold any of those but I probably will end up selling or trading the 25% or so of the set that I have in addition to the full set.

Are you collecting the set, a specific team, or player?

Ben
This was a Good luck, find the whole set, is posible only 10 sets in existence.
Reply With Quote
  #131  
Old 05-10-2020, 04:06 PM
bswhiten's Avatar
bswhiten bswhiten is offline
Ben W.hitener
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: Charleston, SC
Posts: 372
Default

Christian, let’s see that Mint blackless Morris. Very Nice score!!!
Reply With Quote
  #132  
Old 05-11-2020, 10:58 AM
Blackless Collector Blackless Collector is offline
member
 
Join Date: Jan 2020
Posts: 28
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by bswhiten View Post
Christian, let’s see that Mint blackless Morris. Very Nice score!!!
Hi Ben, thanks to this post i note you saw my last add to my Blackless set. Was a big surprise for me receive the grades by email and note my Jack Morris is a 1/1 PSA 9, same my Reggie Jackson and Vida blue plus 1/1 Bill Buckner PSA 8(love this card)
1982 Topps Jack Morris Blackless
Attached Images
File Type: jpg 1982 Topps Jack Morris Blackless.jpg (30.0 KB, 257 views)

Last edited by Blackless Collector; 05-12-2020 at 11:51 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #133  
Old 05-11-2020, 05:41 PM
bswhiten's Avatar
bswhiten bswhiten is offline
Ben W.hitener
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: Charleston, SC
Posts: 372
Default

Very nice Christian!!! Your set is moving along fast! Some awesome quality additions.

Last edited by bswhiten; 05-11-2020 at 05:43 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #134  
Old 05-12-2020, 05:34 PM
jimtb jimtb is offline
member
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Posts: 11
Default

That Morris, oh my!!
Reply With Quote
  #135  
Old 06-07-2020, 05:32 PM
bswhiten's Avatar
bswhiten bswhiten is offline
Ben W.hitener
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: Charleston, SC
Posts: 372
Default

https://www.ebay.com/itm/203007917667

Another mislabel... $7 dollar base card at best.
Hope it doesn’t end too high for the buyers sake...

Edit: ended at $122...
Attached Images
File Type: jpg C15B6B9C-F8EC-4AA2-8143-614EB9731D31.jpg (12.2 KB, 205 views)

Last edited by bswhiten; 06-08-2020 at 04:31 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #136  
Old 06-09-2020, 11:09 AM
Blackless Collector Blackless Collector is offline
member
 
Join Date: Jan 2020
Posts: 28
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by bswhiten View Post
https://www.ebay.com/itm/203007917667

Another mislabel... $7 dollar base card at best.
Hope it doesn’t end too high for the buyers sake...

Edit: ended at $122...
Hi Ben,

I note The card and note is a mislabel card. I wrote to The seller one hour before the auction ended. He responde my Message:
I appreciate your feedback. I had several really great ebayer's that provided me with similar information. Much thanks to them and to you. I had no idea and just described the card as PSA labeled. I really hated that I caused any confusion in that listing even if unknowingly. It is not worth the frustration or the money to misrepresent something and never would knowingly. I updated the description once I was made aware, worked with a bidder to cancel a bid and will obviously let the winning bidder know the card was mislabeled by PSA. Thanks, take care and be safe. He's a nice guy, but he had the confussion because dont know about blackless variation.

Last edited by Blackless Collector; 06-09-2020 at 11:13 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #137  
Old 06-09-2020, 07:32 PM
bswhiten's Avatar
bswhiten bswhiten is offline
Ben W.hitener
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: Charleston, SC
Posts: 372
Default

Yea PSA labeled a lot of the in action and all stars as Blackless when they first started slabbing them as variations. Some of the highest graded cards are mislabeled. Hope the buyer figured out what he was getting.
Reply With Quote
  #138  
Old 06-10-2020, 08:26 PM
philliesphan's Avatar
philliesphan philliesphan is offline
Marc S.
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 571
Default

One of the top two bidders on that Schmidt blackless is a big Schmidt registry person.

I often find myself having a lack of sympathy for collectors who don't do even the slightest amount of due diligence in researching an issue. How can two people both bid over $100- for a card that is clearly not even the variation? Hell, a five minute Google search can tell you more about what you should be expecting for this variation. <rolls eyes condescendingly>
Reply With Quote
  #139  
Old 06-10-2020, 08:31 PM
Cliff Bowman's Avatar
Cliff Bowman Cliff Bowman is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Near Atlanta
Posts: 1,341
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by philliesphan View Post
One of the top two bidders on that Schmidt blackless is a big Schmidt registry person.

I often find myself having a lack of sympathy for collectors who don't do even the slightest amount of due diligence in researching an issue. How can two people both bid over $100- for a card that is clearly not even the variation? Hell, a five minute Google search can tell you more about what you should be expecting for this variation. <rolls eyes condescendingly>
More than likely he knew that it isn't an authentic blackless and just wanted it for his PSA Registry Set.
__________________
“interesting to some absolute garbage to others.” —- “Error cards and variations are for morons, IMHO.”
Reply With Quote
  #140  
Old 06-13-2020, 08:41 AM
bswhiten's Avatar
bswhiten bswhiten is offline
Ben W.hitener
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: Charleston, SC
Posts: 372
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cliff Bowman View Post
More than likely he knew that it isn't an authentic blackless and just wanted it for his PSA Registry Set.
That is so foreign to me. I’m sure that happens a lot, but why would you want a card for your registry set if it wasn’t the actual card....To each their own I guess.

For the Blackless set the one that is part of the registry set but should not be and will probably always remain a mislabel. Fisk IA 111.
Would love to be proven wrong, but I’ve only seen faded ones.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg 170195B6-F551-45EC-9614-062D18D703A8.jpg (19.4 KB, 165 views)
File Type: jpg D566B982-E864-4E81-A780-63598F67548D.jpg (19.8 KB, 166 views)
Reply With Quote
  #141  
Old 07-15-2020, 08:18 AM
Blackless Collector Blackless Collector is offline
member
 
Join Date: Jan 2020
Posts: 28
Default

Another mislabel, 1982 Topps Pete Rose in Action- Blackless. The PSA Blackless pop report is unreal, lot of mislabels https://www.ebay.com/itm/333655341424
Reply With Quote
  #142  
Old 07-15-2020, 08:49 AM
bswhiten's Avatar
bswhiten bswhiten is offline
Ben W.hitener
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: Charleston, SC
Posts: 372
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Blackless Collector View Post
Another mislabel, 1982 Topps Pete Rose in Action- Blackless. The PSA Blackless pop report is unreal, lot of mislabels https://www.ebay.com/itm/333655341424
Yea they seem to have screwed up a lot of the "In Action" examples. I don't think i have seen any with the newer lighthouse label so maybe they recognize the difference now? There is a Goosage In Action on eBay that is a "Blueless" example that was graded as a Blackless.
Reply With Quote
  #143  
Old 07-16-2020, 04:54 AM
Blackless Collector Blackless Collector is offline
member
 
Join Date: Jan 2020
Posts: 28
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by bswhiten View Post
Yea they seem to have screwed up a lot of the "In Action" examples. I don't think i have seen any with the newer lighthouse label so maybe they recognize the difference now? There is a Goosage In Action on eBay that is a "Blueless" example that was graded as a Blackless.
In action and all stars have a pair of mislabels.
Reply With Quote
  #144  
Old 07-16-2020, 09:26 AM
bswhiten's Avatar
bswhiten bswhiten is offline
Ben W.hitener
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: Charleston, SC
Posts: 372
Default

I have had the 2010 Topps "Cards Your Mom Threw Out" Carlton for a while and pulled the Turner out of a Topps Archives retail box from Target a few years ago.

Anyone aware of other years/products where Topps has printed cards similar to the 82 Blackless?

Someone said Gypsy Queen had something, but I don't think I have seen those.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg IMG_E4802.jpg (73.9 KB, 122 views)
File Type: jpg IMG_E4803.jpg (77.6 KB, 120 views)
Reply With Quote
  #145  
Old 07-28-2020, 01:11 PM
hockeyhockey hockeyhockey is offline
member
 
Join Date: Jul 2020
Posts: 100
Default

forgive me for my lack of knowledge on this, but were these found in boxes/packs or sealed sets? assume best way to get them is to buy them from current owners, but was curious about the possible alternate routes. thank you.

Last edited by hockeyhockey; 07-28-2020 at 01:11 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #146  
Old 07-28-2020, 03:50 PM
ALR-bishop ALR-bishop is offline
Al Richter
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: San Antonio
Posts: 6,699
Default

They did show up in packs. I bought many of my B and C cards from sellers in Michigan who got them from packs. Many of my A cards came from sellers in NY who also got them from packs
Reply With Quote
  #147  
Old 07-29-2020, 04:25 PM
hockeyhockey hockeyhockey is offline
member
 
Join Date: Jul 2020
Posts: 100
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ALR-bishop View Post
They did show up in packs. I bought many of my B and C cards from sellers in Michigan who got them from packs. Many of my A cards came from sellers in NY who also got them from packs
michigan always comes up with the quality errors

i just picked up a blackless card for about 10 bucks. look forward to checking it out up close.
Reply With Quote
  #148  
Old 07-30-2020, 01:00 PM
Blackless Collector Blackless Collector is offline
member
 
Join Date: Jan 2020
Posts: 28
Default

Blackless cards apparently was found in cello packs. The B and C sheet Cards are the most scarcest. This Brett is from C Sheet and is Impossible to find, very desired for George Brett Collectors.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg 1982 Topps George Brett A's Blackless_0001.jpg (31.6 KB, 70 views)

Last edited by Blackless Collector; 07-30-2020 at 01:02 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #149  
Old 07-31-2020, 07:03 AM
ALR-bishop ALR-bishop is offline
Al Richter
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: San Antonio
Posts: 6,699
Default

I have been contacted on occasion asking if I would sell certain cards from my set, Brett more than once.

It was my experience B and C cards were harder to find in building my set.

Last edited by ALR-bishop; 07-31-2020 at 07:05 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #150  
Old 07-31-2020, 10:58 AM
Blackless Collector Blackless Collector is offline
member
 
Join Date: Jan 2020
Posts: 28
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ALR-bishop View Post
I have been contacted on occasion asking if I would sell certain cards from my set, Brett more than once.

It was my experience B and C cards were harder to find in building my set.
I only need 1 of the Bretts, #201 IA. IA from others Hofers #101 mike schmidt and #481 carlton. Hofers regular cards #475 Trammel, #610 Henderson, both Stargells and Gossage IA. Dale Murphy is not a Hofer, but the card is very tough. Blackless Cards looks lot better than regular set
Reply With Quote
Reply



Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Slightly OT - 1982 Topps Blackless JasonL Postwar Baseball Cards Forum (Pre-1980) 30 01-25-2011 12:24 PM


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 09:25 AM.


ebay GSB