What is the origin of Frank Thomas NNOF?

[swarmee]

I'd say it's a different error altogether, since all of the black borders are visible on the outer border. So it's really independent of the original issue.

[ALR-bishop]

Agree John. Maybe one of print experts can chime in

[steve B]

I'd have to compare to be more sure of a couple things, but
Short answer
It's a different error from a different black plate

Longer answer
If the obstruction on the original error plate was something like tape, It's possible the tape wasn't completely removed, and a small remnant was still there to obscure the replacement plate.
More likely if all the missing border bits fit inside the NNOF missing black area.
Far less likely if any of the missing bits are outside that area.

So it could be a follow on partial correction, or a totally different issue.

[West]

Originally Posted by steve B

I'd have to compare to be more sure of a couple things, but
Short answer
It's a different error from a different black plate

Longer answer
If the obstruction on the original error plate was something like tape, It's possible the tape wasn't completely removed, and a small remnant was still there to obscure the replacement plate.
More likely if all the missing border bits fit inside the NNOF missing black area.
Far less likely if any of the missing bits are outside that area.

So it could be a follow on partial correction, or a totally different issue.

It is directly related to the NNOF as these were found in the only known case to have NNOF by CU member Rookiewax in 2009. These Thomas partial blackless are from the same print run as the other partial missing black cards (Lawton, Tapani) I have scans of in my post 12 posts back from 8/8/20. I have all the cards from this press run if you guys want scans. Morris and Biggio are also affected.
Additionally, the partially affected Tapani has the same blue plate scratch as the fully affected Tapani from the NNOF press run, just slightly more faded. You can see it in the scan, it is in the exact same location on his face (runs vertically from the “E” in Kevin up through his nose then through the top border).

[ALR-bishop]

If it is a transition misprint how did it occur ?

[swarmee]

Yeah, correlation does not imply causation, as I learned in science. They could be an interim printing stage, but they're much more likely to be a replacement of the printing plates with their own flaws, IMO. Which those were then further corrected.

Add: I recall someone saying that Topps likely had 7 printing presses, with each needing a set of plates. Not sure how true that is, but this could show that one set of plates had one set of errors (regular NNOF and other blackless partial border/background cards), then a different set of plates had these errors you're spotting (two gaps Frank Thomas, Tapani gap).

[West]

Originally Posted by swarmee

Yeah, correlation does not imply causation, as I learned in science. They could be an interim printing stage, but they're much more likely to be a replacement of the printing plates with their own flaws, IMO. Which those were then further corrected.

Add: I recall someone saying that Topps likely had 7 printing presses, with each needing a set of plates. Not sure how true that is, but this could show that one set of plates had one set of errors (regular NNOF and other blackless partial border/background cards), then a different set of plates had these errors you're spotting (two gaps Frank Thomas, Tapani gap).

I think you misunderstood my post. I fully agree with you - these smaller errors were not “caused” by the NNOF. But they are closely related. By that I mean it is 99% certain that these errors were subsequent or simultaneously printed alongside the NNOF at the factory. There is almost no other way they end up next to each other in packs of the same case when you consider the sheer volume of Topps printing back then.

I believe it is possible there were a series of bad plates or negatives in sequence as I posited above in my post on 8/8. Would love to hear other ideas/theories.

[West]

Originally Posted by swarmee

Add: I recall someone saying that Topps likely had 7 printing presses, with each needing a set of plates. Not sure how true that is, but this could show that one set of plates had one set of errors (regular NNOF and other blackless partial border/background cards), then a different set of plates had these errors you're spotting (two gaps Frank Thomas, Tapani gap).

That was me, in this and several other threads about Topps production. That info came from a former pressman at Quebecor who was interviewed by SCD. It was 6 presses. I believe your theory there is correct. The question is was it a bad negative/mask, or an improperly exposed or damaged plate? We may never know, but I always thought the affected cards with minor gaps/border breaks might hold some evidence of causation.